M271 Timing chain/other alarming issues

[MunroC180]

How we going guys, i'm a newbie here and was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction regarding timing chain issues. Let me set the scene.

My car is a C180K 05 with roughly 69000miles on the clock. Upon hearing suspicious noises that sounded like the timing chain upon startup and weirdly when going around roundabouts or long corners, i took the car to my local garage, it was very difficult to recreate the sound, because once the car had started it would run fine until you drove it. Usually you would have to accelerate and come to an abrupt stop for it to make the noise. When he heard the noise he confirmed it sounds like the timing chain and should be replaced as well as cam adjusters and the lot! Not much change from £1000 he said.

Turns out he never actually diagnosed it he just based this on the sounds it was making, i refused the offer, took the car home and diagnosed it myself, it turns out the adjusters look in pretty good shape, unless anyone disagrees? the timing chain does seem to have a little slack in it, but more alarming was the absolute mess of the valve cover and cams etc. The car as FSH and for what it's worth i'm changing the oil tomorrow. Does anyone have any recommendations on this mess? I tried to clean some of it, but fearing I was causing more damage than good by getting debris in to delicate parts I stopped and put it all back together, thinking of getting the chain sorted then selling it or am I just being paranoid?

 

[pembssurf]

Jesus Christ how did that mess happen. Looks like filter failure or wrong oil. Not sure what else explains that mess

 

[MunroC180]

It really is that bad huh? I fear that despite having service history, the oil changes have not been done properly, i.e. filter hasn't been replaced or wrong oil or the garage that it's been to simply hasn't even carried out the oil change. And also the lack of this maintenance has maybe caused the chain to wear prematurely? I only bought the car about 4 months ago and should have checked. A simple look under the oil filler cap would have changed my mind about buying this car. Shame that it's previous owners neglected it so much.

 

[martyz]

I think someone has added something to the oil to mask an engine noise,or
something has disintegrated.

 

[MunroC180]

That would make sense martyz since that may have been the noise of the timing chain. I'm chainging the oil tomorrow so I'll get an idea of how bad it really is. Is there anyway of nursing this engine back into good health even with frequent oil changes or is it a lost cause?

 

[grober]

Causes of oil sludge formation are usually connected with the presence of water for some reason. This can be due to a defective crankcase ventilation system, low engine operating temperatures due a faulty thermostat or the presence of water in the oil due to a blown gasket or cracked head. There are two or more? cheap small bore pipes below the inlet manifold which tend to leak/ collapse/block and coupled to a poor oil change history can contribute to this problem on the M271

 

[MunroC180]

Grober funnily enough when you say low operating temps, I didn't think anything of it, but when cruising at motorway speed or even through town (but not much stop start traffic) the engine temp will never reach it's optimum 80 or 90 degrees, (not sure exactly what it's meant to be) could this be a faulty thermostat, would it throw out a fault code?

 

[grober]

Faulty stat would give you the symptoms you describe. Don't think it would give you a fault code just on its own--- it might precipitate other faults which would eventually of course.

 

[MunroC180]

Well I found what I believe to be the source of the timing chain noise coming from around the cam adjusters. The plastic guide which is meant to exist between the two adjusters does not seem to exist, therefore the chain is making contact with metal and combined with a little slack is causing it to make that grinding sound. The pics show my cams with the missing guide and someone else's

 

[grumpyoldgit]

Causes of oil sludge formation are usually connected with the presence of water for some reason. This can be due to a defective crankcase ventilation system, low engine operating temperatures due a faulty thermostat or the presence of water in the oil due to a blown gasket or cracked head. There are two or more? cheap small bore pipes below the inlet manifold which tend to leak/ collapse/block and coupled to a poor oil change history can contribute to this problem on the M271

[YOUTUBE]watch?v=4C9XqMwyWBg[/YOUTUBE]

In the second picture of 'someone else's' the right hand cam gear appears very badly worn. Note the difference in the depth of the teeth, compared the the left hand one.



.

 

[MunroC180]

Yes I noticed that, where as mine appear to look in pretty good shape? yet the garage I took it to said I should replace the lot and that the cam gears alone would cost me £800. Crazy how as well as timing chain problems, those $5 pipes are causing all sorts of oil related problems as well!

 

[grumpyoldgit]

There is a post on here of one member carrying out all this work himself, with great documented procedures along with pictures. He found a company who manufactured replacement cam gears at a much cheaper price, plus they were better quality. If I recall correctly.

I'll try to find it when I have a few minutes.

 

[Hawkwind]

I don't know much about these things, but to me it looks as though if you had the missing plastic chain guide, the tension of your cam chain would be much better