Mercedes now has an engine with a Cam Belt...urgh!

[Dieselman]

Errrrrr the 1.9 dci engine fitted to the laguna fails as often as I have hot dinners, even the die hard Renault fans over on the Renault forums will advise you to stay away from them. Google 1.9 dci turbo problems for 3 billion threads on why you shouldn't invest your hard earned on a dci engine.

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Cobblers. The engines are tough, the original Garrett turbo's weren't up to the job, but then uprated bearings were fitted and available.

 

[Crespo]

Cobblers. The engines are tough, the original Garrett turbo's weren't up to the job, but then uprated bearings were fitted and available.

I am sure you know a fair bit about diesels judging by your username but having owned a laguna 1.9 dci and being a member of the Renault forum a can assure you they are s**t.
EGR valves go frequently, the 16k service intervals are hugely optimistic, turbos going and the engine running away with itself where it runs on its own oil until it explodes, etc etc etc.
There is a very good reason you can pick up a low mileage dci laguna for not much more than a packet of fags.
Would i recommend one to a friend.? would I f**k.

But to be fair I wouldn't recommend any modern diesel to a friend and would advise them to buy a petrol instead.

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[Vlad]

Don't confuse the 1.5DCi with the older 1.9 and 2.2DCi engines.......the 1.5 is fine, whereas the old 2.2 was seriously one of the worst engines I've had the misfortune of running. Saying that the Laguna it was fitted to was without doubt the worst ever car I have had the misfortune of running.....luckily it was a company car.

Truly dreadful in every aspect......ECU failures x2, Injectors, Cylinder Head, Turbo x2, EGR and various electrical problems....nightmare.

 

[markjay]

I know of a few W124 that have snapped chains under 200k miles.

Before they snap, all cam chains stretch, which causes the valve and possibly injection timing to retard, in addition they wear the sprockets too, so more aggro when the change does come.

In the olden days stretched chains became noisy over time so you knew you had a problem well before the chain actually snapped. Not sure if it's still the case with modern engines.

There no warning with cam belts though... had one snapped some years ago on an Escort, 1.8 diesel, killed the engine... badly maintained company car.

 

[NOMONEYBUTAMERC]

Had plenty of old cars with rattly timing chains , none snapped, but at least you knew they were worn and needed replacing. Duplex chains are more expensive to produce than belts , but timing belt kits are one of the biggest selling aftermarket spares as people are well aware of the potential cost of belt failure.

 

[Dieselman]

Modern chains don't rattle as the tensioner keeps it tight until it snaps.

The Ford Endura 1.8 was well known for snapping belts due to the loading of the cam and injection pump....and fitting a low spec belt.

 

[Dieselman]

I am sure you know a fair bit about diesels judging by your username but having owned a laguna 1.9 dci and being a member of the Renault forum a can assure you they are s**t.
EGR valves go frequently, the 16k service intervals are hugely optimistic, turbos going and the engine running away with itself where it runs on its own oil until it explodes, etc etc etc.

I've already covered the turbo issue, so now the EGR getting troublesome (as they all do) now makes the whole engine rubbish.

Get real.

 

[Crespo]

I've already covered the turbo issue, so now the EGR getting troublesome (as they all do) now makes the whole engine rubbish.

Get real.

Can't see how upgrading the bearings on the turbo is going to stop failures when it is directly linked to the EGR valve.


Last time I checked a diesel without a turbo was pretty rubbish yes.

It was rushed in to production just like early TDCIs which went through delphi injectors at an alarming rate until they were revised.
I am well aware that EGRs are more hassle than they are worth and the same goes for DPFs and DMFs but the fact of the matter is some engines are more reliable than others and the 1.9 dci is ****.

On 1.9DCIs EGR valve should open to allow carbon dioxide, which acts as a cooling gas) into the combustion chambers when the engine is under load (>30% boost). This allows the combustion chamber temperature to drop and thus the temperature of the exhaust gases. If it sticks in the closed position the exhaust gas temperature will rise causing a) the turbo bearings to fail and b) engine oil into the induction system. This will cause the engine to go on running until it has consumed all its oil and then it will go bang. Problems with EGR valves in Renault dCi engines are often the cause of rough running when the valve is stuck in the open position as well. In several cases turbos have blown but the EGR valve has not been replaced. Inevitably the new turbo unit will not last long. At Spring 2004 revise, only Euro IV engine was the dCi 90.

When Renault increased the power of the 1.9 diesel engine from 120 to 130 bhp they put a particle filter in the exhaust system to clean up the emissions. Thisn meant the service intervals cam down from 18,000 to 9,000 miles. Special oil has to be used, which costs £50 for 5 litres. But if the car isn't used on regular long journeys or you don't take the car for a long run at high speed when the 'Particle Filter' warning light comes on, the car locks down to 3,000 rpm. This means that you have to take the car to a Renault dealer to have a £300 procedure carried out to clear the filter. If this doesn't work a new filter costs £1,000, plus fitting.

So an unreliable engine is a good one then. Ok

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[Crespo]

Modern chains don't rattle as the tensioner keeps it tight until it snaps.

The Ford Endura 1.8 was well known for snapping belts due to the loading of the cam and injection pump....and fitting a low spec belt.

I beg to differ Honda 2.2 ICDTI engines which happens to be a modern engine has an extended warranty covering rattling timing chains because they rattle before they snap.

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[Riverside Red]

My Honda S2000 also had a timing chain which when old enough would rattle if the chain tensioner was worn, thought it was a pretty common affliction for cam chains. Always better than a belt, no expensive belt changes every 50k miles!

 

[Dieselman]

Can't see how upgrading the bearings on the turbo is going to stop failures when it is directly linked to the EGR valve.


Last time I checked a diesel without a turbo was pretty rubbish yes.

It was rushed in to production just like early TDCIs which went through delphi injectors at an alarming rate until they were revised.
I am well aware that EGRs are more hassle than they are worth and the same goes for DPFs and DMFs but the fact of the matter is some engines are more reliable than others and the 1.9 dci is ****.

On 1.9DCIs EGR valve should open to allow carbon dioxide, which acts as a cooling gas) into the combustion chambers when the engine is under load (>30% boost). This allows the combustion chamber temperature to drop and thus the temperature of the exhaust gases. If it sticks in the closed position the exhaust gas temperature will rise causing a) the turbo bearings to fail and b) engine oil into the induction system. This will cause the engine to go on running until it has consumed all its oil and then it will go bang. Problems with EGR valves in Renault dCi engines are often the cause of rough running when the valve is stuck in the open position as well. In several cases turbos have blown but the EGR valve has not been replaced. Inevitably the new turbo unit will not last long. At Spring 2004 revise, only Euro IV engine was the dCi 90.

When Renault increased the power of the 1.9 diesel engine from 120 to 130 bhp they put a particle filter in the exhaust system to clean up the emissions. Thisn meant the service intervals cam down from 18,000 to 9,000 miles. Special oil has to be used, which costs £50 for 5 litres. But if the car isn't used on regular long journeys or you don't take the car for a long run at high speed when the 'Particle Filter' warning light comes on, the car locks down to 3,000 rpm. This means that you have to take the car to a Renault dealer to have a £300 procedure carried out to clear the filter. If this doesn't work a new filter costs £1,000, plus fitting.

The issue was the turbo bearings, Garrett upgraded them to stop the failures.

A closed EGR valve won't cause high combustion temperatures as when the engine is under load the valve is closed anyway.
At idle or low load the EGT will be in the region of 150c to 250C, under full load it will be ~800c.
Just how is the lack of EGR at partial load going to affect cause high bearing temperatures.

What do you think happened before there was EGR?

You appear to have picked up on some internet myth and actually believed it. Was it posted on April 1st?

I could expand if you want, but think it would be a bit deep for you to understand.

It is true that specifying semi-synthetic oil and 18,000 mile changes was a recipe for future problems.

I'm not sure what relevance your comment about the particulate trap is, many cars have them fitted and I think you will find the Mercedes ones cause more trouble than other brands.

 

[Dieselman]

I beg to differ Honda 2.2 ICDTI engines which happens to be a modern engine has an extended warranty covering rattling timing chains because they rattle before they snap.

And that has what to do with Mercedes chains, that don't rattle before they snap or wear out the drive sprockets?

 

[Crespo]

And that has what to do with Mercedes chains, that don't rattle before they snap or wear out the drive sprockets?

I was replying to your comment where you said modern engines fitted with a timing chain don't rattle. Nothing to do with Mercedes

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[Bellow]

The A-Class will have (in Diesel form) the same engine as the Dacia Sandero, priced at £8395.

 

[Dieselman]

The A-Class will have (in Diesel form) the same engine as the Dacia Sandero, priced at £8395.

That makes you realise just how much those bonnet stars really cost.

Mercedes must be subsidising them for over counter sales, to the tune of thousands each one.

 

[st4]

That makes you realise just how much those bonnet stars really cost.

Mercedes must be subsidising them for over counter sales, to the tune of thousands each one.

Expect a new breed of hire car pilot soon

 

[Dryce]

The A-Class will have (in Diesel form) the same engine as the Dacia Sandero, priced at £8395.

I think you're supposed to prefix statements about Dacia with:

Good News!
​

 

[Bellow]

I think you're supposed to prefix statements about Dacia with:

Good News!
​

I May...