More than just a key

[recycled]

Yes. I was chatting with a shoplifter the other day - an activity that, in his opinion, was not a crime; he was moaning about store detectives.

And, funnily enough I heard a murderer interviewed on the radio last week - an activity that, in his opinion, was not a crime; he had an issue with the use of DNA - it was better, he said, in the good old days when they just had fingerprints and cigerette ash to try to build a conviction upon.

Overall, I guess, most people who break the law believe that that specific law which thay are breaking should not be considered a crime and technology should not be used to enforce it

Hmm interesting. a shoplifter ends up with a criminal record, so does a murderer.

Still waiting to see if you end up with one in a box junction.
now if police records this great crime in the record books, do you think crime would be down. i think it would have skyrocketed by now.
Now who was that criminal forum member whose rear axle was hanging over that box junction?
was that gucci?

and when it becomes law not to drive your car during the week, i guess you will be obeying that too.

 

[recycled]

I drive through a green traffic light and matey drives through what he alleges is a green traffic light and T-bones me. This is a 'box junction'

I am extremely grateful that the junction is covered by CCTV. Matey is extremely angry about Big Brother invading his human rights etc etc

Guess who went through the red light at thuis box junction?

and Guess who had one of Graham's keys?

Regards

I reported matey for making too much noise in his house, so CCTV is pointed into his bedroom. Hmm saw nice pics of his wife which was on you tube the next morning.
Who was complaining about invading privacy?
Guess who had grahams keys? and guess who was angry about CCTV

 

[recycled]

Yes. I was chatting with a shoplifter the other day - an activity that, in his opinion, was not a crime; he was moaning about store detectives.

On the topic of shoplifting, how many times do you have to do this to actually get any punishment?
All the police programs i watch all end up with no punishment.and one was on BBC north west with 42 convictions(or thereabouts, not sure.-- definitely more than 30) and still no jail sentences or punishment.
various warnings,curfews,banning orders e.t.c.

Now if i park 20 times on yellow lines do you think i would have a car by now?

 

[crockers]

On the topic of shoplifting, how many times do you have to do this to actually get any punishment?
All the police programs i watch all end up with no punishment.and one was on BBC north west with 42 convictions(or thereabouts, not sure.-- definitely more than 30) and still no jail sentences or punishment.
various warnings,curfews,banning orders e.t.c.

Now if i park 20 times on yellow lines do you think i would have a car by now?

Depends if it's your car or one you "borrowed" like the shoplifters...

 

[glojo]

I reported matey for making too much noise in his house, so CCTV is pointed into his bedroom. Hmm saw nice pics of his wife which was on you tube the next morning.
Who was complaining about invading privacy?
Guess who had grahams keys? and guess who was angry about CCTV

If someone stole my chipped car key then I could prove it was mine. As stated many, many, many times and documented many, many times. When people abuse the trust placed in them to operate these CCTV cameras they are extremely strong punitive measures. Idiots will always break laws and the folks that go peeping tomming and abuse that trust have the full force of the law invoked. EVEN MORE THAN US POOR CAR DRIVERS.

Modern technology is an asset in making our streets safer, we all want it unless it causes us inconvenience then watch out. The car key Graham mentioned is an excellent example and so far every objection has been a 'What if' or a 'Supposing this will happen' but no one, no one has put forward any authorised abuse of this or a fishing trip to take advantage.

The spying on parents to get their children into a different school, the spying on dustbins, the spying on dog fouling were all media manipulation of cases which the public themselves had demanded be investigated.

Parents object when devious means are used to get children into a school, neighbours go ballistic when someone deposits their refuse in the street, the public object when dog foul our footpaths. Using modern technology to catch culprits is a simple way of getting a getting to the truth, especially when it is one persons word against another. Certified CCTV footage does not lie, it merely depicts an event in time.

To me it clears the innocent. If we are accused of stopping in a box junction and we deny it. The CCTV footage will prove we are innocent. The nonsense about car keys being used to convict us of speeding is just that.... Nonsense.

We have a number of truck drivers on this forum and I would ask how many times have you had a knock on your house front door and been asked by the police to hand over a tachograph record and then been reported for speeding merely on the evidence of the card. No street name. no town, just a tachograph that is showing a speed above 30mph! It is nonsense.

Yes tachograph evidence has been used countless times to corroborate an event, but has it been used by the police as the sole evidence?? No street, no town, no accusation of any offence?

It is all 'What if'

John

 

[recycled]

What if this forum does not really exist?

 

[Benzowner]

What if this forum does not really exist?

Then the tree that falls in the forest where no one is, still makes a sound

 

[st4]

I drive through a green traffic light and matey drives through what he alleges is a green traffic light and T-bones me. This is a 'box junction'

I am extremely grateful that the junction is covered by CCTV. Matey is extremely angry about Big Brother invading his human rights etc etc

Guess who went through the red light at thuis box junction?

So a camera can maybe prove who was right or wrong, but it wouldn't prevent this situation from arising would it?

Forward antincipation and planning from the offender and victim might There are so many other things that can be done to improve road safety than a set of camera's and keys that record data. Starting with the skills of the people who operate them. IAM training for all I say

 

[glojo]

So a camera can maybe prove who was right or wrong, but it wouldn't prevent this situation from arising would it?

Forward antincipation and planning from the offender and victim might There are so many other things that can be done to improve road safety than a set of camera's and keys that record data. Starting with the skills of the people who operate them. IAM training for all I say

We are where we are and if people did not commit crime then wouldn't it be a nice world?

We go through agreen light I drive into the side of you and accuse you of doing the exact self same thing. There are NO witnesses, our cars are wrote off, but the incident was recorded on CCTV. You are positive you are in the right. Would you use the CCTV footage?

YES or NO?

The camera will only record an event in time. A court will decide the guilt or innocence.

John

 

[st4]

We are where we are and if people did not commit crime then wouldn't it be a nice world?

We go through agreen light I drive into the side of you and accuse you of doing the exact self same thing. There are NO witnesses, our cars are wrote off, but the incident was recorded on CCTV. You are positive you are in the right. Would you use the CCTV footage?

YES or NO?

The camera will only record an event in time. A court will decide the guilt or innocence.

John

I'd be deluding myself if I said no, but at the sametime we can't just spy on the nation because a few spoil it for the lot of us. We deter the few by harsher sentancing etc and deal with the problem at source rather than the method you said.

I'll put it another way, if I were kicking your door in, what would you rather, a camera spotted me and I carried on regardless, or unmarked stopped me - Or any other member of the public who beleived in what was right and wrong? it is so bad that when someone is attacked, people won't intervene to help as they are too afraid they'll get hurt or that they'll be up for assult for defending the victim of attack.

What has changed in society over the last50 years, of which you'll know there has been plently, lets go back to the way things once were.

 

[recycled]

The only people who fear the cameras to be honest are the law abiding ones that try to do right, but sometimes are caught up in the wrong without knowing it.
The real criminals are not bothered about CCTV as they just laugh at it anyway and get on with their crime.
Where has CCTV ever been proved to have actually reduced crime?

it is not the caught on camera that stops crook. it is what you do after catching them that stops them.

and in the early 20th century of which i know nothing about, there was no CCTV at all but were there gang of youths running around with alchohol and drugs behaving like yobs?

 

[glojo]

What has changed in society over the last50 years, of which you'll know there has been plently, lets go back to the way things once were.

human rights has a lot to answer for. We knew right from wrong and corporal punishment was used to teach respect and discipline. Please do not put words into my mouth and suggest I am advocating anything. I am merely saying that 50 years ago if a young boy failed to open a door for a lady, or failed to use the words please or thank you. They would very quickly get a clip around the ear. Now we have everyone asking 'Why should I?' or 'You can't make me!'

 

[st4]

human rights has a lot to answer for. We knew right from wrong and corporal punishment was used to teach respect and discipline. Please do not put words into my mouth and suggest I am advocating anything. I am merely saying that 50 years ago if a young boy failed to open a door for a lady, or failed to use the words please or thank you. They would very quickly get a clip around the ear. Now we have everyone asking 'Why should I?' or 'You can't make me!'

On that you and I agree, despite me probably being a generation or so behind you. You still didn't answer my hypothetical question, but I reckon I know what you'd have opted for now.

 

[crockers]

human rights has a lot to answer for. We knew right from wrong and corporal punishment was used to teach respect and discipline. Please do not put words into my mouth and suggest I am advocating anything. I am merely saying that 50 years ago if a young boy failed to open a door for a lady, or failed to use the words please or thank you. They would very quickly get a clip around the ear. Now we have everyone asking 'Why should I?' or 'You can't make me!'

Yes -- beat them into submission.....

 

[glojo]

On that you and I agree, despite me probably being a generation or so behind you. You still didn't answer my hypothetical question, but I reckon I know what you'd have opted for now.

Apologies but my thoughts are we have to play the hands we arer dealt. We live in the society we are at.

The reality is also that CCTV has made the streets safer, it has not made them SAFE.

As I stated earlier, it is the public that are demanding more of these things not the police, not big brother, but joe public! Go to any parish council meeting, go to any council meeting and you will be deafened by the silence of those requesting the removal of these devices. Attend any meeting that wants to reduce vandalism and apart from the proverbial 'More police on the streets' the next request will usually be for more CCTV cameras.

John

 

[st4]

Apologies but my thoughts are we have to play the hands we arer dealt. We live in the society we are at.

The reality is also that CCTV has made the streets safer, it has not made them SAFE.

As I stated earlier, it is the public that are demanding more of these things not the police, not big brother, but joe public! Go to any parish council meeting, go to any council meeting and you will be deafened by the silence of those requesting the removal of these devices. Attend any meeting that wants to reduce vandalism and apart from the proverbial 'More police on the streets' the next request will usually be for more CCTV cameras.

John

I have heard a statistic that they've reduced crime by 3%. How on earth is that measureable? I just don't think they're any good, its just so easy to disguise yourself. We're apparently one of the most surveillenced countries in the EU I heard, but what good will it do.

More police officers, harsher sentacing that acts as a real deterent, and as you said less of the human rights cr4p so one can defend oneself against the scoundrels that vandalise, steal and attack. Given the chance thats how I'd play the deck of cards that have been dealt, a camera lens with no substance behind it just isn't a solution.

 

[glojo]

Going back to the topic and taking it a stage further.

Big Brother tribe are you all reading this??

I would luv it, luv it if with the latest technology this new key could detect our blood alcohol content!!! How's that for a radical suggestion? The technology might not be present yet to detect blood\alocohl from our skin as we hold the key, but it cannot be far away. The key could also be programmed with our finger print Wrong finger print... no go. The key could contain the prints of all named drivers and this could be linked with the insurance database

I could go further with these suggestions but I fear *** and recycled might die of heart attacks

Over to the 'anti brigade'

Have a nice day
Regards
John

 

[st4]

I could go further with these suggestions but I fear *** and recycled might die of heart attacks

Over to the 'anti brigade'

Have a nice day
Regards
John

John, your right, my breakfast nearly came up and I did nearly have a coronary episode but I've calmed down now

What ever happened to taking responsibility and control of your own actions. Gadgets that nanny us take away a part of humanity and control over ones day to day lives. I know you'll respond re ESP etc but thats different to your suggestion entirely as this monitors the person itself, not the car.

Take lexus eye detection thingee on the LS, it can tell if your nodding off. Erm people own and control a car, not the other way around. Its nice to be nannied etc by gadgets I'm sure, but if you can't even take responsibility for controlling your actions before you drive, then what hope do you have in other areas of life. Nannying people isn't the way forward, they will learn the hard way.

 

[Benzowner]

Going back to the topic and taking it a stage further.

Big Brother tribe are you all reading this??

I would luv it, luv it if with the latest technology this new key could detect our blood alcohol content!!! How's that for a radical suggestion? The technology might not be present yet to detect blood\alocohl from our skin as we hold the key, but it cannot be far away. The key could also be programmed with our finger print Wrong finger print... no go. The key could contain the prints of all named drivers and this could be linked with the insurance database

I could go further with these suggestions but I fear *** and recycled might die of heart attacks

Over to the 'anti brigade'

Have a nice day
Regards
John

Wear gloves

 

[glojo]

John, your right, my breakfast nearly came up and I did nearly have a coronary episode but I've calmed down now

What ever happened to taking responsibility and control of your own actions. Gadgets that nanny us take away a part of humanity and control over ones day to day lives. I know you'll respond re ESP etc but thats different to your suggestion entirely as this monitors the person itself, not the car.

Take lexus eye detection thingee on the LS, it can tell if your nodding off. Erm people own and control a car, not the other way around. Its nice to be nannied etc by gadgets I'm sure, but if you can't even take responsibility for controlling your actions before you drive, then what hope do you have in other areas of life. Nannying people isn't the way forward, they will learn the hard way.

In an ideal World your right but drive by any pub car park and see the number of cars and NOT all of those drivers will be completely sober.

How many cars are being driven under a 'named policy' or someone driving a vehicle they do not own? i take onboard what your saying but........ WAKE UP.

This is the real world where folks lie, deceive and commit illegal acts

Go through the many threads where folks recommend members lie when submitting an insurance claim?

With my smart key it would detect those that chip, remap, or tune their car and this would be linked to the insurance database

I have NO sympathy with the offender and desperately want to protect the rights of the innocent.

Ho many cars are on our roads without insurance? My key would sort that issue out and so does ANPR

Regards
John