Morrisons 15p off per litre

[flango]

Maybe those 38000 miles were driven flat out everywhere? It was an impreza after all!

Engine failed due to excessive build up of carbon and excessive bore wear, it shouldn't matter if he had driven it like he had stolen it for all the 38,000 miles you would not expect the head and pistons to be in a state like this. My Impreza has been driven flat out most of its life on rally stages and Tarmac and it's internals are extremely clean at 140,000 miles, regular oil changes and branded fuel is the key

 

[martin_a]

Having had a tuned Subaru WRX running 300 bhp I had no issues with Tesco Ultimate.

Indeed the mapper who did the work and who runs the fastest Scobby in the UK said in order of preference V-Power and then Tesco 99 was his shopping list.

Car did 50,000 miles on it commuting and nver had an issue.

Lots of scoobies get piston slap or bore washing and other piston related issues because a lot are used as toys. They come out of the garage on a weekend, get thrashed then put away again. Doing low miles but hammering it for 90% of them will kill a lot of engines I think!

m.

 

[m2287]

Engine failed due to excessive build up of carbon and excessive bore wear, it shouldn't matter if he had driven it like he had stolen it for all the 38,000 miles you would not expect the head and pistons to be in a state like this. My Impreza has been driven flat out most of its life on rally stages and Tarmac and it's internals are extremely clean at 140,000 miles, regular oil changes and branded fuel is the key

Was it tuned baadly, serviced correctly, were any other cars from that station effected... there are surely just too many variables to say it was due to supermarket fuel?

Its just that I ALWAYS fill up at tescos and never had a problem, my mum and dad have both filled up at my local tescos for the last 22 years and also never had a problem!

 

[flango]

Having had a tuned Subaru WRX running 300 bhp I had no issues with Tesco Ultimate.

Indeed the mapper who did the work and who runs the fastest Scobby in the UK said in order of preference V-Power and then Tesco 99 was his shopping list.

Car did 50,000 miles on it commuting and nver had an issue.

Lots of scoobies get piston slap or bore washing and other piston related issues because a lot are used as toys. They come out of the garage on a weekend, get thrashed then put away again. Doing low miles but hammering it for 90% of them will kill a lot of engines I think!

m.

Andy Forrest mapped mine too but tesco 99 is not supermarket fuel it's a premium fuel used in many race series but I totally agree with your last comments though which IMHO certainly contributed to this.

 

[flango]

Was it tuned baadly, serviced correctly, were any other cars from that station effected... there are surely just too many variables to say it was due to supermarket fuel?

Its just that I ALWAYS fill up at tescos and never had a problem, my mum and dad have both filled up at my local tescos for the last 22 years and also never had a problem!

I've seen it on more than this car, a Vauxhall Omega failed at 70k run on supermarket fuel all its life, Vauxhall Vectra fail at 80k, Jaguar X type fail at 50k the common denominator Supermarket fuel, it just doesn't have the additive packages of the branded fuel, also when supermarket fuel is used with certain brands of oil this makes the problem much worse.

Will dig out and scan the photo's of the other cars I mention and you won't believe the carbon in the head

Did you keep the cars long enough to be aware of a problem? did you ever take the head off to have a look?

Everyone is entitled to do as they wish and fill up with what they want but as a professional engineer involved in the oil Industry for 25 years I would not go anywhere near it but thats just my opinion and I realise opinions vary

 

[m2287]

I've seen it on more than this car, a Vauxhall Omega failed at 70k run on supermarket fuel all its life, Vauxhall Vectra fail at 80k, Jaguar X type fail at 50k the common denominator Supermarket fuel, it just doesn't have the additive packages of the branded fuel, also when supermarket fuel is used with certain brands of oil this makes the problem much worse.

Will dig out and scan the photo's of the other cars I mention and you won't believe the carbon in the head

Did you keep the cars long enough to be aware of a problem? did you ever take the head off to have a look?

Everyone is entitled to do as they wish and fill up with what they want but as a professional engineer involved in the oil Industry for 25 years I would not go anywhere near it but thats just my opinion and I realise opinions vary

Im no expert and i do believe what you say, my parents had 3 different volvos doing around 20k a year in the space of those 22 years so they probably would have noticed... It could be a problem with the cars though, i mean not every one is made perfectly, there are afew that arent quite right.

I dont know, surely if it was that bad, it would happen more consistently, a bit like on my car, you know one of the abc struts will go at some point!

 

[m2287]

i dont normally keep a car longer than a year.. Ive kept this last one for a year and a half and dont really have any intention on changing for a while! I did use one of them additives the other day though, never used one before and just thought id get one for the hell of it!

 

[Mr E]

Just to throw the other view across...

Vx Omega (P) - 160k miles
MB E220 (D) - 160k miles
MB E220 (D) - 75k miles
BMW M5 (P) - >100k miles (Mr E Snr's, so not sure of exact mileage)

All run on supermarket fuel, no issues (and I know that the Omega is still going strong with >200k on it now.

Mr E Snr's view is that it's a very small variable in a complex mix of issues, and too small for the man in the street to worry about.

 

[flango]

Just to throw the other view across...

Vx Omega (P) - 160k miles
MB E220 (D) - 160k miles
MB E220 (D) - 75k miles
BMW M5 (P) - >100k miles (Mr E Snr's, so not sure of exact mileage)

All run on supermarket fuel, no issues (and I know that the Omega is still going strong with >200k on it now.

Mr E Snr's view is that it's a very small variable in a complex mix of issues, and too small for the man in the street to worry about.

ALWAYS run on supermarket fuel? i.e. never had any branded fuel through them? as it's well known one tank of branded fuel can clear out engine build up, the cars I am talking about ran 100% on supermarket fuel and never had anything else in them, I agree thought it's only one part of a complex picture but IMHO a major contributor

 

[SilverSaloon]

himmm, never had an issue with supermarket fuel. not worth worrying about as all other things can kill a car, i suspect the fuel (supermarket vs V power) or whatever is a rare thing and could be down to a number of reasons not just the actual fuel.

fuels a rip off, stick the cheapest you can find in and forget about it.

All IMHO! personally i dont use the tax station as i run 2 E300D's

 

[Mr E]

ALWAYS run on supermarket fuel? i.e. never had any branded fuel through them? as it's well known one tank of branded fuel can clear out engine build up, the cars I am talking about ran 100% on supermarket fuel and never had anything else in them, I agree thought it's only one part of a complex picture but IMHO a major contributor

Top three certainly - they were/are mine and have been 100% Tesco fuelled (or equivalent non-branded in France). The M5 was not mine, but knowing my Dad he'd not pay a penny more than he would do, especially with Tesco being his closest station too.

If there were a major issue, then we'd see cars failing all the time - none of the OEMs I work with consider it a risk, and it shows up in none of the the warranty or service records we process and analyse on their behalf. However, we all have a right to choose and our own experience will come to bear on that.

 

[scillyisles1]

It is astounding how this issue of supermarket fuel being one step from the devils own brew comes up time and time again on motoring forums with little or no scientific evidence from those who say that supermarket fuel is bad for a cars engine.

Fuel in the UK comes from a finite number of sources and suppliers so in many cases the tankers supplying premium branded outlets are also supplying the supermarkets. Supermarket fuel has additives in it in just the same way that the branded ones do. I guess the marketing depts of the fuel majors would like you to believe that their additives are magical substances but most research shows that there is very little difference.

Sainsbury's used to be supplied by BP but is now supplied by Greenergy who produce the Tesco Super 99 fuel. In fact Greenenergy is the largest fuel supplier in the UK.

 

[BTB 500]

Joking aside I do remember a comparison and something like a Mistubishi FQ300 did gain around 5bhp over normal fuel (petrol) but doubt I would norice 5bhp...

You're probably thinking of the 5th Gear test some years ago, comparing premium fuels (Shell Optimax and BP Ultimate) with standard supermarket unleaded.

In a Clio 1.4, the fuel made no difference when all three were measured on a dyno.
In a Golf GTI, Ultimate gave an extra 2 bhp compared to standard unleaded and Optimax gave 5 bhp (3% increase).
In a Subaru Impreza, Ultimate gave an extra 13 bhp and Optimax 14 bhp (6% increase).

They recorded a significant boost in torque too, more so with the Shell fuel. This was clearly noticeable when I towed the caravan with my petrol V6 Sharan - using Optimax (and later, V-Power) it pulled fine in 6th gear at 65 mph ... whereas with standard fuel you had to use 5th. In normal driving you wouldn't notice any difference, although I definitely got more range with the premium fuels when driven at the same speed - e.g. on our runs to/from Germany.

As already mentioned though the cleaning additives are more important than any slight power increase. My SL only gets V-Power. The Audi and the Vito normally get standard Shell diesel - where we are it's usually no more expensive than Sainsburys anyway. But both get odd tankfuls of other fuels e.g. if there's an offer on at the supermarket or we're on a trip. More so the Audi as that's older / simpler (no dpf etc.) / worth less, and does more miles.

 

[BTB 500]

Sainsbury's used to be supplied by BP but is now supplied by Greenergy who produce the Tesco Super 99 fuel. In fact Greenenergy is the largest fuel supplier in the UK.

It's interesting though that the significant fuel contamination incidents have almost exclusively affected supermarkets. IIRC Greenergy did accept liability in the end for the silicon problems that hit Tesco, Morrisons and Asda a few years ago.

 

[Dryce]

It's interesting though that the significant fuel contamination incidents have almost exclusively affected supermarkets.

Ah yes. Shell Optimax.

Quietly buried.

 

[BTB 500]

Ah yes. Shell Optimax.

Quietly buried.

Eh? No it wasn't, it became V-Power when it went from 98 RON to 99 RON.

Edit - were you thinking of 'Formula Shell' back in the '80s, which did get withdrawn?

 

[A210AMG]

I get 28mpg towing using supermarket cheapest fuel I can put in. I'm more than happy with that the most economical car I have ever owned.

Being honest I've never put any premium petrol in petrol cars I have owned or premium diesal for the two we own now. So really I've nothing to compare.

 

[SilverSaloon]

Personally I think the differences between "premium" fuels and standard fuels are marginal and is all marketing b0ll0x. as soon as they mention things like "developed with help from Ferrari", i loose interest as its obvious they are preying on people who hope their Mondeo is going to be quicker with "Ferrari fuel" in it.

put the cheapest fuel in you can find and forget about it, there are better things to worry about.

i also agree that supermarket fuel comes from the same sources as esso, shell etc so the difference can only be marginal, if any, and even if there was an issue it must be so rare (otherwise supermarket fuel wouldnt exist) that you'd only encounter issues if you have the car after 20 odd years, which in most people's cases is unlikely.

 

[scillyisles1]

Edit - were you thinking of 'Formula Shell' back in the '80s, which did get withdrawn?

Yes and it caused all sorts of problems. My E55 at the time had to have the fuel tank gauge replaced due to problems with Formula Shell (a known issue with this fuel) AIRC other manufactuers had problems with Formula Shell so it was withdrawn and Shell came out with a new better formulated fuel - Optimax.

 

[martin_a]

Eh? No it wasn't, it became V-Power when it went from 98 RON to 99 RON.

Actually V-Power isn't very stable. Neither was Optimax. RON rating degrades over time so fresh V-Power is usually higher than 99 but it could be worse depending on when it was last refreshed.

That's why they took the RON rating off the pumps because Optimax wasn't guaranteed to be 98 which Shell originally advertised.

m.