Should I swop C220 for E300?

[SSBB]

Ive only had three Mercedes, E300TD saloon, C250TD Estate, and now a C220CDI estate.
I sold the first two following bad experiences with rust,and vowed never to buy another Merc now here I am driving another one Trouble is, although Im fairly confident it wont turn brown and fall apart, It doesnt feel like the first two cars. The E300TD was a dream to drive and the C250 not far behind. The C220 feels inferior and rough by comparison and this time I know for sure Im driving a diesel.(sport pack doesnt help things)
Maybe its just me but Im hankering for that nice feeling I had when I drove my old E300TD. My wife thinks Im mad and my mates think I should be locked up...but none of them have been infected with the same MB virus as us...so any thoughts would be welcome.

 

[Dieselman]

If you can either find a good one or put up with dealing with rust, there's nothing like a 300TD, quiet, smooth, reliable.

 

[SSBB]

Ive seen a nice one on autotrader. 82000m, Silver, Fully loaded Avantgarde, looks like a very nice car, £3950

 

[Dieselman]

I would be far more bothered about condition than mileage on one of these. Check ALL the known areas for rust, including underneath.

If you get one there are a few mods you can perform to assist with economy. I'm averaging 40mpg now. I might see if I can stretch to the magic 800 miles to the tank this time, although last Saturday probably stuffed that...

 

[IanT]

If you get one there are a few mods you can perform to assist with economy. I'm averaging 40mpg now. I might see if I can stretch to the magic 80 miles to the tank this time, although last Saturday probably stuffed that...

Small tank then.

On a more serious note, I'm in exactly the same position as SSBB, and missed out on what seemed a very good (135k, no rust except for one neglected stone chip) 2002 E320 Avantgarde estate for £4,600 the week before last. I ummed and ahhed slightly, partly because I'd still got my current car to sell but should have gone with the gut feeling really - it sold the next day.

Good luck with the search, I keep finding conflict in the values between W210 and W211 cars in the 2002/2003 era, the new model often cheaper!

Ian

 

[Dieselman]

Small tank then.

Special compact version...Gotta save weight for hypermiling...

 

[Smiley]

Small tank then.


I keep finding conflict in the values between W210 and W211 cars in the 2002/2003 era, the new model often cheaper!

Ian

I think this is mainly due to some very optimistic asking prices on the late model w210s vs some sensibly priced higher mileage w211s. I think I would be tempted to look for a really nice 300 in w210 form rather than a 320cdi.

 

[IanT]

I think this is mainly due to some very optimistic asking prices on the late model w210s vs some sensibly priced higher mileage w211s. I think I would be tempted to look for a really nice 300 in w210 form rather than a 320cdi.

What's the logic then? I'm all ears. I have to say the main influence for me is more the cosmetic side of it really (facelift) and the later gearboxes.

I suppose the earlier engine is probably simpler and so might be easier to maintain, but am I missing something?

Ian.

 

[Dieselman]

Reliability and quality of materials in build. Definitely facelift interior plastics such as door cards wear more.

 

[IanT]

Reliability and quality of materials in build. Definitely facelift interior plastics such as door cards wear more.

Sorry Will, I wasn't very clear... discounting the W211 for a moment, was there some logic for pre / post facelift W210 or is that what you were talking about? I guess I was thinking conventional vs common rail diesel engines to begin with.

Nothing much wears out in my ownership of any car...

Tell you what, I'll start a thread rather than continue to hijack this one, feel free to educate me when you have time...

Ian.

 

[Dieselman]

was there some logic for pre / post facelift W210 or is that what you were talking about? I guess I was thinking conventional vs common rail diesel engines to begin with.

I meant pre/post facelift W210. Later interiors wear more.

An inline pump system is infinately more reliable than a common rail system.

 

[Smiley]

yes sorry should have been more specific - I dont have direct ownership experience as my w124 is still going (just passed the mot again) but have been very interested in the w210 for many years as the original plan (many years ago) was to upgrade the 124 for a 210. From what I can see the e300td seems to have a lot fewer "ownership hassle" than the newer e320cdi. Now if you are going w211 thats different as you are in CDI only territory - and then you can add water cooled alternators that fail, over complex braking systems that make life difficult for maintenance - and the early 211s were not even galvanised (I dont think). So all of that makes me think either save some money and buy a GOOD early 300TD in 210 form or spend a lot more money and get a post 06 facelift 211 - when they removed the daft brakes and galvanised it.

 

[IanT]

Thanks. That spoiled the plan a bit.

I've got to go and look at a couple of E300DTs then - is there anything much to choose between the two engine types on the road?

Cheers,

Ian.

 

[Dieselman]

Yes. The 320 Cdi has more low down grunt and outright pace, but the 300TD is so much more refined and sounds great when pushed. This is why it was retained for so long.

The slightly lethargic off the line performance of a 300TD is just down to not using a variable vane turbo and having the map set for soft acceleration.

All models use 722.6 gearboxes but CDi have Tip shift selectors. 300 have drain plugs on the torque converter though...

 

[IanT]

Thanks.

This is a tough one for me then. Psychologically I'd like to think I'd have everything my last one had, plus more grunt. In many ways the C250 (non turbo) D I had was quite sprightly, the 'box was pretty decisive sometimes and produced much more acceleration during the gearchanges than between them.

Do you know the points or conditions at which the torque converter is locked, and is this different between the two incarnations? i.e. is it only locked in top for example? I'm struggling to remember now, but have a sneaking feeling the E220 locked in several gears.

I'll go and look at an E300TD I guess, and compare it on the road with the CDI, only way of knowing. Shame you don't live locally.

 

[Dieselman]

The TC clutch proportionally locks in all gears iirc.