Stop expanding the ULEZ to all the London boroughs in 2023

[Darrell]

Can you imagine the arguments and confusion if it was only expanded in certain specific little areas though?

Why did it need to be expanded at all. Just let nature take its course. Give it 3 years and all the dirty diesels would be off the road anyway.

 

[Darrell]

1675 posts and has any one of those posts made any one in here change there mind on their views of ulez, for or against? The whole thread goes back and forth......

Yet you’re still here.

 

[clk320x]

You’re also missing the point about buying and selling, this has been discussed in this thread somewhere.

What’s this point?

What kind of ULEZ compliant vehicle can you buy that’s going to be safe, reliable etc for a grand?

Well I suppose technically everyone now has at the minimum £2k to spend, and if scrapping under the scheme their car will be worth sub-£2k so the replacement will probably be of an equal age and therefore safety standard or EVEN better if going from say a £500 1998 car to a £2k 2007 car…

If you own a more valuable non-complaint car such as for example a £5k Merc, are you suggesting you can’t find a reliable petrol car for £5k?

 

[clk320x]

What about a plumber in a 2015 Euro 5 van that now needs to change up to a Euro 6 van of the same condition, spec, mileage etc? That’s going to cost.

We’ve already discussed this before, vans are a tricky one, but the majority of vehicles affected are cars and seeing as vans are commercial vehicles, businesses/sole traders should have planned their finances accordingly in preparation for the transition. Don’t forget there’s also the option of paying the £12.50 fee in the interim, and with the prices some tradesmen charge in London, that shouldn’t be an issue.

 

[clk320x]

Why did it need to be expanded at all. Just let nature take its course. Give it 3 years and all the dirty diesels would be off the road anyway.

Because if the scheme works it’s 3 more years of lower NoX and PM2.5 in the zone?

 

[Darrell]

Because if the scheme works it’s 3 more years of lower NoX and PM2.5 in the zone?

3 years is nothing.

 

[Will]

Why did it need to be expanded at all. Just let nature take its course. Give it 3 years and all the dirty diesels would be off the road anyway.

Given the backlash on this thread (and as evidenced by a minority elsewhere) it’s clear that some people haven’t and won’t change their ways without the charge being introduced.

How long have the general public known that older diesels are bad news for health now?

 

[Darrell]

We’ve already discussed this before, vans are a tricky one, but the majority of vehicles affected are cars and seeing as vans are commercial vehicles, businesses/sole traders should have planned their finances accordingly in preparation for the transition. Don’t forget there’s also the option of paying the £12.50 fee in the interim, and with the prices some tradesmen charge in London, that shouldn’t be an issue.

Shouldn’t?

 

[Darrell]

What’s this point?

Flick back and you’ll find it.

 

[Will]

10+ years ago:

Diesel fumes more damaging to health than petrol engines | Transport | The Guardian

Ministry report says 'green' cars contribute significantly to air pollution and lung diseases

amp.theguardian.com

20+ years ago:

Health effects of diesel exhaust emissions

Epidemiological studies have demonstrated an association between different levels of air pollution and various health outcomes including mortality, exacerbation of asthma, chronic bronchitis, respiratory tract infections, ischaemic heart disease and stroke. Of the motor vehicle generated air...

erj.ersjournals.com

To me it’s staggering that people want to wait a little bit longer.

 

[poormansporsche]

Well the bloke who bought my euro 6 Vivaro van on Sunday has had it confirmed that he's getting the 7 grand scrappage for his old euro 5 van. So he's got a 4 year old 3.5t lwb van with 20k on the clock, for 8 grand which is not so bad.

Shame they couldn't pay me my 7 grand from 3 years ago first though. ****ers, the 7 grand that has cost me £130 a month for 3 years and a final payment of 3 grand over the weekend.

 

[clk320x]

Flick back and you’ll find it.

I don’t fancy reading 85 pages to find it, if it’s a really important point I’m sure you’d have said it.

 

[Harrythedog]

Kinda irrelevant really. I hardly think the protestors represent the majority of people affected by ULEZ.

We’ll find out next May. One candidate has said if elected she’ll scrap the scheme the next day.

Well the bloke who bought my euro 6 Vivaro van on Sunday has had it confirmed that he's getting the 7 grand scrappage for his old euro 5 van. So he's got a 4 year old 3.5t lwb van with 20k on the clock, for 8 grand which is not so bad.

Shame they couldn't pay me my 7 grand from 3 years ago first though. ****ers, the 7 grand that has cost me £130 a month for 3 years and a final payment of 3 grand over the weekend.

What scrappage scheme is this?
We‘ve been given a £4.5k grant against a new van that has to go through a main dealer and authorised financial service, also no private transactions permitted

 

[clk320x]

What scrappage scheme is this?

a quick google finds it... ULEZ van and minibus scrappage scheme

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

We’ll find out next May. One candidate has said if elected she’ll scrap the scheme the next day.

Not gonna happen. And it'll be too late by then anyway.

What scrappage scheme is this?
We‘ve been given a £4.5k grant against a new van that has to go through a main dealer and authorised financial service, also no private transactions permitted

It's part of the new, expanded scrappage scheme announced a couple of weeks ago Mayor announces massive expansion of scrappage scheme to all Londoners

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

10+ years ago:

Diesel fumes more damaging to health than petrol engines | Transport | The Guardian

Ministry report says 'green' cars contribute significantly to air pollution and lung diseases

amp.theguardian.com

20+ years ago:

Health effects of diesel exhaust emissions

Epidemiological studies have demonstrated an association between different levels of air pollution and various health outcomes including mortality, exacerbation of asthma, chronic bronchitis, respiratory tract infections, ischaemic heart disease and stroke. Of the motor vehicle generated air...

erj.ersjournals.com

To me it’s staggering that people want to wait a little bit longer.

Completely out of date and irrelevant info to add to the discussion on the evidence to support the real world impact of expanding the ULEZ to the full Greater London area. Great job.

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

The Ulez countdown: Londoners have a year to ditch old polluting cars

A £12.50 a day charge will affect 350,000 motorists from next October when the Ultra Low Emission Zone is expanded

www.theguardian.com

That's from 3 years ago regarding the previous expansion. Motorists were given 12 months notice. I don't remember too many people complaining. So why now?

Because many more people are impacted by this expansion, outer London has much worse public transport links and there's more reliance on cars, is less densely populated, and so on. Obviously.

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

For sure I remember looking at seven seaters when I was changing my previous estate S212 4+ years ago and I was well aware of the previous expansion even then. Regardless of legislation people have been aware of diesels being bad news health wise for a lot longer than that.

I realised I was going to have to spend more than I ideally wanted for a family car but it’s been pretty reliable, mainly just the depreciation cost to consider which is nowhere near as bad as many newer cars anyway.

I don’t really comment on mine or other’s finances but I can assure you cars are very cheap to run compared to children - if I had to drive an older car I would happily do so. I think I’ve owned/driven 50+ cars over years from old bangers to new daily drivers.

Is it the choice/standards think that people oppose here? As said already you can buy compliant cars for £1k so I don’t really see the affordability side of things.

I need to update my profile, the 190E went a couple of years back but I don’t drive my GL or 911 daily anyway (911 has hardly been used at all in recent years anyway)

I still don’t understand the timescale thing - how long do you think people realistically needed to swap their car? And that’s after it was well publicised and expected following previous expansion from the original (CC/central London) zone. Even the lorries have had the LEZ for years before this in outer London too.

I don’t know but 9 months seems okay - you can’t delay something forever just because a minority are unhappy about it?

Surrey man with GL63 AMG and Porsche 911 'still doesn't understand' how 9 months isn't enough time for certain parts of the population to buy a replacement car during cost of living crisis, why they can't just buy a £1000 banger, or why they should have to - shocking revelations. More news as reports come in, back to the studio!

 

[clk320x]

Surrey man with GL63 AMG and Porsche 911 'still doesn't understand' how 9 months isn't enough time for certain parts of the population to buy a replacement car during cost of living crisis, why they can't just buy a £1000 banger, or why they should have to - shocking revelations. More news as reports come in, back to the studio!

You still haven’t explained why they can’t buy a ULEZ compliant car with the £2k scrappage payment and call it a day?

Is it because there’s no reason they can’t?

 

[clk320x]

why they can't just buy a £1000 banger

What makes a petrol car of equal value to their diesel car a ‘banger’?