I disagree, but even assuming you’re right, what guarantee is there that Euro 5 diesels will be ‘naturally’ gone in 3 years? Considering they exist up to 2015 and some will only be 11 years old in another 3 years? If there’s no scheme to persuade people to change, they won’t…
I disagree, but even assuming you’re right, what guarantee is there that Euro 5 diesels will be ‘naturally’ gone in 3 years? Considering they exist up to 2015 and some will only be 11 years old in another 3 years? If there’s no scheme to persuade people to change, they won’t…
If you'd asked me about how many older cars I think I see out and about - I'd say the number drops off rapidly after 10 years age.
But this may simply be down to how level of usage (maybe older cars end being used less). My observation in Central Scotland is EVs aren't used that much - using a highly speculative casual observation technique which is based on relatively few being seen driven vs the number i see that never seem to move on driveways.
A more rigorous approach would be to look at howmanyleft website. And picking a few diesels from that would suggest that population peaks within a couple of years of intrtoduction and that peak is halved after about another 12 years - with a very steep downward curve after that for cheaper models (eg. Clio DCi) and shallower curve down for the likes of BMW 5 Series and Mercedes E class. That would suggest average practical life of 10 years isn't so far from the truth. There are some types such as SUVs where the population seems to have extended life.
In the case of Euro 5 - one might reasonably assume that the typical peak would be well before 2015 - and that would mean many if not actually most populations of Euro 5 diesel car models would be well down the curve from those peaks with only a few years to go before the vast majority were gone.
While suggesting that the 'benefits' of the scheme are oversold - this would also explain why there is perhaps not even more of an outcry.
I disagree, but even assuming you’re right, what guarantee is there that Euro 5 diesels will be ‘naturally’ gone in 3 years? Considering they exist up to 2015 and some will only be 11 years old in another 3 years? If there’s no scheme to persuade people to change, they won’t…
Surrey man with GL63 AMG and Porsche 911 'still doesn't understand' how 9 months isn't enough time for certain parts of the population to buy a replacement car during cost of living crisis, why they can't just buy a £1000 banger, or why they should have to - shocking revelations. More news as reports come in, back to the studio!
Oh dear - so this is turning into an issue of jealousy/entitlement/finger pointing then? Rather than looking at ways to do the right thing. You know nothing about my finances and I don’t really care what assumptions you make either.
I’ve already explained that I’ve owned/driven all sorts of cars over the years from old bangers (costing as little as £70!) up to new/nearly new ones. My cars have been previously more of a hobby thing for me, doing the majority of all work myself and often I bought cars needing work and turned them around in my spare time (something I don’t have as much of these days)
Running a car is a privilege, it’s often not cheap anyway. If I need to sell my cars and buy cheaper ones one day I will do so. They’re only lumps of metal and plastic. If someone is affected by this and needs to keep mobile on a budget, as said already there’s no real shortage of used cars that are compliant. It seems more of an entitlement issue, which is why the charge is needed as otherwise some people won’t make the change themselves.
People have known that diesels are bad news for many years. Referring to 9 months and then naively sounding surprised about change seems a bit silly.
not been paying much attention to this until recently from April 2019, if your car is not Euro 6 for diesel or Euro 4 for petrol, you pay the T-charge (which is the same as the congestion charge) in addition to the congestion if you go in to the congestion charge zone from Oct 2021, if your...
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I’m well aware that this has come in stages, but it’s really not unexpected that the zones have been expanded, even on this forum.
To repeat - this is not just a London thing. It’s happening all around the country and in many other places on this planet. Don’t be surprised if in future there are other areas that will try and reduce the usage of vehicles that emit high levels of pollution. Could well be nationwide one day, who knows.
Shall we start a thread to bring back creosote, asbestos, high VOC paint, coal fires? Maybe we can petition to bring back incandescent light bulbs and high wattage vacuum cleaners too.
Look back on this thread in five years time and it will seem silly it went on this long, IMHO.
And now we have extremists on social media openly encouraging destruction of cameras and violence against an elected politician along with racist insults and threats.
Given that Johnson and his mates introduced massive extra taxes on cars which pollute our air and poison our kids/grandkids, with no whining or moaning or threats or personal attacks, what is the gripe here?
Let’s call it out for what this is all about. Old fashioned extremist entitlement, with a dash of whataboutery and a thuggish desire for physical violence and destruction of property on our streets.
2010 Mercedes W212 E Class E350 CDI Sport, 2006 Mercedes W169 A Class A170.
I'd be very interested to know if the ULEZ changes make any measurable difference at all to the (already pretty good) London air quality.....and if in 12 months or so they even give an honest answer. My feeling is that it won't be much....possibly slightly lower overall but the particulate matter (the important one for most of the ULEZ advocates) will be much the same.....due to having three big airports nearby (Heathrow, the biggest, and Gatwick being in the direction of the prevailing wind of course ...West and South West) and the amount of tyre particulates remaining the same due to there being about the same number is cars... or possibly getting higher due to heavy EV models and the current trend to drive ugly, bloated over weight SUVs.
I'd be very interested to know if the ULEZ changes make any measurable difference at all to the (already pretty good) London air quality.....and if in 12 months or so they even give an honest answer. My feeling is that it won't be much....possibly slightly lower overall but the particulate matter (the important one for most of the ULEZ advocates) will be much the same.....due to having three big airports nearby (Heathrow, the biggest, and Gatwick being in the direction of the prevailing wind of course ...West and South West) and the amount of tyre particulates remaining the same due to there being about the same number is cars... or possibly getting higher due to heavy EV models and the current trend to drive ugly, bloated over weight SUVs.
...Shall we start a thread to bring back creosote, asbestos, high VOC paint, coal fires? Maybe we can petition to bring back incandescent light bulbs and high wattage vacuum cleaners too...
All of which, incidentally, ended up in a cost to individuals or to society (or both), and obviously poorer people are hit harder whenever a cost has to be incurred.
I am not indifferent to this, but what I do say is that we should improve people's standard of living year on year, help lift them out of poverty through education and by helping then acquiring skills and finding employment that pays well above minimum wages - rather than keep them poor and suffocate everyone with toxic fumes.*
The difficulty though is that when we say that we should lift poor peopyout of poverty, or that better public transport is the answer, or that we need more street chargers, etc, some people will argue that 'it will never happen' and therefore we shouldn't change what we're doing now. I find this attitude to be both defeatist and pessimistic.
Add to this the inherent distrust some people have in any form of authority, and you will get resistance to almost any government plan to affect a change. The assumption is that we got used to the old ways, and any change instigated by the government is bound to be for the worse.
* This is actually a political issue, there's an argument to say that some political ideologies benefit from keeping people poor and dependent on state handouts rather than lifting them out of poverty and lose government control over them, but I digress.
I'd be very interested to know if the ULEZ changes make any measurable difference at all to the (already pretty good) London air quality.....and if in 12 months or so they even give an honest answer. My feeling is that it won't be much....possibly slightly lower overall but the particulate matter (the important one for most of the ULEZ advocates) will be much the same.....due to having three big airports nearby (Heathrow, the biggest, and Gatwick being in the direction of the prevailing wind of course ...West and South West) and the amount of tyre particulates remaining the same due to there being about the same number is cars... or possibly getting higher due to heavy EV models and the current trend to drive ugly, bloated over weight SUVs.
The honest answer is already in the public domain thanks to the Office for National Statistics. Life expectancy in the UK is increasing not decreasing.
The honest answer is already in the public domain thanks to the Office for National Statistics. Life expectancy in the UK is increasing not decreasing.
It's not helping the government's coffers or the NHS budget, for sure. But it's the right thing to do... democratic governments are elected to benefit society, and at times there's a cost for doing so.
It's not helping the government's coffers or the NHS budget, for sure. But it's the right thing to do... democratic governments are elected to benefit society, and at times there's a cost for doing so.
Sold .. E350 CDI Sport Saloon 265. Mini JCW. Current
So after page after page of ‘discussion’, and the reading of reports, scientific analysis and clean air data, involving undoubtedly certain disruption and costs for hard working folks, you either believe the ULEZ expansion to be in the public good, or a merely a cynical ploy by a bloated egotistical politician to simply stiff you for extra revenue.
One thing is certain, it’s already cost a fortune to implement.
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