TMC Update

[glojo]

quite...

yes, I believe that Navteq is the correct name for Navtec/Navtech, but I could be wrong. Google isn't much help here...

they *could* be completely different... so don't take my word for it. (I don't even have a car with COMAND in it, yet; roll on 1st March

I 'might' try getting someone to put an old Mercedes-Benz DVD into the Pioneer to see if it recognizes it.

Good luck again with your choices,
John

 

[glojo]

I 'might' try getting someone to put an old Mercedes-Benz DVD into the Pioneer to see if it recognizes it.

Good luck again with your choices,
John

Tried and it does not read the disc. Either Navteq and Navtech are different or there is something that stops the Pioneer from reading the Mercedes-Benz disc.

Regards,
John

 

[calum]

OK. The company used to be called Navigation Technologies, and offered products branded NAVTECH. In March 2004, both the company's name itself, and their product branding, were changed to NAVTEQ.

http://www.navteq.com/

[Navtec, which crops up regularly, seems to be nothing more than a common misspelling]

 

[glojo]

OK. The company used to be called Navigation Technologies, and offered products branded NAVTECH. In March 2004, both the company's name itself, and their product branding, were changed to NAVTEQ.

http://www.navteq.com/

[Navtec, which crops up regularly, seems to be nothing more than a common misspelling]

Well researched, so it looks like there is some 'coding' on the different model disc's? What would your theory be about the DVD's not being interchageable?

The 211 COMAND will receive the TMC signal in European countries that have it, but as we have already stated it will not receive it in the UK.

I wonder if the member from Guernsey could receive the French signal?
Regards,
John

 

[calum]

Well researched, so it looks like there is some 'coding' on the different model disc's? What would your theory be about the DVD's not being interchageable?

The 211 COMAND will receive the TMC signal in European countries that have it, but as we have already stated it will not receive it in the UK.

It's very odd. Are you saying that TMC actually works for a UK car, with the Navteq Europe DVD, when in Europe, but it doesn't work in the same car when in the UK?

Or that it works for European cars, but not UK cars? If so, is there a different Europe DVD for the UK? No, that would be insane

 

[glojo]

It's very odd. Are you saying that TMC actually works for a UK car, with the Navteq Europe DVD, when in Europe, but it doesn't work in the same car when in the UK?

Or that it works for European cars, but not UK cars? If so, is there a different Europe DVD for the UK? No, that would be insane

Hi Calum,
I'm still trying to understand what you have said PLEASE blame me for being thick, it is no criticism of you.

I have only been told by one person that there COMAND picked up TMC information when they were driving through Europe. I certainly have NOT read anything to either confirm or refute what I was told.

I believe the COMAND is identical for all European models, and the disc is definitely the same.

I have NO technical knowledge of what activates TMC, but I have both read, and been told that all we will eventually need is a software upgrade that will allow our COMAND to receive this signal? The buttons and everything else is already working, but when I press the TMC button it just states 'No signal received'

So my assumption (on what I have been told) is that my car will indeed pick up the TMC signal in any European country that has it?? Unless someone knows different??

Sorry about being a bit thick,
John

 

[calum]

Well, the crux of my confusion is as follows:

o We know that TMC is broadcast in the UK - on Classic FM, and it's also broadcast in Europe, of course

o Reports that a UK car will receive and use the TMC data in Europe.

o UK cars will not receive and use the TMC data in the UK.

o Certainly for the old TeleAtlas CD maps, the CDs were available in both TMC and non-TMC flavours

This leads me to assume that there's something in the map CD/DVD itself that is needed for TMC. Yet, with the DVD system, we *have* a DVD that works with TMC in Europe, according to a report. I'm also assuming that the Navteq Europe DVD supplied with UK models is the same as that supplied in Europe.

We also know that the hardware itself can receive TMC (for the same reason).

So what exactly is it that needs upgrading so that we can use TMC in the UK? We know it's already broadcast, we know the DVD knows about it (since it works in Europe) and we know that the hardware itself can receive it (ditto).

I can only assume that everything needed is already there, but that licensing reasons mean it's artifically disabled, just for the UK mappings, perhaps?

 

[glojo]

I can only assume that everything needed is already there, but that licensing reasons mean it's artifically disabled, just for the UK mappings, perhaps?

Hi Calum,
I think you have hit the nail on the head It must be amusing for anyone that knows the real reasons why we are not receiving it, but my useless guess would be that there is perhaps some software coding that will activate the TMC signal in the UK and when Mercedes-Benz pays the licencing fee you and I will be paying in excess of £360 just for an 'upgrade' disc with the necessary programming code added.

I would further guess that the DVD I have at present contains the necessary software to work TMC when and if I ever go abroad.

Is anyone out there that knows anything about this interesting subject???? (I know there is)

Regards,
John

 

[calum]

Having re-read the thread, I see that tvcam has already made it quite clear, but I didn't grok it fully the first time around...

It's also interesting that you can order Navteq upgrade DVDs directly from their website, but it presents a list of car manufacturers, and MB are not on it.

 

[Goldfish11]

I upgraded to the V3 (2004) DVD for £40 by getting a copy off ebay. It seems many company car drivers get the company to pay the £370 and then sell off the old version on Ebay.

If anyone is interested in a Version 2.0 (2003) Europa DVD (my old one) PM me. I would be very happy to sell it

 

[saorbust]

Gents - I think I've told you all this before, but to recap...

TMC is broadcast continuously by Classic FM in the UK, numerous other stations in Europe.

In other words, you can pick it up. BUT

You need to be able to DECODE the messages.

And thats where the NAV CD comes in. You do NOT need a hardware upgrade to be able to get TMC messages. You simply need a translation engine.

The TMC codes are different for different countries. I have V4.0 of the DVD system - works fine in Germany.

We need a new DVD, with the codes to translate the signal. Then the job is done.

Now - the good news. I have seen it working here, in a test. Its a lot better than the older version for the CD based comand systems. Its probably being held up by the legal eagles.

Clarky.

 

[glojo]

Gents - I think I've told you all this before, but to recap...Clarky.

Morning Clarky,
I think that your latest post is the 'icing on the cake' that has just added a little bit more information to your previous post.

Thank goodness I was not talking a 'load of clap-trap' in my own guess of what was happening.

It beats me why Mercedes-Benz have to 'test' the TMC, when it is available on numerous vehicles and different brand systems.

Thanks for the informative update,
John

 

[Shude]

I'm almost certain I saw in a config file on the teleatlas nav CD (with TMC) an entry for TMC data and mercedes-benz comand models listed as not being enabled. This probably means that the disc itself has been set to allow other models of travelpilot-based navigation (ford, fiat, jaguar, maserati etc are listed) to use the TMC data but MB comand specifically not. If I get get my hands on that TMC ISO again I might try to edit the ISO and turn TMC on for comand, see what happens.

 

[glojo]

I'm almost certain I saw in a config file on the teleatlas nav CD (with TMC) an entry for TMC data and mercedes-benz comand models listed as not being enabled. This probably means that the disc itself has been set to allow other models of travelpilot-based navigation (ford, fiat, jaguar, maserati etc are listed) to use the TMC data but MB comand specifically not. If I get get my hands on that TMC ISO again I might try to edit the ISO and turn TMC on for comand, see what happens.

Hi Shude,
That would be brilliant, is it in computer machine code or plain English? Unfortunately the latest Navigation software is produced by Navteq. The older versions use Teleatlas. No doubt they will appreciate your efforts though.

Regards,
John

All files except one on my DVD are '*.db' the one exception is '*.ips'

 

[Alps]

just as a side point, TMC on my Alpine navigation has to be paid for with a subscription!

 

[sym]

Its no easier getting a disc to work TMC with the BMW system either ! Apparently the latest version does have the coding, but its only available as a part number for the 7 series - not for the 5 series, which is a joke, as they both use the same Navi system ! Some nonsense about it has to be licenced for the particular car, before they can issue a disc associated with it !

You can buy it direct from navtech, but its a slightly different version apparently ... ho hum ! Luckily my car also has a full version of trafficmaster fitted, so might just get a subscription key for that in the meantime, even though it won't re-route my Sat Nav, it does cover A Roads !

S.

 

[Shude]

That would be brilliant, is it in computer machine code or plain English?

It's in plain english, like a windows INI file, basically something like this:

[TMC]
Fiat whatever
Ford navigation thingy
Alfa Romeo WTFAmI
# Mercedes Benz Comand

and it's literally remarked so it's not enabled, delete the # and we're hopefully back in business. The only problem is that I had difficulty backing up a TMC navigation disc before so even if I can edit the file I probably won't be able to burn a working version of the disc. Seems sad that it's an extra £30 or something for a disc with TMC and as far as I know it doesn't even work! I did however see something like:

[General]
Copyprotection = 1

or something like that in there, which might also be an interesting switch to play with

 

[glojo]

It's in plain english, like a windows INI file, basically something like this:

[TMC]
Fiat whatever
Ford navigation thingy
Alfa Romeo WTFAmI
# Mercedes Benz Comand

and it's literally remarked so it's not enabled, delete the # and we're hopefully back in business. The only problem is that I had difficulty backing up a TMC navigation disc before so even if I can edit the file I probably won't be able to burn a working version of the disc. Seems sad that it's an extra £30 or something for a disc with TMC and as far as I know it doesn't even work! I did however see something like:

[General]
Copyprotection = 1

or something like that in there, which might also be an interesting switch to play with

Thanks Shude,
I understand exactly what you are saying. I do have 'hidden files' set to off, but I can only see the two types of file.

Good spotting though
Regards,
John

 

[tvcam]

Latest TMC from TVCAM

Mercedes Benz contacted me two weeks ago, and have now refunded me £850, and will give me a free first service because the TMC is not operative.

I complained by letter to Milton Keynes that they keep saying in the instruction book TMC/Dynamic Route Guidance will work in countries where TMC is available, when we ALL know it does not work in the UK where TMC is available.

The latest news MB reported was, they are currently testing a TMC Dynamic Route Guidance option that will not just take into account the traffic on motorways (same thing they said three years ago).. and this is why they have not offered TMC in the UK yet.

My recommendation is that more customers should make WRITTEN complaints and request refunds, or buy an MB Comand with the TeleAtlas CD navigation system, and then only buy TeleAtlas own brand discs, because the Mercedes discs don't have operating TMC/Dynamic Route. But the TeleATlas own brand disc from
Jan2004 does have TMC coding and Dynamic Route Guidance. :bannana: :bannana:

 

[Guy]

Mercedes Benz contacted me two weeks ago, and have now refunded me £850, and will give me a free first service because the TMC is not operative.

I complained by letter to Milton Keynes that they keep saying in the instruction book TMC/Dynamic Route Guidance will work in countries where TMC is available, when we ALL know it does not work in the UK where TMC is available.

:bannana: :bannana:

Well done, that is admirable persistence and a good pay off!