Whats your strategy for year 2030 / ban of ICE vehicles?

[Darrell]

My contribution to the planet isn't buying an EV, it's leaving my car at home and walking or taking public transport instead.

And flying you and your family to Italy for your summer holiday instead of getting the train to Cornwall.

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

Maybe.....but if you have to buy a car and care about the climate enough for it to affect you choice than a car that puts out 80 percent or whatever less carbon in its life can't be ignored.

You okay mate?

 

[markjay]

And flying you and your family to Italy for your summer holiday instead of getting the train to Cornwall.

My better-half is Italian... from Puglia in the south... they say that on a clear day you can see Skiathos

 

[ALFAitalia]

You okay mate?

Lol.....they are not for me.....I just don't like them and being able to accelerate fast won't change that.....but I'm not stupid enough to see that they are not the future and can see some of the benefits they being too many (financial, environmental or otherwise) But as a keen petrol head, classic car enthusiast (SADCASE member), half decent DIY mechanic, and someone who like cars that handle because they weigh less than Jupiter......(sure the weight is low down.....but if you are trying to corner an extra 500 (or whatever) kilos fast its impossible to beat physics).....I could never want or love one. I think most real car people will say the same.....even those that for whatever reason drive an EV.

 

[markjay]

Lol.....they are not for me.....I just don't like them and being able to accelerate fast won't change that.....but I'm not stupid enough to see that they are not the future and can see some of the benefits they being too many. But as a keen petrol head, classic car enthusiast (SADCASE member), half decent DIY mechanic, and someone who like cars that handle because they weigh less than Jupiter......(sure the weight is low down.....but if you are trying to corner an extra 500 or whatever kilos fast its impossible to beat physics).....I could never want or love one. I think most real car people will say the same.....even those that for whatever reason drive an EV.

I love cars and I live engines, most people on this forum do. And people who are into watches will tell you that an old Rolex or Omega etc has character, even if it's not as accurate or as precise as Swatch or a Casio (let alone the time on your smartphone). But what they won't do is try and tell you is that a Swatch is no good for them because they can never manage with a watch that needs to have the battery replaced every 5 years (i.e. in the event that they spontaneously decide to cross Australia by foot, you never know )

 

[TrueSpirit]

the implication of not liking EVs automatically rendering people ignorant is quite a leap. I know people who have got in one with a view to purchase it and not like it. Does that make them ignorant, no it makes them informed ? It's called personal preference. Some people may prefer lighter, cheaper cars that will last longer, that can be refuelled far quickly and more conveniently. It doesn't make them ignorant. EVs have significant downsides too. Acknowledging them doesn't make you anti EV or ignorant or whatever other names have been making the rounds.

 

[Steveml63]

Hi,
We chose to buy two EVs with our own money to replace two similar sized ICE cars.
The Tesla Model 3 Performance replaced a tuned 2017 Audi TTS - the Tesla outperforms and out handles the TT easily (they were actually quite crashy over speed bumps and uneven surfaces.)
The BMW iX40 MSport replaced a 2019 BMW X3M40i - the iX is a little bigger inside, is much more luxurious and has some amazing extras.
Where we live both petrol & electricity are much cheaper than the UK and we can actually charge both our EVs for free on public chargers.
We have an 11kw AC charger at home and it costs around £4.80 to fill either car with 80kW of charge.
Because of the above we are saving around £400 per month on fuel costs.
The Tesla has better data logging than the BMW and I just checked the charging statistics.
We have charged a total of 6558 kWh at a cost of £267 since last November.
We have covered 24926km (15488 miles) at a cost of 1.7p per mile.
It would be lower - but despite the available free charging we have still charged 69% of the time at home - because it is so convenient.
Regarding weight differences between EVs and ICE cars - our Tesla Model 3 Performance weighs 1844kg vs a 2022 BMW M3 Competiton at 1780kg - so a difference of only 64kg (or the weight of a small adult).
ICE cars that have been modified to become an EV are often much heavier - because their design is not optimised.
The EV equivalent of a BMW M3 is their i4 M50 and this actually weighs a hefty 2735kg! Nearly a ton more than the ICE it is based on!

Cheers
Steve

 

[Darrell]

the implication of not liking EVs automatically rendering people ignorant is quite a leap. I know people who have got in one with a view to purchase it and not like it. Does that make them ignorant, no it makes them informed ? It's called personal preference. Some people may prefer lighter, cheaper cars that will last longer, that can be refuelled far quickly and more conveniently. It doesn't make them ignorant. EVs have significant downsides too. Acknowledging them doesn't make you anti EV or ignorant or whatever other names have been making the rounds.

A couple of years ago a buddy of mine thought he should follow the herd and go electric. I think his 2 young teenage boys were hassling him and his wife is a bit of a hippy chick.

He bought a Lexus hybrid (not sure which model) for the thick end of £30,000. It lasted less than 3 months in his possession until he sold it and bought an X1 BMW Diesel. He simply says that he couldn’t get on with it.

He’s now got a 23 plate Diesel Q5 company car.

 

[Darrell]

the implication of not liking EVs automatically rendering people ignorant is quite a leap. I know people who have got in one with a view to purchase it and not like it. Does that make them ignorant, no it makes them informed ? It's called personal preference. Some people may prefer lighter, cheaper cars that will last longer, that can be refuelled far quickly and more conveniently. It doesn't make them ignorant. EVs have significant downsides too. Acknowledging them doesn't make you anti EV or ignorant or whatever other names have been making the rounds.

I’ve noticed that here on this thread.

 

[markjay]

the implication of not liking EVs automatically rendering people ignorant is quite a leap. I know people who have got in one with a view to purchase it and not like it. Does that make them ignorant, no it makes them informed ? It's called personal preference. Some people may prefer lighter, cheaper cars that will last longer, that can be refuelled far quickly and more conveniently. It doesn't make them ignorant. EVs have significant downsides too. Acknowledging them doesn't make you anti EV or ignorant or whatever other names have been making the rounds.

Not liking an EV is indeed personal preference. But repeating and posting every bit of negative info about EVs that one sees online is borderlining on an obsession.

 

[BTB 500]

Zero exhaust emissions is not the same as zero emissions ; England still burns fossil fuels to generate electricity ; so does Germany , and these are just two countries where EVs are already being used , that is apart from the carbon footprint of making the darned things

 

[Darrell]

My better-half is Italian... from Puglia in the south... they say that on a clear day you can see Skiathos

I doubt it. There’s a large land mass in the way.

 

[TrueSpirit]

Not liking an EV is indeed personal preference. But repeating and posting every bit of negative info about EVs that one sees online is borderlining on an obsession.

I would argue so is jumping to their defence in an equally vigorous way seems like it is bordering on an obession too. I don't share the view that the guardian article is bashing EVs. This is because the 5 EV burnout is doing the rounds as a trending item on social media and this specific article looks like pure damage limitation spin compared to a lot of other view points on it. I don't really have a strong view on EVs. I really like shiny new technology and a lot of EVs tend to have really impressive tech. If I was given one as a company car, I'd use it. However being the main ESG person in my firm which oversees billions in turnover that has to be made ESG friendly, I can see just how vacuous a lot of measures being implemented by UN, Blackrock, Soros , WEF our net zero policies etc are which will have a significant net negative impact on peoples lives apart from the rich ofcourse.

 

[markjay]

I would argue so is jumping to their defence in an equally vigorous way seems like it is bordering on an obession too. I don't share the view that the guardian article is bashing EVs. This is because the 5 EV burnout is doing the rounds as a trending item on social media and this specific article looks like pure damage limitation spin compared to a lot of other view points on it. I don't really have a strong view on EVs. I really like shiny new technology and a lot of EVs tend to have really impressive tech. If I was given one as a company car, I'd use it. However being the main ESG person in my firm which oversees billions in turnover that has to be made ESG friendly, I can see just how vacuous a lot of measures being implemented by UN, Blackrock, Soros , WEF our net zero policies etc are which will have a significant net negative impact on peoples lives apart from the rich ofcourse.

I read between the lines that you are suggesting that EVs are disliked because they are a symptom of the government's unpopular net zero policy. I can agree with that - but this can be left there, there's no need to rubbish EVs just to nail the government, especially when a lot of what is said about EVs is total nonsense.

 

[markjay]

View attachment 146672

Am I the only one spotting the trip hazard......?

On a serious note, would you rather have all the cr@p and black smoke bellowing from cars' exhausts outside your home and outside your kids' school? At least it's in the open air far away from where people live. But that's not funny, so let's stick with the joke.

 

[BTB 500]

Am I the only one spotting the trip hazard......?

Speaking of which I saw this picture the other day:

 

[markjay]

A couple of years ago a buddy of mine thought he should follow the herd and go electric. I think his 2 young teenage boys were hassling him and his wife is a bit of a hippy chick.

He bought a Lexus hybrid (not sure which model) for the thick end of £30,000. It lasted less than 3 months in his possession until he sold it and bought an X1 BMW Diesel. He simply says that he couldn’t get on with it.

He’s now got a 23 plate Diesel Q5 company car.

I never quite understood the point of Hybrid cars, not even the plug-in ones.

The reliability of any system is (largely) calculated by working out the reliability of each component and the number of components. The more components there are, the less reliable the system.

So you take the complexity of an ICE propulsion system, you add to it the complexity of EV propulsion system, and on top of both you add a third complex system to manage the other two complex systems. This can't be cheap to make and can't be cheap to fix.

I am fully aware that Toyota has an amazing track record for reliability, so that's probably why they manage to pull it off (Lexus Hybrids have been around for well over a decade, the Prius two decades).

But the concept makes no sense (and indeed MB's Hybrid were never very good).

EDIT: trivia - the Glock 17 when introduced had 34 parts, as compared to 52 parts for the popular Colt 1911. The Glock was cheaper to make (in part also due to use of composting materials), cheaper to fix, and much more reliable.

 

[markjay]

Speaking of which I saw this picture the other day:

View attachment 146678

That's nuts.

 

[BTB 500]

On a serious note, would you rather have all the cr@p and black smoke bellowing from cars' exhausts outside your home and outside your kids' school? At least it's in the open air far away from where people live. But that's not funny, so let's stick with the joke.

Traffic density is very low where we live and congestion/traffic jams are almost unheard of, so we survive OK. EVs are extremely rare round here.

As an aside my 71 plate diesel tractor doesn't have a cat or DPF ... apparently these are only required above a certain engine size / power output.

 

[BTB 500]

That's nuts.

Yup.

Mind you years ago I worked with a guy who had a 240V pre-heater in his Renault Espace and he ran the cable for that across the pavement (not at waist height though ).