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Whats your strategy for year 2030 / ban of ICE vehicles?

Darrell said:
13 runners have died competing in the London Marathon since its inception in 1982. Should it be banned?
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They only harm themselves, not others.

But when you drive an old Diesel car through the high street, you harm others.
 
Darrell said:
Breathing in exhaust fumes is also a choice.
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If you're wealthy enough to move to the countryside and never work again, sure.

But most people live and work where the flats and jobs are.
 
markjay said:
If you're wealthy enough to move to the countryside and never work again, sure.

But most people live and work where the flats and jobs are.
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You can move and still work. The examples you give seem to go from one extreme to the other.
 
MikeInWimbledon said:
What article is that? The article you posted, written by a very under-qualified journalist, demonstrated NOTHING like the direct causation of deaths from smoking that was identified in the 1960's and 70's. Londoners are NOT dying in their 50's purely because they live and breathe the air in Greater London.
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"Having assimilated this evidence, the review led by the US Health Effects Institute (HEI) concluded,with high confidence, that strong connections existed between traffic and road air pollution and increased death rates. A wider HEI review in 2022 reached similar conclusions for connections with lung cancer and cases of new asthma in children and adults."

I could probably find the actual research paper, but I doubt it will be accepted by this forum anyway....
 
markjay said:
Participating in sport activity is a personal choice.
Avoiding breathing cars' exhaust fumes if you live or work in a city, not so much.
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Agreed, personal choice in deciding to live or work in a crowded city, clearly needs intervention.

The population of London was in decline until I moved to London in the 1970's and has dramatically increased since then. More people should be priced out of town.

Obviously London's air quality is measurably better than it was a decade or five ago. But that's not the point.
 
Darrell said:
N

No.
Zero ailments.

No aches, pains or anything.
Never had a sickie and the only time I’ve had paracetamol is because I’ve got a headache.

Never been to A&E or had reason to see my GP apart from tablets to give up smoking.
They were astonished that I’d been registered there for so long without making an appearance.

I used to smoke, I’ve worked on roofs in London for donkeys years handling lead, I cycle in central London and I’ve lived in what is now the ULEZ.

Heart rate and blood pressure is that of a younger man.
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I refer you to my earlier post. Spend a few grand on tests and they'll find something that could be addressed.

That you haven't diagnosed yourself as having an issue wasn't my point.

As healthcare gets more sophisticated, it identifies more potential problems. Whether they are lifeshortening is another issue. My B-I-L got to 70 before the quacks identified the asbestosis he'd inhaled while running the wood "shop" repairing and rebuilding carriages for British Rail. Before that he'd led a healthy active life, playing football into middle age and doing lots of weekend DIY and gardening
 
MikeInWimbledon said:
Agreed, personal choice in deciding to live or work in a crowded city, clearly needs intervention.

The population of London was in decline until I moved to London in the 1970's and has dramatically increased since then. More people should be priced out of town.

Obviously London's air quality is measurably better than it was a decade or five ago. But that's not the point.
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And if London’s air quality is so bad now why do people still want to live here?
 
MikeInWimbledon said:
I refer you to my earlier post. Spend a few grand on tests and they'll find something that could be addressed.

That you haven't diagnosed yourself as having an issue wasn't my point.

As healthcare gets more sophisticated, it identifies more potential problems. Whether they are lifeshortening is another issue. My B-I-L got to 70 before the quacks identified the asbestosis he'd inhaled while running the wood "shop" repairing and rebuilding carriages for British Rail. Before that he'd led a healthy active life, playing football into middle age and doing lots of weekend DIY and gardening
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We’ve known the dangers of asbestos since the 70’s.

As an aside, asbestos removal was the biggest bill for the HS2 work at the Euston part. Followed closely by security.
Strange isn’t it that by doing something good and then keeping out the rabble that want to stop that good being done is a major expense.
 
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markjay said:
"Having assimilated this evidence, the review led by the US Health Effects Institute (HEI) concluded,with high confidence, that strong connections existed between traffic and road air pollution and increased death rates. A wider HEI review in 2022 reached similar conclusions for connections with lung cancer and cases of new asthma in children and adults."

I could probably find the actual research paper, but I doubt it will be accepted by this forum anyway....
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Once again, where is the evidence of causation. Not connection, not risk factors. The evidence that says that xx,000 Londoners are dying prematurely because of traffic pollution at the current levels. (Levels which are far, far lower than they were one, two, three, four, five decades ago)

We can see that the recent rise in the number of fast food outlets is causing chronic obesity, harmed quality of life, and reduction of life expectancy in London. One in four secondary school children in the UK is now obese. Not just overweight: obese. Where's the regulation to address that issue? It's non-existent because the government makes a money from the sales and business taxes on it.
 
Darrell said:
We’ve known the dangers of asbestos since the 70’s.

As an aside, asbestos removal was the biggest bill for the HS2 work at the Euston part. Followed closely by security.
Strange isn’t it that by doing something good and then keeping out the rabble that want to stop that good being done is a major expense.
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For sure. My point is that my B-I-L didn't know that he had it, because no-one looked for it.

Obviously we all knew people who had died from it, and we knew it was an issue with rail carriages and with all kinds of domestic settings: garages and the like.

In his case, it killed him, prematurely, in his early 70's. But for most, it's an undiagnosed condition that doesn't actually prematurely kill

Like the prostate cancer that half of we men will die with, but not from. One may have it, but it's not necessarily harmful or life-shortening.
 
MikeInWimbledon said:
For sure. My point is that my B-I-L didn't know that he had it, because no-one looked for it.

Obviously we all knew people who had died from it, and we knew it was an issue with rail carriages and with all kinds of domestic settings: garages and the like.

In his case, it killed him, prematurely, in his early 70's. But for most, it's an undiagnosed condition that doesn't actually prematurely kill

Like the prostate cancer that half of we men will die with, but not from. One may have it, but it's not necessarily harmful or life-shortening.
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Sorry to bring it up but when did your BIL pass away?

Reason I’m asking is because my old business partners dad was diagnosed with asbestosis in the mid 80’s and died in 87.

We were given talks on Prostate Cancer in 2007.
 
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markjay said:
"Having assimilated this evidence, the review led by the US Health Effects Institute (HEI) concluded,with high confidence, that strong connections existed between traffic and road air pollution and increased death rates. A wider HEI review in 2022 reached similar conclusions for connections with lung cancer and cases of new asthma in children and adults."

I could probably find the actual research paper, but I doubt it will be accepted by this forum anyway....
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One needs to carefully read these research papers as many are simply cherry picking and then performing statistical analysis on assumptions/predictions and modelling from other papers none of which specifically test the hypothesis using controls and sampled populations.
 
whitenemesis said:
One needs to carefully read these research papers as many are simply cherry picking and then performing statistical analysis on assumptions/predictions and modelling from other papers none of which specifically test the hypothesis using controls and sampled populations.
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Which is what Kahn does. He gives out the worst case scenario and scares the living daylights out of the proles.

They in turn bleat on about it like sheep and the funny thing is that most of them probably don’t even reside in London. They slide in from the burbs, moan about the traffic, collect their big salary and bog off again at 5 reading The Guardian on the train.
 
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Ted said:
Looks like the ban may not come in by 2030. Possibly delayed until 2035.

Rishi Sunak considers weakening key green policies Rishi Sunak considers weakening key green policies
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Let’s see. I hope he’ll take a proper look at it.

I’ve never been a fan of knee jerk policies.
 
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