You can help Porsche in its fight

[Dieselman]

Porsche invest heavily every year in improving their technology much like most other car manufacturers. Certainly technology in pretty much all cars has moved on tremendously over the last few years, mainly driven by Mercedes who seem to be the innovators of most of the improvements.

Sadly Ken has not moved on intellectually from his loonie days at the GLC!

Fair comments, but note that Mercedes (et-al) have done a lot more to reduce fuel consumption and emissions than Porsche and are not joining in with the fight against the additional charges as they will just produce vehicles that fall under the 226g/km threshold.

I don't see that Porsche have invested in reducing emissions or fuel consumption, merely in general product improvement to keep sales high and profitable.
Virtually all other manufacturers have reduced fuel consumption measurably by implementing new technology.

The reason why 'Red Ken' is implementing such draconian measures is because human nature dictates that people and companies will only act when financially forced to.

Whether we like it or not, there is only one way forward and the increased charge supports that view.

BTW: Just so you know I am no fan of Ken, but can understand this policy.

 

[Dieselman]

I suspect it might have something to do with the fact that you cant make affordable seriously fast petrol fuelled sports & supercars that emit less than 226g/CO2/km with todays technology. And thats the marketplace that Porsche are in. And Ferrari. And Maserati. And Lamborghini. And a few others as well. Its not just Porsche.
Its not too difficult to make a fast car dip under the 226g barrier, but to make a VERY fast car do that is another thing. And people buy Porsches precisely because they ARE seriously fast. Not because they just fast.
How many buy the entry level 2.7 engined version of the Caymen/Boxster?
I rest my case.

Hawk20, you're good at finding this sort of info, can you oblige please.?

Hmm..
Audi seem to think they have an answer for the short tem, and isn't that my point, technology has stood still for petrol engines.

They are no more efficient now than they were 30 years ago.

 

[verytalldave]

He wont be happy until we are all driving around in on of these wonderful creations. Even then he will find something to tax us on........

http://www.yourgreendream.com/yp_solar_car.php

A snip at $4500

 

[Dieselman]

Sounds Ideal for London traffic. Faster and further than at present..

Seats two people.
Can be 100% charged by the sun
Twenty-five Miles per hour top speed.
Range of 12 miles

 

[verytalldave]

Sounds Ideal for London traffic. Faster and further than at present..

Seats two people.
Can be 100% charged by the sun
Twenty-five Miles per hour top speed.
Range of 12 miles

BUT would YOU drive one? In London traffic?
I would imagine a Congestion Charge friendly Bendy Bus could hit one and not even know it.

 

[Alfie]

They are no more efficient now than they were 30 years ago.

This applies to Ken surely as the petrol and diesel engines have become more efficient in the last 30 years.

You never used to be able to get a 2 litre diesel to do 65mpg! Mine does (albeit occasionally). You never used to be able to have a 5 litre V8 that did anything like 20mpg. You can now.

 

[Alfie]

He wont be happy until we are all driving around in on of these wonderful creations. Even then he will find something to tax us on........

http://www.yourgreendream.com/yp_solar_car.php

A snip at $4500

All thats missing is the little blue badge.

That is one of the most hideous and dangerous looking things I've ever seen! I'd rather walk!

 

[verytalldave]

And according to the blurb, its adaptable to become road legal.

 

[jeremytaylor]

TfL use SMART cars with camera enforcement to enforce the red routes

I have seen TFL white vans with little cameras at each corner to enforce the Con Charge. You pay if you are in the zone on public roads, regardless of whether you actually move the car.

Also, is it not a little hypocritical of Ken to allow London Taxis in for free? They are in the top emission band and if you registered one privately, you would have to pay £25. Ken IS obviously scared of some things - like the Taxi-drivers lobby.

 

[recycled]

Fair comments, but note that Mercedes (et-al) have done a lot more to reduce fuel consumption and emissions than Porsche and are not joining in with the fight against the additional charges as they will just produce vehicles that fall under the 226g/km threshold.

Whether we like it or not, there is only one way forward and the increased charge supports that view.

.

i am not sure this is accurate.
the merc cars that compete with the porsche do not have reduced emmisions at all ala the AMG's and the twin turbos or supercharged V8 cars.
Merc have diluted their prestige with some cheap city cars and the doomed chrysler project to see them through.
i hope you are not suggesting stuttgarts finest start making cars like a porsche 111 or 211 with the engine hidden in some cupboard or glove compartment beneath the wheels to please ken and his dictatorial ideas.
As for voting, the whole of london might vote for this but they are not affected .if you ask a vote on just the people of london affected there will be a crushing defeat .
Meanwhile i am sure if you wake up today and find out that you have to par £25 to move your car out of your garage in to the street, you will not like it at all.
believe me remember in 1930's when some german said he was only after german territory lost in the 1910's and the west let him?
it went from that to the rhine, on to czech, on to poland then to the low countries unil he was threatening us.
I will not sit pretty even if i have a zero polluting car right now. as if such a thing even exists.

I think diesel man is cross with porsche as they have refused to endorse his name on their cars unlike the usual culprits audi

 

[recycled]

I have seen TFL white vans with little cameras at each corner to enforce the Con Charge. You pay if you are in the zone on public roads, regardless of whether you actually move the car.

Also, is it not a little hypocritical of Ken to allow London Taxis in for free? They are in the top emission band and if you registered one privately, you would have to pay £25. Ken IS obviously scared of some things - like the Taxi-drivers lobby.

buy one, register it as a taxi and keep the yellow light off all day.
do the national express have to pay this as well?

 

[verytalldave]

As an alternative, buy a 9 seater Land Rover and register it as a bus. Get yourself a PSV licence and Kens your uncle.
I think that loophole will be closed very shortly.

 

[Dieselman]

Merc have diluted their prestige with some cheap city cars and the doomed chrysler project to see them through.

Depends on whether you consider an S class to be a cheap city car..??:S

http://www.vcacarfueldata.org.uk/search/vehicleDetails.asp?id=17414

And I don't really care what technology they use but so far they have stood still for a long time.

 

[Dieselman]

This applies to Ken surely as the petrol and diesel engines have become more efficient in the last 30 years.

Not really for petrol engines, they have stood still at 25% efficiecncy for years. Cats even reduced efficency.

The only tangiable improvements have been in reduced friction and marginally better burn.
Diesels have become more efficient due to the use of direct injection and higher pressure injection systems.

 

[television]

MB are saying that the new SL350 engine is much more efficient claiming a much better 0-60 and a lot more economical the actual figures are in the article that I put up.

 

[recycled]

Depends on whether you consider an S class to be a cheap city car..??:S

http://www.vcacarfueldata.org.uk/search/vehicleDetails.asp?id=17414

And I don't really care what technology they use but so far they have stood still for a long time.

unfortunately some of us do not like cars that can not move without a turbo or forced induction.

Good suggestion though stick a high pressure turbo in every 1.5 litre petrol and you will pass the low emmisions malachy.
remember 80,s F1 cars ? 1.5 turbo 1200hp

 

[hawk20]

Porsche are using the public to fight their battle so they don't have to invest as they should have been doing. It's all about money for them and nothing about freedom of choice for their customers.

All they need to do is to produce cars that fall under the 226g/km threshold. For some reason they don't want to do that.

I wonder why?
.

Dieselman: your desire to save the planet is completely fusing your normally sharp mind.

Porsche have not designed cars round a CO2 level of 226g/km because only Britain -a small offshore island-- has adopted this totally arbitrary figure. And only London has a £25 per day tax on such cars.

The time lag in car design from glint-in-the-eye stage to a final new product is years not a few months to suit the whims of a maverick ex loony-left Labour MP turned London mayor.

 

[recycled]

As an alternative, buy a 9 seater Land Rover and register it as a bus. Get yourself a PSV licence and Kens your uncle.
I think that loophole will be closed very shortly.

or one of them old post office ldv vans
Anyway since this is about money, that will be closed as well.
even the prius will cough up sooner or later. it will be called battery acid charge

 

[prprandall51]

As an alternative, buy a 9 seater Land Rover and register it as a bus. Get yourself a PSV licence and Kens your uncle.
I think that loophole will be closed very shortly.

I think you will find that such a vehicle will then come under the LEZ. Gotcha!

I am disappointed to find that my Land Rovers come under this new bit of beaurocracy. Having said that, I would only take one to London in order to drive it through the doors of County Hall (or whatever that self indulgent pile of rubbish is called nowadays).

 

[Dieselman]

Dieselman: your desire to save the planet is completely fusing your normally sharp mind.

Porsche have not designed cars round a CO2 level of 226g/km because only Britain -a small offshore island-- has adopted this totally arbitrary figure. And only London has a £25 per day tax on such cars.

The time lag in car design from glint-in-the-eye stage to a final new product is years not a few months to suit the whims of a maverick ex loony-left Labour MP turned London mayor.

Thanks for the comment Hawk20, good to see you haven't lost your will to insult people that disagree with you.

The global markets are shifting towards lower emission vehicles and there is an EU mandate that average emissions from a manufacturers range should fall below 170g/km (?) within the next few years for vehicles sold within the EU.

Sure the German Luxo-barge manufacturers are going to face a problem and have petitioned their PM to support their case, but they are in the main doing something about it as well. Well all except Porsche, that is.

Ken didn't dream up the 226g/km band, it is a UK Government banding and classifes those vehicles as Band G, also referred to as gross polluters.
Ken is simply enforcing the will of the EU in a way in which he and the TFL see fit.