You can help Porsche in its fight

[Dieselman]

Still billed as a conjestion charge, just now has different levies for different CO2 emissions.

Clever....


http://www.tfl.gov.uk/roadusers/congestioncharging/default.aspx

 

[prprandall51]

That is plenty of time for most people to make a decision about their car. A lot of those affected will have changed their car before then anyway.

But how would you like it if someone just told you - not asked you or encouraged you - that you have to sell the car you currently own and buy a different one? With the financial penalties - especially the abolition of the residents' discount - this is effectively what is happening.

Plus, as I have already pointed out, the only person who is going to buy that car is going to be someone who lives so far from London that they don't give a stuff about the CC. So what sort of offer are you going to get on your car? A low one.

Great.

 

[robert.saunders]

I have also seen them "on duty" up Shaftesbury Avenue - where there are no bus routes at all - red or otherwise. So presumably they must have a dual role. One - to enforce red route useage, and Two - to check on car/van zone payments.

If they check for CC "payment" they have to have specific signage which states that's what they are doing. If not, then they are enforcing red routes (not necessarily bus routes) and if not TfL vehicles, could enforce other parking controls via the local council who also use CCTV-equipped SMART cars (technology which is going nationwide from 31 March)

 

[verytalldave]

This really is crazy ...

So, even if you are not using your car (i.e. the car has not been started and driven in and/or out and/or around the Zone during the charging hours), and therefore not polluting, you pay !!???!!

I might be wrong, but that is my interpretation of the rules that will come into force in October. Enter enter or be in the zone during the chargable time and you will be liable for payment providing your car is on the road. Parked or not.
I would like somebody to prove me wrong.
I am waiting..................

 

[hawk20]

only just realised that the new charges come into force in October 2008.

That is plenty of time for most people to make a decision about their car. A lot of those affected will have changed their car before then anyway.

Dieselman you are a reasonable man with numerous wise postings but that is a ludicrous argument. People do not change their car every six months or so unless they are very well off -and stupid. For families with petrol estate cars, for sports car fans, for those with band G 4x4's, and many others, this is going to cause upheaval and hardship. Do you really think selling band G cars in London will now be a simple matter? Or even possible for some. And not everyone has the replacement cost at the ready. I simply do not believe that under a truth drug you can possibly support retrospective legislation. If you do, you are off my xmas card list

 

[verytalldave]

Still billed as a conjestion charge, just now has different levies for different CO2 emissions.

Clever....


http://www.tfl.gov.uk/roadusers/congestioncharging/default.aspx

Not after October.
It will then be re-named the CO2 Charge (or Levy).

 

[robert.saunders]

I'd love to know exactly how many vehicles will be affected by the £25 charge

 

[hawk20]

I'd love to know exactly how many vehicles will be affected by the £25 charge

Isn't it 33,000 according to TfL?

 

[verytalldave]

I'd love to know exactly how many vehicles will be affected by the £25 charge

Looking at the "average" car that drives past my office window in Holborn - quite a few. Difficult to be very specific because many might be low CO2 diesels. Plenty of the bigger Mercs and BMWs mixed in with a fair few 4x4s. Although I bet that number will fall after October.
Are statistics available anywhere?

 

[hawk20]

Looking at the "average" car that drives past my office window in Holborn - quite a few. Difficult to be very specific because many might be low CO2 diesels. Plenty of the bigger Mercs and BMWs mixed in with a fair few 4x4s. Although I bet that number will fall after October.
Are statistics available anywhere?

Yes. In the TfL report I think. Ken said 3,000 at the Press conference and they corrected him to say it was 33,000. That's how much he knows

 

[Dieselman]

Dieselman you are a reasonable man with numerous wise postings but that is a ludicrous argument. People do not change their car every six months or so unless they are very well off -and stupid. For families with petrol estate cars, for sports car fans, for those with band G 4x4's, and many others, this is going to cause upheaval and hardship. Do you really think selling band G cars in London will now be a simple matter? Or even possible for some. And not everyone has the replacement cost at the ready. I simply do not believe that under a truth drug you can possibly support retrospective legislation. If you do, you are off my xmas card list

But this hasn't just come along unannounced.

I was made aware of this new scheme through the consultation, which came out a few months ago.

And I would think that most Porsche drivers that may be affected may well change their cars in the order of annually or so.

The average family person will have already been avoiding cars that emit 226g/km or more due to the increased road tax, which has been published for a long time.

On a personal level of course I wouldn't like it if I was directly affected by this, however I am aware that road/congestion/pollution charging is likely in the Cities near me and as such am aware of the need to be aware of my options.
When that day comes I will probably switch to a lower emitting vehicle, possibly electric for City use or diesel/electric hybrid.

This has been reported as coming for a long time.

Porsche's action is like King Canute trying to stem the tide and manipulating the public into supporting them. They should be accepting change and embracing new technologies to produce cleaner vehicles.

If the computer industry was like the car industry, we wouldn't be having this conversation now as there would be no internet.

 

[Dieselman]

Isn't it 33,000 according to TfL?

Out of how many in that travel into or are resident in 'the Zone'.?

 

[Alfie]

................................................................................................................

If the computer industry was like the car industry, we wouldn't be having this conversation now as there would be no internet.

That is rubbish. There can be no valid comparision between the existence of the internet to the Kengestion Tax.

I fail to see how the globe was offered the internet if they paid a tax for it but made sure they downgraded their PC first to one that runs on 5 volts instead!

Come on Dieselman you are normally quite erudite but this comparision is way off..........

 

[verytalldave]

.....the Kengestion Tax........

Love it..........Excellent.......

 

[Dieselman]

That is rubbish. There can be no valid comparision between the existence of the internet to the Kengestion Tax.

I fail to see how the globe was offered the internet if they paid a tax for it but made sure they downgraded their PC first to one that runs on 5 volts instead!

Come on Dieselman you are normally quite erudite but this comparision is way off..........

Alfie.

I suspect you are quite aware that my comments refers to the lack of technology improvement by the car manufacturers, not road taxing, if not please take this post as confirmation.

Porsche are using the public to fight their battle so they don't have to invest as they should have been doing. It's all about money for them and nothing about freedom of choice for their customers.

All they need to do is to produce cars that fall under the 226g/km threshold. For some reason they don't want to do that.

I wonder why?

Just to qualify this further.
I am making an assumption that all forum members would like a car that can go further on a gallon of fuel, whilst producing lower emissions, if there was no performance trade off.

This is possible, but requires more thought and development from manufacturers.

One analogy that should apply is that of Triumph motorcycles as was. The Good ol' Boys used to say that Japanese motorcycles were no good and wouldn't catch on.

Well the rest is history...

Porsche and other manufacturers need to get on board with the programme.

 

[Sp!ke]

If the computer industry was like the car industry, we wouldn't be having this conversation now as there would be no internet.

Shouldnt that be "If the porn industry was like the car industry"....

 

[Alfie]

Alfie.

I suspect you are quite aware that my comments refers to the lack of technology improvement by the car manufacturers, not road taxing, if not please take this post as confirmation.

Porsche are using the public to fight their battle so they don't have to invest as they should have been doing. It's all about money for them and nothing about freedom of choice for their customers.

All they need to do is to produce cars that fall under the 226g/km threshold. For some reason they don't want to do that.

I wonder why?

I respect your opinion. I do not necessarily agree with it but I respect that it is yours.

Porsche invest heavily every year in improving their technology much like most other car manufacturers. Certainly technology in pretty much all cars has moved on tremendously over the last few years, mainly driven by Mercedes who seem to be the innovators of most of the improvements.

Sadly Ken has not moved on intellectually from his loonie days at the GLC!

 

[Dieselman]

Shouldnt that be "If the porn industry was like the car industry"....

But then we'd all be driving 1950s models....

 

[verytalldave]

Alfie.

I suspect you are quite aware that my comments refers to the lack of technology improvement by the car manufacturers, not road taxing, if not please take this post as confirmation.

Porsche are using the public to fight their battle so they don't have to invest as they should have been doing. It's all about money for them and nothing about freedom of choice for their customers.

All they need to do is to produce cars that fall under the 226g/km threshold. For some reason they don't want to do that.

I wonder why?

I suspect it might have something to do with the fact that you cant make affordable seriously fast petrol fuelled sports & supercars that emit less than 226g/CO2/km with todays technology. And thats the marketplace that Porsche are in. And Ferrari. And Maserati. And Lamborghini. And a few others as well. Its not just Porsche.
Its not too difficult to make a fast car dip under the 226g barrier, but to make a VERY fast car do that is another thing. And people buy Porsches precisely because they ARE seriously fast. Not because they just fast.
How many buy the entry level 2.7 engined version of the Caymen/Boxster?
I rest my case.

 

[Alfie]

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Ken Livingston

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