124 estate/saloon wheel difference

[philiggy]

Anyone know what the difference is between the wheels on 124 estates and saloons (they look the same) but estates have stickers on them and on inspection they are 1244001002 and saloons have part number 1244001202.
I would guess its loading but I wonder if in reality it would be okay to mix them

Phil

 

[bolide]

Estates run T-wheels (T-Model) which are much thicker and weigh about twice as much

It has to be about loading. I wouldn't run ordinary steels on an estate

Nick Froome
www.w124.co.uk

 

[1augapfel]

Greeting, gents, I'm new to this forum. I usually hang out here:

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w124-e-ce-d-td-class/

since I'm in the USA and own several 124s (all 1988s).

I got here by doing a google search on 124 400 12 02. I run these steel wheels and Euro covers on one of my estates. The steelies came from a gray market car (saloon).

I was surprised to see that estates got different (thicker) steel wheels than saloons. I've been running the 12 02s on the estate for a few years but I use the estate as a family hauler, not heavy cargo hauler so heavy loads are not an issue.

Despite that, I may be interested in buying a set of the heavier estate wheels (and some wheel covers) to use for winter tyres on my cars. How much does a set of used estate wheels sell for on the other side of the pond? I guess shipping would be brutal.

All the 124s sold here in the USA had alloy wheels so I'm out of luck when it comes to finding the wheels locally.

 

[bolide]

I'd estimate the estate T-Wheels weigh about 10 Kg (22 lbs) each. You'd need the matching wheel bolts and wheel trims

I have plenty of sets if you really want some

Nick Froome
www.w124.co.uk

 

[GrahamC230K]

I seem to recall a thread where the same thing was queried but the responses were the more along the lines the wheels were not different (which would now seem incorrect). Anyone know the thread?

 

[Will]

Haven't seen the thread before, but I concur with Nick (bolide) that the 124 estate wheels are certainly heavier/thicker/different to the regular saloon model.

I also have a set lying around if someone needs any

Will

 

[Smiley]

Why do they use the same alloys if the steels are different?

 

[Will]

Why do they use the same alloys if the steels are different?

Presumably due to cost.

If you're producing millions of steel wheels, it's cheaper to make them suitably thinner for one model rather than simply using extra steel for every car sold.

I would imagine that the alloy wheels are suitably stronger than the thinner type of pressed steel wheels? Obviously the choice for alloy wheels was a cost option when new.

Will

 

[neilrr]

Why do they use the same alloys if the steels are different?

Because the alloys are at least as strong as the reinforced steel wheels?

 

[Smiley]

Interesting - I guess that is probably right. I am surprised that the steel wheels are that much different - the saloon is still a heavy car and the idea of "getting away" with a slightly thinner wheel for the saloon to save a few Deutschmarks (remember them ) does not really sit with the over engineering principles at the time.
Oh well got bigger things to worry about like how Gord is going to get us out of the small matter of taking the country to bankruptcy.....

 

[Will]

Interesting - I guess that is probably right. I am surprised that the steel wheels are that much different - the saloon is still a heavy car and the idea of "getting away" with a slightly thinner wheel for the saloon to save a few Deutschmarks (remember them ) does not really sit with the over engineering principles at the time.
Oh well got bigger things to worry about like how Gord is going to get us out of the small matter of taking the country to bankruptcy.....

Hi Smiley,

I don't think it was probably a case of 'getting away' with something, more that the suitably strong wheels that they used on the regular saloon, were then 'over engineered' to be extra-strong for the possible load-lugging T-models

It's not cost-cutting as such, simply why stop using the normal steel wheels and start use heavier wheels made from more steel than neccessary on a saloon with no requirement for them?

Will

 

[Dieselman]

The mass of a wheel/tyre combo makes a considerable difference to acceleration, braking and steering forces due to the gyroscopic effect and suspension quality due to unsprung mass.

Saving weight on wheels is definitely a good thing for ride and handling.

Did anyone see TopGear where they fitted big alloys and brakes to the Renault Avantime.?
It added several seconds to the lap time. Doh.!!

Weigh your wheels..

 

[Will]

Yep, a good point there Will.

Even fairly small wheels/tyres come in at around 15kg a piece. That's a good 60kg of unsprung weight to deal with.

Will

 

[230K]

The mass of a wheel/tyre combo makes a considerable difference to acceleration, braking and steering forces due to the gyroscopic effect and suspension quality due to unsprung mass.

Saving weight on wheels is definitely a good thing for ride and handling.

Did anyone see TopGear where they fitted big alloys and brakes to the Renault Avantime.?
It added several seconds to the lap time. Doh.!!

Weigh your wheels..

I did!!!! http://www.mbclub.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=60852&highlight=alloy+wheels
The alloys weigh more than the steel wheels

230K

 

[Dieselman]

I did!!!! The alloys weigh more than the st... as speed builds aerodynamics then take over.

 

[The G.F.P]

i sold my old polished sportline 15"alloys that were on GFP 3 (the twin turbo) to a bloke who put them on his estate and im sure he was from this forum

he has not had any problems that i know of

 

[trapperjohn]

Thanks philiggy for the heads up and the part numbers. Next time my wheels are off Ill check. I run my 124 estate on 16" steels for the winter and 16" 8 hole alloys for the summer. Not noticed anything amiss in handling/suspension/steering running the car this way. Sure 15s are standard spec. Why 16s? Fill the arches better and because I can. Anyone get one 16" estate steels Im interested.