190e head bolts problem

[tony853]

hi guys ive been trying to source head bolts, but bought head bolts firstly from gsf , but went to fit them and they longer than the original. so travelled back to gsf to see what was wrong they are the right bolts . i tried explaining that they longer than the original ones and could either cause damge if too long if bottomed out in thread hole and pushed through the block or just bottom out not allowing you to torque head down .he started to get fresh so i as for money back .
then went to another place bought some more of which was on next day
but these where the same .so i got in touch with the manufacturer whose techy bloke said he see where i was coming from ,the head of these bolts are only slightly thicker than the hole to whiich the go through so i gave him dimensions of the original bolt he tells me i need a washer. idid see it needed a washer as it was obvious when opened and put in hole .but nothing mentioned anywhere about having washers .so iasked to order them from this manufactor he says they dont do them go to mercedes and get them

but why manufacture a bolt to do a job that is in adequate for the job .erm erm erm we dont do the washer ,

anyway guys if you can give a place to where i can get these washers i would be greatfull and so would the owner of this mercedes

thanks
and be aware of head bolt without washers

 

[Dieselman]

They are just spring washers, but you can get them from your MB dealer.

p/n N000137008212


Although it's good practice to replace them anyway, what happened to the old ones?

 

[BlackC55]

Just get them from your local MB dealer. They are around £3 each. You will know they are 100% correct then.

 

[tony853]

cheers they not spring washer there flat .
3.75 plus vat each bolt 1.50 plus vat for a washer

i really only needed 1 as one needed drilling out as was siezed in but being strech bolt i thought you need to change them why i went and bought set and at current climate a set at £14 against a set £63 iam going to get the cheaper set but after all the cheaper set is starting to workout dearer than the mercedes set.

 

[Will]

MB head bolts have the flat washers built in. The GSF ones don't and are no good IMHO.

I think the price of the head bolts has risen slightly, might be nearer £4-5 each with the VAT or so (x10, £40-50 in total).

I don't have the WIS data in front of me, but there's a permitted maximum length for the cylinder head bolts - so you could measure the original bolts and re-use them if they're within spec (something like 2mm max stretch).

I used new MB bolts for both of the 2.5-16s that I rebuilt, but on the 8-valve M102 that I rebuilt last year the original bolts were fine and well within spec. I don't think M102/M103 engines suffer much with head bolts anyway.

In reality, cleaning out the bolt holes in the block thoroughly, cleaning the threads properly, using a decent torque wrench, angle guage and ensuring perfect conditions for the gasket/block/head mating surfaces are probably just as (if not more) important.

IMHO

Will

 

[BlackC55]

For what they cost i would use the MB bolts.

TIP: Blow the bolt holes out with an air line and lubricate the threads of the new bolts with a little engine oil. Also lubricate the head of the bolt too so it does not "cut" into the head and give you a false torque when torquing up.

 

[Will]

Good tip, I cleaned them out and used compressed air from a can, also ran the (new MB ) bolts by hand into and out of the threads in the block gently before fitting to ensure smoothness on the threads and no trapped oil/moisture (hissing/bubbling)

But if it were a question of spurious bolts + adding washers or using original bolts that are within spec, I'd use the originals.

For the 2.5-16, the head bolts were £4.35 + VAT each - if you're doing the work yourself I reckon it's well worth paying that considering how much you would have saved doing the job yourself anyway

 

[tony853]

bang on lads .Will this is what i told they guy, they where already built on as a complete bolt . i did speak to our local mb parts depo yesterday and he says that they needed washers and i said the bolt i have was a complete so i guess i will give a trip to mercedes and take bolt with me and see from there

the guy from bgautomotive whom manufacture the bolt or supplys it said he get in touch with parts agent in town and credit account so no worries mb here i come

thanks guys just as a highlighter to others that cheap pattern parts not so wise

 

[Ian B Walker]

Another tip is to run a tap down the threads before placing the head. You will be surprised at the gunk that comes out of the holes.