80mph speed limits, Pah

[grober]

Sorry for just quoting you, but this one really tickled me....

Correct me if I am wrong, but did a Mr Salmond not promise this as part of his election campaign.

It's had some improvements, but not the DCW which the main route to Inverness and the North Highlands deserve. This much discussed upgrade has not happened, have you driven on the A9 recently, south of Inverness, I have, the surface is diabolical.

It's supposedly been brought forward. estimated £3 billion cost 80 miles to be "dualled"





BBC News - A9 Inverness to Perth carriageway upgrade to start early

 

[gIzzE]

Damon Hill has a different take on the 80 mph speed limit. He knows a thing or two about driving.

PistonHeads Headlines - Damon Hill against 80mph speed limit

No he doesn't, he drives and A3 diesel FFS!

 

[Dryce]

It's supposedly been brought forward. estimated £3 billion cost 80 miles to be "dualled"

Waste of money. Long thin route to a very small city (by UK standards) and some peripheral communities.

A better value solution would be to maintain the road that's there already a whole lot better, build a few extra crawler/overtaking lanes (though the numpties on the road don't seem to know how to use them), police it more but also designate it as being a route where HGVs can go up to 56 mph.

Put the rest of the 3 billion towards upgrading the A1.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

Sadly you also theorised that the forum is better than average. Sadly I'm on the forum. I know some of my limitations and that average isn't looking good while I'm around.

Which raises a whole new question: should drivers who class themselves as having "below average" capabilities be banned from our roads? One has to ask why they've done nothing about it and why they continue to risk their lives and the lives of other road users by remaining at the wheel.

Since passing my driving test I've studied high-speed driving skills at Hendon Police College, had lessons on a skid pan, took a week's course in ambulance driving (highly recommended for a whole range of skills), driven a range of cars under instruction at Thruxton culminating in a few laps in a Formula Ford where I gained the highest marks of the day, and experienced driving in dozens of countries around the world. My experience has helped me to become a better driver, certainly better than those who think of a car as no more than a means of getting from A to B. I'm certainly not the best, but I'm experienced and qualified enough to be better than average. I don't want to be average when I have control of a killer machine.

Now although I've never attempted it, I'm reasonably confident that I'd be worse than average at performing heart surgery, therefore I don't! And similarly, the day that I feel that I'm no longer even an average driver I will give up.

 

[@MARK]

Which raises a whole new question: should drivers who class themselves as having "below average" capabilities be banned from our roads?

Far from it.

If somebody recognises that they are not the worlds greatest driver, then they are going to think twice before doing something genuinely stupid.

Its the drivers who THINK they are in the top 1% but who are actually rubbish that are the dangerous ones surely?

 

[Deleted member 65149]

If somebody recognises that they are not the worlds greatest driver, then they are going to think twice before doing something genuinely stupid.

Oh that that were true. Of course there's a big gap between "the world's greatest driver" and "the average driver" - a gap that I believe we should all be aiming for. It's the "below average" drivers (including but not limited to the self-confessed) who worry me. Waiting for the road to clear as far as the eye can see in either direction before pulling out from a junction is annoying, seemingly incapable of operating their indicators is tending towards dangerous, blinkered concentration on the road in front with no appreciation of other traffic is suicidal.

Its the drivers who THINK they are in the top 1% but who are actually rubbish that are the dangerous ones surely?

Absolutely. Well almost. I would put them in a class of "most dangerous". There's still the majority who think that they're average, so they also think they can relax when driving, and that's when they become dangerous too. We're all potentially dangerous - a thought that has to be uppermost at all times behind the wheel. We can't eliminate danger, just work towards minimising it.

 

[ss201]

No he doesn't, he drives and A3 diesel FFS!

He does now, but I'd still put money on him being quicker around a race track in that than you in your W211 E320cdi: Brabus-tuned or not!

 

[Dryce]

Now although I've never attempted it, I'm reasonably confident that I'd be worse than average at performing heart surgery, therefore I don't! And similarly, the day that I feel that I'm no longer even an average driver I will give up.

I find that the best people at doing a job are often not the best in terms of skills but the ones who have the best measure of their own skills and capabilities and work within them.

The great philosopher Harry Callahan once stated that a man has got to know his limitations.

I know I have to work quite hard at driving. I don't like speaking with people while driving - don't like handsfree calls - plan ahead and pace myslf - and try and make sure I work within my capabilities.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

I know I have to work quite hard at driving. I don't like speaking with people while driving - don't like handsfree calls - plan ahead and pace myslf - and try and make sure I work within my capabilities.

Sounds to me like the qualities of a good driver

 

[WillDeBeest]

Now although I've never attempted it, I'm reasonably confident that I'd be worse than average at performing heart surgery...

Funnily enough, I think KE and I might both be above average at performing heart surgery, especially if we consider the modal or median average of the population as a whole. Even the mean competence will be dragged down by the vast numbers with no clue at all while we muddle through with some basic problem-solving intelligence and a bit of mechanical sympathy. That doesn't mean either of us should actually do it, of course.

 

[finisterre]

Far from it.

If somebody recognises that they are not the worlds greatest driver, then they are going to think twice before doing something genuinely stupid.

Its the drivers who THINK they are in the top 1% but who are actually rubbish that are the dangerous ones surely?

It is a recognised bias

Dunning

 

[219]

80mph is ok at certain times of the day in certain conditions, anything above that is not viable on UK roads which are not designed for the purpose.

Hmmm , I seem to remember reading somewhere in the dark , distant past when I did my advanced training that the design speed for UK motorways ( as in bend radii etc ) was 130 mph .

Back in those halcyon days before high tech enforcement it was not difficult to maintain such speeds in safety - as long as car , driver , road , traffic and weather conditions were suitable .

Police training can regularly see speeds well in excess of 100 mph attained on A roads , never mind motorways .

As per Roadcraft - speed is not in itself dangerous ; danger only arises when speed inappropriate to the circumstances arises . That can just as easily mean 20 mph is an unsafe speed if going down a pedestrianised road or on an icy surface - driving is a dynamic activity and so must be your risk assessment .

 

[219]

To believe that your MB is safe at 100mph should you have a blow out is at best a little deluded (and I mean no offence whatsoever).

If an MB has a 4.3 litre engine, is it inherently safe at 120. Of course not...in a crash at that speed it will fall a part as much as any car...especially if its 13 years old.

I had a blow out at circa 120 mph in my W114 280E back in the early 1980's , slowed and stopped to change the wheel without any fuss or drama . The car was very stable . Turned out I had driven over a bolt which had not only punctured the tyre but also punched a hole in the alloy wheel where it remained !

Mercedes-Benz have always been very safe cars : partly due to active safety which reduces the chances of being involved in a crash in the first place ( good ergonomics which reduce fatigue and make the car easy to control , good visibility , handling , responsive engines , good brakes etc ) then passive safety ( seatbelts , crumple zones , safety cell etc ) . Many other drivers besides myself can attest to the structural integrity of a Mercedes-Benz and feel that we owe our lives to it ; after the head-on crash I had when I encountered a car overtaking around a blind bend , coming towards me with a closing speed close to 100 mph ( I had been doing 60 on the A road before sighting him and hitting the brakes ) both cars were written off with the other driver's Capri folding up like a pack of cards , from which he had to be cut out by the fire brigade and taken to hospital with three broken limbs and broken ribs ; I was able to open the door of my 12 year old W115 220/8 ( despite the crumple zone being halved in length ) and stepped out unhurt apart from an irritation to my eye from a piece of glass ( no laminated windscreens in those days , just toughened glass ) . I know several people who have survived bad crashes in Mercs .

 

[allegoricus]

What's more 'dangerous' out of these two;

Driving 30mph under the NSL on a motorway.

Or

Driving 30mph over the NSL on a motorway.

It'd be interesting to hear people's views.

Which lane? ;-)

I once encountered a stationary car in the third lane of the M6.

 

[BTB 500]

I once encountered a stationary car in the third lane of the M6.

I was once in a stationary car in the 3rd lane of the M1 (brand new company car, engine just died without any warning), and bloody scary it was too!

 

[st4]

I was once in a stationary car in the 3rd lane of the M1 (brand new company car, engine just died without any warning), and bloody scary it was too!

Did you not have enough momentum to get onto the hard shoulder?

 

[Deleted member 65149]

As per Roadcraft - speed is not in itself dangerous ; danger only arises when speed inappropriate to the circumstances arises . That can just as easily mean 20 mph is an unsafe speed if going down a pedestrianised road or on an icy surface - driving is a dynamic activity and so must be your risk assessment .

ABSOLUTELY. Unfortunately roadcraft is rarely taught to learners, who are instead only instructed on how to pass the driving test. My impression is that well over half the driving population appear unable to retain even those basic skills and certainly never learn and apply roadcraft.

 

[Apukgroup]

just to throw my 50 pence in, go drive in France, there motorway discipline is superb. A little daunting at first but it was best place I have driven on motorways. They get in immediately and they pull out just as quick.

The speed however is constant and this is the key. They are sneaky cheese eating surrender monkeys and the speed cameras could be anywhere at any time and people drive with that in mind. This keeps everyone in check and driving there was a pleasure! As soon as i got back to the uk my blood pressure was up and the swearing was in full flow!

I think 80mph is a great idea. But it has to be policed very differently to how our roads are now.

Hi mate. Are you interested in selling your plate ?

 

[92Adam]

I consider myself a very average driver but do drive a wagon for a living…Thus qualify as a professional driver…
In all my years 30+ years of motorway driving car/lorry I very rarely touch the brakes due to the fact I keep my distance & observe the road well ahead…Occasionally I may go over the speed limit slightly but even then rarely do I need to touch the brakes…
So much so back in about 2001 I drove to Leicester from mid Bedfordshire in almost an hour despite not touching the brakes as my wife had broken down late Sunday evening coming back from her mothers in Nottingham…She had the kids with her & had broken down on the M1 & was told by the AA it could be 4hrs before a patrol could get to her…Hence of I went…

It’s more about driving to the conditions with a combo of defensive driving thrown in the mix…

Absolute pet hate is drivers who sit up your backside & once they pass you slow down again…

What’s that about??

I can still drive 130mph plus in Europe without touching the anchors but I do feel clearly you drive according to the conditions…

 

[TC350]

I consider myself a very average driver but do drive a wagon for a living…Thus qualify as a professional driver…
In all my years 30+ years of motorway driving car/lorry I very rarely touch the brakes due to the fact I keep my distance & observe the road well ahead…Occasionally I may go over the speed limit slightly but even then rarely do I need to touch the brakes…
So much so back in about 2001 I drove to Leicester from mid Bedfordshire in almost an hour despite not touching the brakes as my wife had broken down late Sunday evening coming back from her mothers in Nottingham…She had the kids with her & had broken down on the M1 & was told by the AA it could be 4hrs before a patrol could get to her…Hence of I went…

It’s more about driving to the conditions with a combo of defensive driving thrown in the mix…

Absolute pet hate is drivers who sit up your backside & once they pass you slow down again…

What’s that about??

I can still drive 130mph plus in Europe without touching the anchors but I do feel clearly you drive according to the conditions…

I’m totally with you on observation and thinking ahead resulting in very little need for braking.

But it took me several years to cotton on that other drivers are far less observant. A few shunts up the bum persuaded me to do a bit more light braking; just enough to illuminate my brake lights to alert following drivers.

What I’ve yet to discover is where in my boot the super strong magnet is located. It still attracts far too many vehicles.