AC not working

[E55BOF]

I wouldn't recharge an empty system but will top up a low one .

And that is precisely my point too.

 

[Pontoneer]

Most places offering A/C regassing for that car are offering it for between £60 to £70.

How is that more expensive?

Plus, no need for the derogatory comments, the machines may be automated but the companies providing do stand by their service via guarantee and the OP clearly is no expert in this area.

Last time I bought a bottle of R134a it was about half that price , after deducting the deposit from my old bottle ( £10 ) and my Halfords Trade Card discount .

I find most garages you'd be as well handing your car over to trained monkeys , so many bodge jobs have I seen down the years . The only place I would 100% trust with my cars are Merparts , otherwise I DIY so I know the job has been done right .

 

[DSM10000]

Halfords auto centre still charged me when I booked an ac service along with a new set of tyres for my SL . Told me the condenser was holed and wanted £££ to repair , scoffed when I declined , saying it was a convertible after all and ac is just a nice to have , not an essential , as I always have the roof down when it is warm . I didn't argue the toss over the bill as I'd paid in advance and they still ran the test on it .

After that , I just bought the kit to do the job myself , and the gauge indicates the state of charge of the system , I wouldn't recharge an empty system but will top up a low one .

The gauge cannot measure the high pressure and low pressure sides when the system is running so you cannot be sure that the interns valves are opening correctly.

I was in a local Tyre garage recently getting tracking checked, a customer had brought her car in for a regas, the machine had found a fault with the A/C system twice and the Technician was calling the customer to tell her it needed further investigation but she wasn't being charged and that they had already refunded her.

 

[ALFAitalia]

Its a pretty idiot proof procedure....the machines are pretty much fully automated after you choose the correct car. I've used Halfords twice....once on my Jeep and one on the A Class....came out with ice cold AC and no issues both times. Most places use the same equipment no matter what they charge.

 

[DSM10000]

Last time I bought a bottle of R134a it was about half that price , after deducting the deposit from my old bottle ( £10 ) and my Halfords Trade Card discount .

I find most garages you'd be as well handing your car over to trained monkeys , so many bodge jobs have I seen down the years . The only place I would 100% trust with my cars are Merparts , otherwise I DIY so I know the job has been done right .

A/C gas prices have doubled in the past couple of years.

There are good and bad technicians and mechanics in all types of vehicle repair shops.

 

[Pontoneer]

The gauge cannot measure the high pressure and low pressure sides when the system is running so you cannot be sure that the interns valves are opening correctly.

I was in a local Tyre garage recently getting tracking checked, a customer had brought her car in for a regas, the machine had found a fault with the A/C system twice and the Technician was calling the customer to tell her it needed further investigation but she wasn't being charged and that they had already refunded her.

By operating the system and finding that it works as expected I can reasonably deduce that it is working correctly ; the gauge I know just gives an indication of the charge in the system and if it is showing low , then I generally add a can of lubricant then a top up until the gauge shows green ; if the system then works happily for a year , all is well .

 

[DSM10000]

By operating the system and finding that it works as expected I can reasonably deduce that it is working correctly ; the gauge I know just gives an indication of the charge in the system and if it is showing low , then I generally add a can of lubricant then a top up until the gauge shows green ; if the system then works happily for a year , all is well .

I can see how, if you have a good mechanical knowledge of how the systems work (and you clearly do) then this pragmatic approach would work well for you.

Unfortunately the OP is not in possession of such knowledge and experience.

 

[Pontoneer]

A/C gas prices have doubled in the past couple of years.

There are good and bad technicians and mechanics in all types of vehicle repair shops.

R134a retails now at about £70 a bottle ( including the deposit ) ; when I last bought one for my W140 , more than two years ago , it retailed at around £50 , again including the deposit . Because I was returning an empty bottle , and using my trade card , I think I paid around £30 last time . My current W124 does not have ac , hence I haven't needed to buy gas in the two years I've had it .

My experience of just about all garages is that almost all of them bodge jobs to a greater or lesser extent ; hence I distrust most of them .

 

[E55BOF]

If you cant be bothered to read this scientific paper on the subject then one of the summary points is...The relative annual leakage rate is the percentage of the measured difference against the norm charge, which is annualised in the same way as above. It is found to be 6.9% per year."

I've always thought that (without the numbers, of course); that confirms it. I note also that it states:

"However, it also seemed that the more the air conditioner is operated the higher the leakage rate, as the leakage rate of airconditioners measured in Portugal (54.0 grams or 7.5% per year) were higher than in Germany (48.7 grams or 6.2% per annum). All in all the differences were fairly small."

That goes completely against the accepted wisdom of 'use it or lose it'; you're going to lose it come what may...

Got some more info from my MB dealer

A/C pressure when A/c not on - 0 - 4 bar low pressure, 0 - 6 bar high pressure

A/C on - 0 - 2 bar low pressure, 10 - 15 bar high pressure.

As I told you; 13-14 bar, running, high side.

The gauge cannot measure the high pressure and low pressure sides when the system is running so you cannot be sure that the interns valves are opening correctly.

That's where the iCarsoft (or other code reader) comes in, but years of experience indicate that when it's blowing reasonably cold when set to Low and full fan, it's not overfilled, which is the main worry.

 

[Pontoneer]

I've always thought that (without the numbers, of course); that confirms it. I note also that it states:

"However, it also seemed that the more the air conditioner is operated the higher the leakage rate, as the leakage rate of airconditioners measured in Portugal (54.0 grams or 7.5% per year) were higher than in Germany (48.7 grams or 6.2% per annum). All in all the differences were fairly small."

That goes completely against the accepted wisdom of 'use it or lose it'; you're going to lose it come what may...


As I told you; 13-14 bar, running, high side.


That's where the iCarsoft (or other code reader) comes in, but years of experience indicate that when it's blowing reasonably cold when set to Low and full fan, it's not overfilled, which is the main worry.

That , and iCarsoft only works on more recent cars with OBD ports , and not the likes of my W124 , W140 , R129s which don't have that connectivity , although I can use my trusty AVO 8 to count kicks of the needle from relevant pins on the diagnostic port ( because I can't be bothered to make a blink code reader ! ) .

 

[E55BOF]

I tried making a blink code reader for my R129; it never worked properly.

 

[alabbasi]

If you cant be bothered to read this scientific paper on the subject then one of the summery points is...

Yeah and it was scientists in the FDA who suggested the acceptable amount of rat poop in human food. I get tired explaining what should be the obvious. I have similar discussions with people on this side of the pond who keep posting scientific papers to explain away why its OK to use propane as an automotive refrigerant.

I read the summary on the link you just posted and have already determined that it's nonsense. A one year study to determine the average annual leak rate of cars up to 7 years old with a huge distribution which they determine have no damage from a visual inspection?

Please use your common sense and think about the types of pressures that are held within an air conditioning system and how it cannot be anything but a sealed system. You know better than to drive around on a tire with a slow puncture and they're only inflated to 35psi.

 

[alabbasi]

I tried making a blink code reader for my R129; it never worked properly.

It works better if you blink

 

[E55BOF]

Yeah and it was scientists in the FDA who suggested the acceptable amount of rat poop in human food. I get tired explaining what should be the obvious. I have similar discussions with people on this side of the pond who keep posting scientific papers to explain away why its OK to use propane as an automotive refrigerant.

I read the summary on the link you just posted and have already determined that it's nonsense. A one year study to determine the average annual leak rate of cars up to 7 years old with a huge distribution which they determine have no damage from a visual inspection?

Please use your common sense and think about the types of pressures that are held within an air conditioning system and how it cannot be anything but a sealed system. You know better than to drive around on a tire with a slow puncture and they're only inflated to 35psi.

I've been doing top-ups since the R5 days, and my experience suggests you're wrong. Aircon is indeed a sealed system, but I believe that as seals age they become slightly less efficient, and leak a little. Let's agree to differ, shall we?

 

[DSM10000]

R134a retails now at about £70 a bottle ( including the deposit ) ; when I last bought one for my W140 , more than two years ago , it retailed at around £50 , again including the deposit . Because I was returning an empty bottle , and using my trade card , I think I paid around £30 last time . My current W124 does not have ac , hence I haven't needed to buy gas in the two years I've had it .

My experience of just about all garages is that almost all of them bodge jobs to a greater or lesser extent ; hence I distrust most of them .

I believe raw material costs have started to ease again.

I have have seen £89 quoted locally for refilling with the r1234yf refrigerant.

 

[Pontoneer]

I plan to get another R129 when I retire - I loved that car !

 

[E55BOF]

I am retired, but I don't, because I didn't. The R171, though....

 

[Pontoneer]

I would be retired but am waiting to see what my son wants to do after school , talking about going to Uni , so I will continue to work for now , besides he will be wanting a car when he turns 17 next year , and that will no doubt be funded by the bank of dad . Mind you he currently wants a go-kart , and a decent one will cost as much as a used car , but he is doing well at our local circuit where he is only 1.5S behind Coulthard's record time there ...

 

[alabbasi]

Aircon is indeed a sealed system, but I believe that as seals age they become slightly less efficient, and leak a little. Let's agree to differ, shall we?

Then we're not disagreeing. Everything made of rubber ages and fails over time and should be replaced when appropriate. Going back to the OP's OP. He had the car 12 years where his a/c was functioning normally and now it's not working. That sounds like a significant leak. I used to be able to buy R134a for $99/jug 4 years ago. It's now closer to $400/jug. At some point. it will be cheaper to fix the leak.

 

[E55BOF]

It could be a significant leak; it could just be that the slow seepage out has just passed the point where the system won't play any more when asked. A simple yes/no pressure check should show which it is.