BenzedUP
MB Enthusiast
Red C220 said:
A real petrol head puts cars in front of anything, lol
A real petrol head puts cars in front of anything, lol
OP
OP
Palmball
MB Enthusiast
Yep, that's my approach to life. I'll never be rich, but I like to think I have fun.
I get some stick for swapping cars so often but I just like the experience of trying different ones. I guess theres other ways I could do that, like joining a supercar club, but it doesn't stack up....they're more expensive than the depreciation (assuming in buys and sells carefully) and you get hardly any time for your money. It's not like I even get bored of the cars I do have - sometimes I go back to the same one (currently on our second E63 after briefly flirting with the GLE Coupe).
One just has to be a bit more careful when playing around at higher values as small percentages of depreciation end up big dollars!
Red C220
MB Enthusiast
I think you've already answered your own question. You're comfortable with this route even if there is a risk attached.
I always had a list of cars I'd buy if I had the money. I found when the money arrived I couldnt actually deal with the depreciation mentally despite being able to afford it which was something I'd never considered before it became a reality. You can deal with it so go for it.
My business partners depreciation threshold we've discovered is even lower than mine!
I always had a list of cars I'd buy if I had the money. I found when the money arrived I couldnt actually deal with the depreciation mentally despite being able to afford it which was something I'd never considered before it became a reality. You can deal with it so go for it.
My business partners depreciation threshold we've discovered is even lower than mine!
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stumpy1
MB Enthusiast
Of the higher mileage FFs I have seen I have been surprised at the seat bolster wear. (25k miles). There is also one on the ramps at Lovetts sans engine. The most important word when it comes to these is 'warranty'. Your test drive will be very interesting. You may find it a bit dull bimbling about but as soon as you up the pace I will be amazed if you aren't smitten. Not much space in the back though and access is awkward so think of it like a luxurious 911.
Red C220
MB Enthusiast
Chris Harris sold his FF after 4 months due to depreciation fears and the fact it was so much fun.
Ferrari FF: PH Fleet | PistonHeads
I still couldn't find a summary of cost over 4 months though, he put down £45K and paid £1500 a month on finance. What we don't know is how much of the £45k he got back.
Ferrari FF: PH Fleet | PistonHeads
I still couldn't find a summary of cost over 4 months though, he put down £45K and paid £1500 a month on finance. What we don't know is how much of the £45k he got back.
D
Deleted member 113659
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OP
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So, update on my shenanigans this weekend. I went to try an FF, and as I drive the dealers demonstrator rather than the one I was looking to buy, I suspect it was a lot better than the (much older) one I was looking at.
I was impressed, certainly enough to let my heart rule my head and pay a deposit on a car. However, after more consideration (a lot more than I normally give to such things) and getting back into my car, I've changed my mind Whoops!
Firstly, I just cannot subscribe to the notion that the FF would make my car feel like a roller skate, or in any way inferior. It didn't, and if anything it highlighted just how good the AMG GT is, and how overpriced a new FF is!
Here's my thoughts on the car:
First thing's first, I was a little underwhelmed because the combination of a nervous salesman and traffic meant I only got to properly rev it twice in an hour's test drive. Also, I spent the hour trying to get used to the ergonomics....it's a challenge getting used to fixed paddles (when you're used to them moving) and no indicator stalks! I just couldn't really relax and get into it, but still, some underlying qualities still shone through.
The first thing that stood out was the sound. The lack of it
Outside the car it's a glorious wail. Very different to anything else I've driven, a typical Ferrari sound I guess. But inside, up to about 3k rpm it's fairly quiet - the car is VERY refined - but it does improve as revs rise. By the time it's shooting through 7-8k it's like an F1 car, but as I said, I only got to do this a couple of times.
Secondly, the ride quality. This was really unexpected but I thought it was one of the best riding cars I've ever experienced. Again, I can't see this as anything other than good, almost miraculous given how flat and sharp it drove. Very impressive, and I suspect due to the long wheelbase and what I imagine is fairly sophisticated suspension.
Steering. Simply AMAZING. Ferrari's seem to have a good rep for steering and I can see why. I really like my GT's very direct rack (although it's not to everyones taste) and the FF's was similarly direct but a touch heavier. The steering wheel is also fan-bloody-tastic....tiny little thing, nice and thick and with lots of ridges and bumps in the right places. It's an odd shape though.
Performance was hard to judge and despite being 150bhp up on the GT it really didn't feel like it in day to day driving. I guess because it only has about 20b/ft more torque and delivered much higher up so it needs working harder, which I didn't really get to do. On the couple of times I did use the full rev range I'd say it felt like it had very long legs (the car just keeps pulling) but faster than my GT or any other 5-600bhp car I've had? No.
The driving position is definitely different to what I'm used to though - the steering wheel is further away with my legs in a more bent position but this is mitigated by a steering wheel which comes out absolutely vertical so you get a consistent reach all round it. The seats are comfortable, but with way less side support than my GT....they'd be great on a long journey though.
Build quality?!?! Whilst the demo had NO rattles or unwanted noises and the material quality is phenomenal, it didn't feel any better than a top end German car and I'd say something like an S Coupe is way ahead. I got back in my car and it didn't feel in any way inferior.
Things I didn't like were fairly predictable - the sat nav is touch screen and utterly dire. Awful. And I'm sure it'll be worse on the 2012 example I'm looking at too. Then I'm back to the driving position - I'm only a size 8 but my foot kept hitting the underside of the dash (I later realised it was the position of the OBD port which is right in front of the brake pedal). It's also way off the mark compared to what I'm used to for technology.
So yes, it did have some fairly impressive qualities, despite the limitations of the test drive. As it should be for a £300k+ car (the spec on the one I was looking at was outrageous), but it definitely doesn't feel that kind of value if I was to judge it as 2-3x 'better' than other cars I've had. I guess I'm well into the territory of diminishing returns though, so whilst it was undeniably a special piece of kit with some aspects that are better than my GT (sound, ride quality and steering are all stand-out items), there are plenty of other areas where it's so far off the mark that I actually preferred it when I get back in my AMG.
Ultimately though, there were a couple of other nails in the coffin. Firstly there's the mileage I'll do - if I whack another 10k in the next 6-8 months then I'll have a 35k mile V12 Ferrari, which I suspect won't be the easiest thing to move on. Secondly, as I am merely a wage slave, an employee, and not the owner of a business, it's not a car one can use everyday so I'd end up getting annoyed at having to find way round NOT using it.
It's clearly a car one buys for a certain experience, for the brand and image. It's definitely not a car one buys because it is better than other much cheaper options. Dare I say it was a bit superficial
Maybe some will think that I just don't 'get it' (and maybe I don't) but quite frankly, after much consideration, I'll stick with my AMG thanks!
I was impressed, certainly enough to let my heart rule my head and pay a deposit on a car. However, after more consideration (a lot more than I normally give to such things) and getting back into my car, I've changed my mind
Whoops!Firstly, I just cannot subscribe to the notion that the FF would make my car feel like a roller skate, or in any way inferior. It didn't, and if anything it highlighted just how good the AMG GT is, and how overpriced a new FF is!
Here's my thoughts on the car:
First thing's first, I was a little underwhelmed because the combination of a nervous salesman and traffic meant I only got to properly rev it twice in an hour's test drive. Also, I spent the hour trying to get used to the ergonomics....it's a challenge getting used to fixed paddles (when you're used to them moving) and no indicator stalks! I just couldn't really relax and get into it, but still, some underlying qualities still shone through.
The first thing that stood out was the sound. The lack of it
Outside the car it's a glorious wail. Very different to anything else I've driven, a typical Ferrari sound I guess. But inside, up to about 3k rpm it's fairly quiet - the car is VERY refined - but it does improve as revs rise. By the time it's shooting through 7-8k it's like an F1 car, but as I said, I only got to do this a couple of times.Secondly, the ride quality. This was really unexpected but I thought it was one of the best riding cars I've ever experienced. Again, I can't see this as anything other than good, almost miraculous given how flat and sharp it drove. Very impressive, and I suspect due to the long wheelbase and what I imagine is fairly sophisticated suspension.
Steering. Simply AMAZING. Ferrari's seem to have a good rep for steering and I can see why. I really like my GT's very direct rack (although it's not to everyones taste) and the FF's was similarly direct but a touch heavier. The steering wheel is also fan-bloody-tastic....tiny little thing, nice and thick and with lots of ridges and bumps in the right places. It's an odd shape though.
Performance was hard to judge and despite being 150bhp up on the GT it really didn't feel like it in day to day driving. I guess because it only has about 20b/ft more torque and delivered much higher up so it needs working harder, which I didn't really get to do. On the couple of times I did use the full rev range I'd say it felt like it had very long legs (the car just keeps pulling) but faster than my GT or any other 5-600bhp car I've had? No.
The driving position is definitely different to what I'm used to though - the steering wheel is further away with my legs in a more bent position but this is mitigated by a steering wheel which comes out absolutely vertical so you get a consistent reach all round it. The seats are comfortable, but with way less side support than my GT....they'd be great on a long journey though.
Build quality?!?! Whilst the demo had NO rattles or unwanted noises and the material quality is phenomenal, it didn't feel any better than a top end German car and I'd say something like an S Coupe is way ahead. I got back in my car and it didn't feel in any way inferior.
Things I didn't like were fairly predictable - the sat nav is touch screen and utterly dire. Awful. And I'm sure it'll be worse on the 2012 example I'm looking at too. Then I'm back to the driving position - I'm only a size 8 but my foot kept hitting the underside of the dash (I later realised it was the position of the OBD port which is right in front of the brake pedal). It's also way off the mark compared to what I'm used to for technology.
So yes, it did have some fairly impressive qualities, despite the limitations of the test drive. As it should be for a £300k+ car (the spec on the one I was looking at was outrageous), but it definitely doesn't feel that kind of value if I was to judge it as 2-3x 'better' than other cars I've had. I guess I'm well into the territory of diminishing returns though, so whilst it was undeniably a special piece of kit with some aspects that are better than my GT (sound, ride quality and steering are all stand-out items), there are plenty of other areas where it's so far off the mark that I actually preferred it when I get back in my AMG.
Ultimately though, there were a couple of other nails in the coffin. Firstly there's the mileage I'll do - if I whack another 10k in the next 6-8 months then I'll have a 35k mile V12 Ferrari, which I suspect won't be the easiest thing to move on. Secondly, as I am merely a wage slave, an employee, and not the owner of a business, it's not a car one can use everyday so I'd end up getting annoyed at having to find way round NOT using it.
It's clearly a car one buys for a certain experience, for the brand and image. It's definitely not a car one buys because it is better than other much cheaper options. Dare I say it was a bit superficial
Maybe some will think that I just don't 'get it' (and maybe I don't) but quite frankly, after much consideration, I'll stick with my AMG thanks!
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Red C220
MB Enthusiast
Quite honestly, at £300K new or £160K used you're stepping into the more money than you can count league. Or possibly more money than sense.
You're right about it being the law of diminishing returns.
You're right about it being the law of diminishing returns.
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Andrew.
We looked at a 458 recently. After getting up close with it, driving it I left underwhelmed. Now I know it's not an FF but it did not do it for me. It felt brittle. A 991 is much more appealing to me as it has that quality level like your GT.
We looked at a 458 recently. After getting up close with it, driving it I left underwhelmed. Now I know it's not an FF but it did not do it for me. It felt brittle. A 991 is much more appealing to me as it has that quality level like your GT.
stumpy1
MB Enthusiast
I agree with pretty much everything Andrew said. When testing cars like this you need to borrow them for the weekend so that you don't have a salesman next to you to worry about. The FF is very quiet inside which is great for refinement but it would be nice if you could hear more of the engine more of the time. Although less mileage sensitive than other Ferraris the FF is colour sensitive and dark, sober colours are in most demand. You certainly need deep pockets to own one of these. Did you get any finance figures?
D
Deleted member 113659
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Just curious Andrew but why is it that you couldn't test drive the actual car? Is it located elsewhere in the UK?
Even if it is I thought it was customary for dealers to transport the car for a test drive. Or am I living in cloud cuckoo land?
AND size 8 feet??? Are you an elf?
I'm pleased you've decided to keep the GT. It'll keep us all glued to the site for at least another few days until you spot another buy.
Ant.
Even if it is I thought it was customary for dealers to transport the car for a test drive. Or am I living in cloud cuckoo land?
AND size 8 feet??? Are you an elf?
I'm pleased you've decided to keep the GT. It'll keep us all glued to the site for at least another few days until you spot another buy.
Ant.
truth is, it's impossible to 'justify' the cost of a new(ish) Ferrari ..
bit like buying Bang & Olufsen TV
bit like buying Bang & Olufsen TV
Andrew, I think you have made a wise decision there as it sounds like the negatives would out weigh the positives for you and it would cost a whole lot more to get the FF
Hi,
I think it's really funny that test drive lengths are inversely proportional to car price!
Vauxhall will happily loan you a Vectra for a long weekend - but it is often hard to get a drive longer than an hour in an expensive, supercar!
Luckily, in this part of the world - you can normally test a good range of more expensive cars because they are so common here.
If you have a UAE driving license, you are automatically covered to drive somebody else's car - providing they have it insured. You can't renew the cars annual license without insurance.
People here are also more relaxed about letting people drive their cars - I got talking to a local guy in a car park a few weeks back and he immediately let me drive his highly modified (one month old!!) E63S.
Cheers
Steve
I think it's really funny that test drive lengths are inversely proportional to car price!
Vauxhall will happily loan you a Vectra for a long weekend - but it is often hard to get a drive longer than an hour in an expensive, supercar!
Luckily, in this part of the world - you can normally test a good range of more expensive cars because they are so common here.
If you have a UAE driving license, you are automatically covered to drive somebody else's car - providing they have it insured. You can't renew the cars annual license without insurance.
People here are also more relaxed about letting people drive their cars - I got talking to a local guy in a car park a few weeks back and he immediately let me drive his highly modified (one month old!!) E63S.
Cheers
Steve
R8V10German
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The GT looks good indeed Andrew. I'm normally not a fan of red cars, but Rudolph here looks really cool, inside and out.
Annoying about the suspension being so stiff - I hope I don't make the same mistake myself, going for an R8 with sports suspension. But the current one with magnetic ride annoys me too as the dampers fail about every 12 months, and at 1K a pop that's not fun.
Enjoy driving the GT! And seriously, the Fiat is not a real alternative.
Annoying about the suspension being so stiff - I hope I don't make the same mistake myself, going for an R8 with sports suspension. But the current one with magnetic ride annoys me too as the dampers fail about every 12 months, and at 1K a pop that's not fun.
Enjoy driving the GT! And seriously, the Fiat is not a real alternative.
a111r
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Popped into MB Lakeside today to see their yellow GTS.
Tangible 'Orange peel' on the rear flanks. Hmm...
Tangible 'Orange peel' on the rear flanks. Hmm...
Have you tried a McLaren 650S? Admittedly I've not driven many cars in this segment, but of the ones I have, nothing comes close to giving you super levels of ride comfort when you need it, and then huge amounts of grip and stability when you don't. Also, the braking ability is immense.
Year old 650's are now into your FF price range and in relative terms appear to hold their price with the competition. Alternatively, snapping up one of next years 675LT spiders, while you still can, would let you run it for a year with minimal loss as limited numbers mean used 675's are in demand.
cheers, Steve
Year old 650's are now into your FF price range and in relative terms appear to hold their price with the competition. Alternatively, snapping up one of next years 675LT spiders, while you still can, would let you run it for a year with minimal loss as limited numbers mean used 675's are in demand.
cheers, Steve
it's a £10,695 option
