Anti-McLaren / Pro Ferrari strip Lewis of win
verytalldave
MB Enthusiast
"Schumacher totally disagreed and said that under the rules you have to let the car re pass you and get at least one car length in front before you can start to over take it again,"
Where does it say that in the rules?..if it does then we all now know and the decision of the stewards is correct....but if not then its just another Ferrari biased opinion and lends more weight to our thoughts on that subject
Cant see that in the rules............
http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-publi.../$FILE/F1.SPORTING.REGULATIONS.19-05-2008.pdf
miro
MB Enthusiast
"Schumacher totally disagreed and said that under the rules you have to let the car re pass you and get at least one car length in front before you can start to over take it again,"
Where does it say that in the rules?..if it does then we all now know and the decision of the stewards is correct....but if not then its just another Ferrari biased opinion and lends more weight to our thoughts on that subject
The Ferrari is longer than the MacLaren anyhow .. so which car length ? The whole idea of polite distance is some kind of red-herring. Behind is behind. There is no real measure of this distance as LH could say he conceded his own car length to hand back the advantage. That is just as much a car length as letting some float away on their Ferrari pontoon only to speed-boat past them.
Did anyone happen to mention that Kimi rammed the back of the MacLaren in the apex out of the straight ?
Leemc2008
Active Member
In doing so broke his front wing which was rubbing against the tire constantly until he dropped it and smashed into the barrier destroying everything.
recycled
MB Enthusiast
to be honest trulli has a point. lewis had time to lift and just follow kimi. i had no doubt he would have caught him anyway within the next lap.
If there was a wall lewis would not have done it. still do not agree with the stewards though
If there was a wall lewis would not have done it. still do not agree with the stewards though
As far as I can tell from the footage, Lewis was in front of Kimi, then he was alongside, then he was behind and then he overtook Kimi on the other side....he actually went behind the Ferarri! Don't they see that?
On anyother day, the Ferarri should have been able to out accelerate the Mclaren and there would have been no way that Lewis would have been able to overtake in the manner in which he did....its only Kimi pussyfooting in the Ferarri that made this possible.
In my opinion, Shumacher's quote a red herring....I doubt if it says anywhere how far ahead you have to let the car in front have an advantage. Anyway, Lewis was on Kimi's tail going into the corner...
On anyother day, the Ferarri should have been able to out accelerate the Mclaren and there would have been no way that Lewis would have been able to overtake in the manner in which he did....its only Kimi pussyfooting in the Ferarri that made this possible.
In my opinion, Shumacher's quote a red herring....I doubt if it says anywhere how far ahead you have to let the car in front have an advantage. Anyway, Lewis was on Kimi's tail going into the corner...
Peterdon
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What is the definition (if any) of a car length ahead.
In rowing you are a length ahead if your stern is just ahead of the following bow, not if there is a boat length of space between stern and following bow (that's two lengths).
In rowing you are a length ahead if your stern is just ahead of the following bow, not if there is a boat length of space between stern and following bow (that's two lengths).
paulrstaylor
Active Member
looks like there going to appeal for sure!
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70442
and rightly so!
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70443
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70442
and rightly so!
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70443
from http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70443 :- McLaren have revealed that they were told twice by FIA race officials during the Belgian Grand Prix that Lewis Hamilton had given back the race lead to Kimi Raikkonen in an 'okay' manner
What more could Mclaren have done?
What more could Mclaren have done?
paulrstaylor
Active Member
As linked in the post above!
In answer to your question, you would have thought not much........ maybe attach one of these (http://flickr.com/photos/65646217@N00/1368417384) to Hamilton's car and so the Ferrari's (Kimi in particular!) could follow before he stops just before the line to allow them to pass!
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Dryce
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Well one of the stewards speaks.
http://www.planet-f1.com/story/0,18954,3213_4122656,00.html
Doesn't seem to be so strong on justifying his decision as attempting to suggest the criticism is partisan (and presumably therefore unfounded).
http://www.planet-f1.com/story/0,18954,3213_4122656,00.html
Doesn't seem to be so strong on justifying his decision as attempting to suggest the criticism is partisan (and presumably therefore unfounded).
MangoMan
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alls fair in love & war
...... Unless your name is Lewis Hamilton......... It appears!
The Dent Guy
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I just wondered what Ferrari fans were saying about this incident - and saw a derogatory image of presumably Lewis, on the homepage
http://www.thescuderia.net/
Forgive my ignorance - but who's is the face??
Typically, you cant view threads without joining - so i wont be viewing any threads then.
However, there are several unsavory thread titles.
http://www.thescuderia.net/
Forgive my ignorance - but who's is the face??
Typically, you cant view threads without joining - so i wont be viewing any threads then.
However, there are several unsavory thread titles.
flango
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
Better bet than KR but my bet is Alonso & Massa at Ferrari? Although Ross Braun has openly admitted he is chasing Alonso for Honda to partner Button
flango
Hardcore MB Enthusiast
These are the Public view of the general sporting regulations, you cannot view the drivers rules and drivers sporting code unless you hold an FIA Super License or are a Senior management member of a Motorsport team that are involved in F1
In racing terms a car length is defined as the length of the car that you are directly competing against. I cannot comment on if the car length re pass rule applies to F1 as I am not involved in that sport but I can confirm it does apply to BTCC, WTC and Formula BMW and some other single seater series and is certainly very clear in the drivers code, so maybe it does apply to F1 as well?
That seems to be the face of Saddam's information minister during the last Gulf War.
grober
MB Master
In considering this incident and before imposing the penalties, the race stewards should have perhaps asked the following question.
Did this particular incident in which Hamilton was deemed to have "gained an unfair advantage" ----MATERIALLY EFFECT THE FINAL RACE RESULT AND THE DRIVER WINNING ORDER. From all the available evidence pre and post the disputed racing incident the answer is no. The imposition of a 10 grid place penalty in the next race would have been a fairer decision under the circumstances ( if such a penalty was deserved at all
)
This whole post winning driver presentation ceremony protest makes a mockery of the sport. Once the drivers award ceremony has taken place that's it. Any repercussions -thats for the next race.
Formula one is rapidly becoming like the Eurovison song contest.
Hier sind die Stimmen für das McLaren-Team--------- null Punkte
qui sono i voti per la "bella" ferrari squadra ----di dieci punti !!!!!!!!!!!
Did this particular incident in which Hamilton was deemed to have "gained an unfair advantage" ----MATERIALLY EFFECT THE FINAL RACE RESULT AND THE DRIVER WINNING ORDER. From all the available evidence pre and post the disputed racing incident the answer is no. The imposition of a 10 grid place penalty in the next race would have been a fairer decision under the circumstances ( if such a penalty was deserved at all
) This whole post winning driver presentation ceremony protest makes a mockery of the sport. Once the drivers award ceremony has taken place that's it. Any repercussions -thats for the next race.
Formula one is rapidly becoming like the Eurovison song contest.
Hier sind die Stimmen für das McLaren-Team--------- null Punkte
qui sono i voti per la "bella" ferrari squadra ----di dieci punti !!!!!!!!!!!
Fandango
Active Member
In considering this incident and before imposing the penalties, the race stewards should have perhaps asked the following question.
Did this particular incident in which Hamilton was deemed to have "gained an unfair advantage" ----MATERIALLY EFFECT THE FINAL RACE RESULT AND THE DRIVER WINNING ORDER. From all the available evidence pre and post the disputed racing incident the answer is no. The imposition of a 10 grid place penalty in the next race would have been a fairer decision under the circumstances ( if such a penalty was deserved at all
This whole post winning driver presentation ceremony protest makes a mockery of the sport. Once the drivers award ceremony has taken place that's it. Any repercussions -thats for the next race.
Formula one is rapidly becoming like the Eurovison song contest.
Hier sind die Stimmen für das McLaren-Team--------- null Punkte
qui sono i voti per la "bella" ferrari squadra ----di dieci punti !!!!!!!!!!!
Agree with every point.
...und dein Deutsch? Perfect bis zum letzten Buchstaben!
Dryce
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That leads to a problem with dealing non-obvious but serious infractions in the last few laps and also etchnical infractions taht require scrutinering or some sort of chemistry investigation.
It also means the last race of the championship would be more open to cheating.
So at the end of the day results have to be revokable.
However.
There is already a precedent for dealing with infractions during the race with drive throughs. These have to be decided within a reasonable time.
On that basis anything that would have been subject to such a decision or penalty should be resolved within so many minutes of the race. That means that should the result be subject to an immediate enquiry the stewards have to deal with it within that time. And barrig a technical infraction the result stands.
The situation at Spa is odd because they took such a long time. They also took some sort of statement from Ferrari and McLaren. Why? If it had happened in say lap 10 would they have had the time or the facility to interview the drivers. No.
Somewhere in this fiasco the stewards lost sight of what the whole thing is about. Part of the weirdness is the way the decision appears to have been represented. They were allowed to think too long and lost their sense of perspective.
carnut
Active Member
flanaia1 wrote
"These are the Public view of the general sporting regulations, you cannot view the drivers rules and drivers sporting code unless you hold an FIA Super License or are a Senior management member of a Motorsport team that are involved in F1"
Oh .. so a law un to themselves? Scary thought, just like the Spanish Inquisition.
Sorry,,it wasnt Alonso this time was it?!
"These are the Public view of the general sporting regulations, you cannot view the drivers rules and drivers sporting code unless you hold an FIA Super License or are a Senior management member of a Motorsport team that are involved in F1"
Oh .. so a law un to themselves? Scary thought, just like the Spanish Inquisition.
Sorry,,it wasnt Alonso this time was it?!
