C207 E350 CDI Stick or Twist.............

[McT]

I bought a 2010 70k E350 C207 for a little over £9k some four years ago and I bought it as i was doing virtually 1k miles per week travelling from Scotland to Milton Keynes. When i bought it i think i got a good deal on it from the dealer as it is white, pano roof, red leather and had a decent MB history with it.

Anyways.............my dilemma is now to stick with it or twist?

Reasons to twist
1. It isn't ULEZ compliant so Edinburgh (where my family stay will soon be a problem)
2. It will likely need 4 tyres this year
3. The rear offside window sometimes isn't returning fully up when the door closes (i've tried reprogramming it once but no joy yet)
4. The front bumper could do with a respray and there are a couple of other bodywork bits that need some TLC
5. It's got 145k on it (but it should take a whole lot more)
6. My expected annual mileage has dropped off a cliff and will continue to fall to i'd guess 8k a year

Reasons to stick
1. I still love the car and enjoy driving it
2. I know the car inside out and have never scrimped on expenditure on it
3. It's still comfy as for what i need it to do
4. It's probably worth a box of maltesers now so aside from ongoing maintenance it isn't costing me anything
5. I have no idea what i'd replace it with
6. I spent £1k at the last service and MOT (mostly pads and discs front and rear, and shoes for the footbrake)

 

[W1ghty]

What’s it worth now buddy ?
What will the Edinburgh ULEZ cost you ?

 

[SmartAmg]

Know what you mean, my C207 350 cdi is exactly the same as yours, and I keep thinking should I change, but to what? Without putting 15 to 20
grand plus mine into it.
As you say, I still love driving mine, it's got everything and looks stunning, I've spent a few Bob lately and is running like a dream, so me personally am leaned towards keeping it. So it's a dilemma for you, you could go out and spend 1000s and get a dog, whereas you know yours, decisions, decisions, good luck.

 

[McT]

What’s it worth now buddy ?
What will the Edinburgh ULEZ cost you ?

If ULEZ is in line with the likes of London and Bolton then it'll be £12.50 per trip. Admittedly not that often as in once a week but £50pm is a stinger.
As far as the car goes then WBAC are saying £3k, trade in would be £3.5k/£4k depending on what i am buying. A private sale would likely be in the £4k/£4.5k so not much really.

 

[McT]

Know what you mean, my C207 350 cdi is exactly the same as yours, and I keep thinking should I change, but to what? Without putting 15 to 20
grand plus mine into it.
As you say, I still love driving mine, it's got everything and looks stunning, I've spent a few Bob lately and is running like a dream, so me personally am leaned towards keeping it. So it's a dilemma for you, you could go out and spend 1000s and get a dog, whereas you know yours, decisions, decisions, good luck.

Decisions, decisions indeed.

If you don't mind me asking what have you spent the monies on? Is it mechanical or have you braved the paintwork TLC? Realistically my bumper needs resprayed but then you are as well doing bonnet, front wings and into the doors. The bulk of the car polished up with the pearescent white still looks stunning.

 

[SmartAmg]

I've had it 5 years in May it's done 63,000 miles, the first 3 and a half years, no trouble, but the last 18months or so, I've probably spent about 2 grand over and above servicing, the bulk of that being the dreaded Oil Cooler seals. It's now running like a dream. (Shouldn't have said that, probably put the mockers on it now)
I pretty much know what I want, if I did eventually change, fancy a 2018/19 C257 CLS 400d in White, what a motor, but I'm looking at £25,000 plus mine.

 

[BTB 500]

Regardless of ULEZ etc. I reckon diesels are going to increasingly become a liability in the next few years and are not a great idea unless you're doing mega mileage.

From a reliability POV even pre-AdBlue ones aren't that good IMHO ... at around 90k miles I spent almost £6k in a year on the OM642 in my 2007 Vito although a lot of that was when the exhaust manifold liners delaminated, trashing the turbo Apart from that: crank position sensor, DPF pressure and temperature sensors, fuel pressure sensor, mass airflow sensor, EGR valve, loads of glowplugs, glowplug relay, glowplug circuit 'mega fuse' ... probably other things I've forgotten. That's a 1 owner vehicle with FMBSH up to 2022. Currently on 150k miles and going OK, but given the choice I'd definitely have petrol instead. Both our cars are petrol now - we had an old Audi A4 TDi in the past which was great, but modern diesels are just too complicated for their own good.

 

[W1ghty]

If ULEZ is in line with the likes of London and Bolton then it'll be £12.50 per trip. Admittedly not that often as in once a week but £50pm is a stinger.
As far as the car goes then WBAC are saying £3k, trade in would be £3.5k/£4k depending on what i am buying. A private sale would likely be in the £4k/£4.5k so not much really.

Similar to my situation with my 2009 E320cdi, on 125k miles worth peanuts like yours but excellent condition and still lovely . I also will be hit once a week by ULEZ (which I think will get delayed or changed ) .
So I’m sticking with the car for another 2-3 years at least , after all it’s almost free motoring at the moment.
How much would I have to add to get a petrol in the same condition? It would have to be a lot newer because most people don’t look after cars like me . 10-15k more ?

 

[Smiley]

Regardless of ULEZ etc. I reckon diesels are going to increasingly become a liability in the next few years and are not a great idea unless you're doing mega mileage.

From a reliability POV even pre-AdBlue ones aren't that good IMHO ... at around 90k miles I spent almost £6k in a year on the OM642 in my 2007 Vito although a lot of that was when the exhaust manifold liners delaminated, trashing the turbo Apart from that: crank position sensor, DPF pressure and temperature sensors, fuel pressure sensor, mass airflow sensor, EGR valve, loads of glowplugs, glowplug relay, glowplug circuit 'mega fuse' ... probably other things I've forgotten. That's a 1 owner vehicle with FMBSH up to 2022. Currently on 150k miles and going OK, but given the choice I'd definitely have petrol instead. Both our cars are petrol now - we had an old Audi A4 TDi in the past which was great, but modern diesels are just too complicated for their own good.

I think that you have been particularly unlucky with your om642; I ran the same engine in an e class up to 160k miles and only needed a set of glow plugs (all 6 replaced after one failed) and a glow plug relay - other than servicing that was it. Apart from servicing he only other repairs on the car were front springs, front brake back plates, ball joints and an a/c condensor (stone damage). The difference is that mine did not go near a main dealer.......

 

[Smiley]

I bought a 2010 70k E350 C207 for a little over £9k some four years ago and I bought it as i was doing virtually 1k miles per week travelling from Scotland to Milton Keynes. When i bought it i think i got a good deal on it from the dealer as it is white, pano roof, red leather and had a decent MB history with it.

Anyways.............my dilemma is now to stick with it or twist?

Reasons to twist
1. It isn't ULEZ compliant so Edinburgh (where my family stay will soon be a problem)
2. It will likely need 4 tyres this year
3. The rear offside window sometimes isn't returning fully up when the door closes (i've tried reprogramming it once but no joy yet)
4. The front bumper could do with a respray and there are a couple of other bodywork bits that need some TLC
5. It's got 145k on it (but it should take a whole lot more)
6. My expected annual mileage has dropped off a cliff and will continue to fall to i'd guess 8k a year

Reasons to stick
1. I still love the car and enjoy driving it
2. I know the car inside out and have never scrimped on expenditure on it
3. It's still comfy as for what i need it to do
4. It's probably worth a box of maltesers now so aside from ongoing maintenance it isn't costing me anything
5. I have no idea what i'd replace it with
6. I spent £1k at the last service and MOT (mostly pads and discs front and rear, and shoes for the footbrake)

Your car is perfect, well looked after, reliable and worth peanuts; just keep it and enjoy the ability to park it where you like and don't give a 4x what happens to it. There is absolutely no point at all in buying an unreliable, expensive to maintain euro 6 diesel just to avoid £50pm. Your car has another 100k miles in it with basic maintenance.

 

[BTB 500]

I think that you have been particularly unlucky with your om642; I ran the same engine in an e class up to 160k miles and only needed a set of glow plugs (all 6 replaced after one failed) and a glow plug relay - other than servicing that was it. Apart from servicing he only other repairs on the car were front springs, front brake back plates, ball joints and an a/c condensor (stone damage). The difference is that mine did not go near a main dealer.......

Did yours have a DPF?

I possibly have been unlucky, but the crank position sensor failure affected all OM642s built in a particular date range and I've read of the big problem with the exhaust manifolds happening on MLs (and maybe other models) as well. The glowplugs started failing on mine at 35k miles! Obviously I've had other issues with the vehicle too (a/c condenser, springs, instrument cluster, window regulators, exhaust, ...) but not related to it being a diesel

My local trusted indi garage was unable to resolve the first few issues it had as their diagnostic system (not STAR) wasn't able to clear some of the fault codes so it kept going back into limp mode. Hence all the repairs after that were done by MB (apart from the last lot of glowplugs / relay / fuse). In the worst year it was off the road for 6 weeks in total!

Worth mentioning that the OM642 only runs at 204 bhp in our W639 (later versions had 224 bhp), so not highly stressed. From new it's also only ever been used to carry our dogs and kids ... it's not a 'work' vehicle that's been thrashed with tons of building materials etc. in the back. This is a relatively 'simple' Euro 4 engine too - when we replace it we'll end up with Euro 6 (AdBlue etc.), which will add another whole set of things to go wrong as it gets older. Sadly it won't last until battery (or hydrogen?) power becomes a practical option! I wish they still had a petrol option - you could originally get the Vito with a 3.7 V6 petrol (same as the Viano) as a special order.

 

[McT]

Your car is perfect, well looked after, reliable and worth peanuts; just keep it and enjoy the ability to park it where you like and don't give a 4x what happens to it. There is absolutely no point at all in buying an unreliable, expensive to maintain euro 6 diesel just to avoid £50pm. Your car has another 100k miles in it with basic maintenance.

I'm quoting you on the "another 100k miles in it with basic maintenance"!

In all fairness i do watch Autotrader and there are plenty out there with way more miles than mine.

Was looking through my receipts and in addition to basic servicing and tyres i've had to do the following in the 4 years i've had it: -

- pipes to power steering fluid reservoir as they were leaking £300 (pipes were £145 alone)
- offside rear level sensor which defaults the car to Sports mode £250
- osf lower arm £100
- DPF pressure sensor replaced £120
- aircon condensor £250
- 4 lots of wheel alignment at ~£100 a time

 

[SmartAmg]

Your car is perfect, well looked after, reliable and worth peanuts; just keep it and enjoy the ability to park it where you like and don't give a 4x what happens to it. There is absolutely no point at all in buying an unreliable, expensive to maintain euro 6 diesel just to avoid £50pm. Your car has another 100k miles in it with basic maintenance.

Agree with everything, except, park it anywhere and don't give a 4x what happens to it. That'll never happen, as I'm always careful where I park it and always will be.

 

[McT]

One other thing that went wrong with my car, and is common to many, was the failure of the motor in the electronic steering lock. MB wanted £2k to resolve so i took to the internet, took the plunge and replaced it myself. It's a bit of a mission with needing to take the steering wheel off, instrument panel out and drop the steering rack but at the end of the day it is only a motor that costs a fiver that gets knackered. And on that note if anyone wants a new motor i have five spare ones that i hope to never need again.

 

[Smiley]

Did yours have a DPF?

I possibly have been unlucky, but the crank position sensor failure affected all OM642s built in a particular date range and I've read of the big problem with the exhaust manifolds happening on MLs (and maybe other models) as well. The glowplugs started failing on mine at 35k miles! Obviously I've had other issues with the vehicle too (a/c condenser, springs, instrument cluster, window regulators, exhaust, ...) but not related to it being a diesel

My local trusted indi garage was unable to resolve the first few issues it had as their diagnostic system (not STAR) wasn't able to clear some of the fault codes so it kept going back into limp mode. Hence all the repairs after that were done by MB (apart from the last lot of glowplugs / relay / fuse). In the worst year it was off the road for 6 weeks in total!

Worth mentioning that the OM642 only runs at 204 bhp in our W639 (later versions had 224 bhp), so not highly stressed. From new it's also only ever been used to carry our dogs and kids ... it's not a 'work' vehicle that's been thrashed with tons of building materials etc. in the back. This is a relatively 'simple' Euro 4 engine too - when we replace it we'll end up with Euro 6 (AdBlue etc.), which will add another whole set of things to go wrong as it gets older. Sadly it won't last until battery (or hydrogen?) power becomes a practical option! I wish they still had a petrol option - you could originally get the Vito with a 3.7 V6 petrol (same as the Viano) as a special order.

No it did not have a DPF. Maybe that is the difference. But actually your story of your car having lots of parts replaced may in part be due to the main dealer approach - if in doubt put as many new parts on as you possibly can. You really need an indi with Star.

 

[BTB 500]

No it did not have a DPF. Maybe that is the difference. But actually your story of your car having lots of parts replaced may in part be due to the main dealer approach - if in doubt put as many new parts on as you possibly can. You really need an indi with Star.

All were a result of it going into permanent limp mode on different occasions over a couple of years - only one thing was replaced each time. DPF temp & pressure sensors are common failure items and can need to be drilled out to replace (as one of our glowplugs did). The EGR valve is also a common failure item, and as mentioned the CPS failure (which stopped the engine dead) affected the OM642 in all MB models built over a certain date range (2006-2007, IIRC). Commercial dealerships aren't as bad as (some) car ones, and don't tend to replace things on a whim. I think they were pretty embarrassed about the number of failures and started voluntarily giving me a discount each time.

Our Vito has mostly been used for long motorway runs so has never had any issues with the DPF itself - of course that's another problem area for many cars which are frequently used for shorter local trips.

 

[tonysmb]

I'd be tempted to keep it. Unless you buy new or virtually new, you could just as easily buy something that needs new tyres, brakes etc. and also have no idea how it's been treated. At least you know yours.

I've never bought into some people's idea of buying a new car to save 5mpg ( not suggesting that's what you're saying), ie spending £20,000 to save £10 per week (maybe exaggerated) whilst ignoring the biggest cost of all, depreciation.

Your car has done its depreciating, so you either spend a chunk of money on a new car, which should be reliable, or you buy secondhand and take your chances, possibly spending as much on repairs on the replacement as the E350 needs, so potentially just saving £12 week.

You could always ask the family to meet you outside the ulez and save the £12 , or buy a couple of folding pushbikes to cycle the last section

 

[Smiley]

I'd be tempted to keep it. Unless you buy new or virtually new, you could just as easily buy something that needs new tyres, brakes etc. and also have no idea how it's been treated. At least you know yours.

I've never bought into some people's idea of buying a new car to save 5mpg ( not suggesting that's what you're saying), ie spending £20,000 to save £10 per week (maybe exaggerated) whilst ignoring the biggest cost of all, depreciation.

Your car has done its depreciating, so you either spend a chunk of money on a new car, which, IF IT IS AN ADBLUE DIESEL MODEL WILL NOT BE AS should be reliable, or you buy secondhand and take your chances, possibly DEFINITELY spending as much MORE on repairs on the replacement as the E350 needs, so potentially just saving £12 week AND BEING COMPLETELY WITHOUT A CAR WAITING FOR AN ADBLUE TANK.

You could always ask the family to meet you outside the ulez and save the £12 , or buy a couple of folding pushbikes to cycle the last section

Fixed that for you

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Just grab a pad of paper and do a budget for the year. Tax, fuel, ULEZ, maintenance, repairs, depreciation, total.

Tear off the page, and then do a budget for a replacement car. Same headers.

Look at the two pages and draw your own conclusion.

It sounds like “stick”
You might say “Twist.”
Some might say “Get a lower mileage, better condition” version of what you’ve got.

The first thing that struck me was that if you’re doing 700 mile return journeys to Edinburgh, two days of ULEZ is the least of your problems

Likewise you’ve done 5 years and 60,000 miles and you’re complaining about a repairs bill of just £400 a year ???

 

[McT]

Just grab a pad of paper and do a budget for the year. Tax, fuel, ULEZ, maintenance, repairs, depreciation, total.

Tear off the page, and then do a budget for a replacement car. Same headers.

Look at the two pages and draw your own conclusion.

It sounds like “stick”
You might say “Twist.”
Some might say “Get a lower mileage, better condition” version of what you’ve got.

The first thing that struck me was that if you’re doing 700 mile return journeys to Edinburgh, two days of ULEZ is the least of your problems

Likewise you’ve done 5 years and 60,000 miles and you’re complaining about a repairs bill of just £400 a year ???

Steady tiger..............

I'm not and never have been complaining about the bills and was just laying it out there what has happened over and above servicing, MOT and tyres. Also, i live in Fife so my longest journeys are maybe once every couple of months to Manchester or Milton Keynes with work and my normal journeys are to Edinburgh to visit family.

I know the answer to the cost of buying a new(er) car as opposed to (hopefully) that of keeping this one and yes, sticking for now is arguably the most sensible thing to do but you know what it is like when you start looking and thinking about a replacement. Everything looks shiney and tempting.