How to deal with the Mercedes dealership. W211 2007 E280 CDI

[tagnut]

As I said. Most people look at the down payment and the monthly.

I'm not saying that all deals are bad - and within a given context the margin between bad/good may vary according to individual cases.

But many people don't work the numbers. The back end of the deal is often completely overlooked. As in "I got a great deal - I only had to put down £XXXX and it's just £YYY per month." That doesn't tell the full story.

Everything has a cost - and that includes leasing and finance - and has a value.

Where there is finance or leasing there is a service being provided and you pay for that somewhere. If that cost matches the value *to you* then fine.

Errr....agreed

 

[cumblechook]

The settlement figure is everything.

He owes a certain amount on the car.

He may have £5000 equity in it, he may be £5000 short.

The first thing the dealer will ask is 'How much outstanding finance have you got on your car?'
You need to know. They need to know. They will want to pay it off to clear the finance companies interest in the vehicle.

GFV is ONLY relevant if you are upside down on the amount outstanding, however, 44 months into a 48 month agreement I doubt that will be the case.

The dealerships prey on people who think the GFV is what the car is worth at the end, I know so many people who say "I handed the keys back and started again."
Even my old man came back the other day and said "I managed to get £2500 off their price and they are going to settle my finance on the 730d."
Hold on!
I bet they are, you owe £13,000 on it and it is worth at least £16,000.
A quick phone call and the dealer agreed that maybe £13k was a bit under valued, the new figure is £15800, thus meaning my old man has an extra £2800 as deposit.

How many people would have just accepted that 'they will pay the fianance off on your existing car.' ???
Quite a few.

Thank you for your advice: The settle ment on my original documents is £13720 Glass gave me this

Trade in - excellent: £ 14,151.00
Trade in - average: £ 13,250.00
Trade in - below average: £ 12,000.00
Dealer Retail price £ 18,100.00
Private Sale price: £ 15,800.00

 

[cumblechook]

Well Glasses this month has the 280cdi on a 2007 with 62k miles on it, in excellent condition (so ready to retail, something to think about service wise.) as.....

Sport - £15700
Avantgarde - £14500
Elegance - £14000


Many dealers want the part ex as it gives them a chance to make another £3k.



Anyway, it is all irrelevant as he posted exactly the same thing elsewhere on the forum and isn't even looking at this thread, so we're just talking to ourselves.

No way man....... "I see everything". This forum has been good to me in the past and it wont let me down now. Currently reading all your posts now so keep taking y'all.

 

[cumblechook]

It doesn't always work like that, just found out my neighbour bought a new Vauxhall Insignia estate and paid..........wait for it............£33,000!! That was with nearly £5000 discount.

Don't get me wrong, it is lovely looking and has all the toys, but it is still a Vauxhall, and only a 160bhp 2.0 diesel!!

Worse than that is the residual value, they have said £11500 after 3 years, which means it is costing him £640 a month. He came round to see if I thought that was a good deal as he knows I go through loads of cars.
WTF could I say??

I told him we had just bought a BMW 520d SE Touring with everything on it, including 8 speed auto, full nav, usb, bluetooth, internet etc. etc. for less money and because of residuals it was £440 a month.

The thing with Mercs and BMWs etc. is they are very desirable used, which does help residuals, and makes using finance an option that should definitely be considered.

Buying something that doesn't hold its value, like the Vauxhall above, using finance makes little sense at all, buy at 3 years old for £13k.

Oh my God!!!!

 

[gIzzE]

No way man....... "I see everything".

Cool.

 

[cumblechook]

Thank you to everyone who made enlightening posts.
I may have some equity left in this motor, but I am sure Merc will try and bull**** me out of it. I have 4 avon zzrs on instead of the more expensive continentals (all four tires failed it's mot last time....... unbelievable) other than that the car is well cared for and only serviced by mercedes main dealers

 

[gIzzE]

If I were in your position I would get a settlement figure from Mercedes finance tomorrow and then advertise the car privately, sounds like you will have sod all left in it through Mercedes, where as you may get a couple of grand selling private.

 

[hawk20]

No you don't only get equity towards a new car.
I now understand why you keep saying you need a part ex price.

At any point in the agreement you can purchase that car using a pcp/mercedes agility/bmw select or whatever they want to call it. You only know what you owe on the last month of the agreement, if you want to pay off the finance before the end of the term you simply call them and ask for a settlement figure, they will then work out what you owe up to that point taking into account a discount in charges for the months you are not keeping the car for.

Once you have the settlement figure you can clear the finance and start again or simply not bother and pocket any equity.
Of course the dealers rely heavily on people thinking they have to hand the keys back or on people thinking they have to buy a new car from them, but it simply isn't the case.


The only time you can't do the above is if you are doing a contract hire, so renting the car from them, but usually the deposit for this is tiny as they get the deposit back when they sell the car on at the end of the term, so they can't afford to sell it to you unless you pay full retail for it.

What I said is correct: - At the end of the three years you only get equity towards the next car if the part-ex figure is higher than the GFV. If you sell privately you might get a bigger surplus towards the next car if you can sell at more than the GFV and more than the part-ex price.

If you settle before the end of the agreement, you only get equity towards the next car, (all this is assuming you are trading in against another car from an MB dealer ), if the part ex price they offer you is higher than the settlement figure.

Obviously if you choose to sell privately you can get a surplus towards the next car if you can sell for more than the settlement figure.

 

[gIzzE]

What I said is correct: - At the end of the three years you only get equity towards the next car if the part-ex figure is higher than the GFV. If you sell privately you might get a bigger surplus towards the next car if you can sell at more than the GFV and more than the part-ex price.

If you settle before the end of the agreement, you only get equity towards the next car, (all this is assuming you are trading in against another car from an MB dealer ), if the part ex price they offer you is higher than the settlement figure.

Obviously if you choose to sell privately you can get a surplus towards the next car if you can sell for more than the settlement figure.

Sorry, that isn't correct.

Only last week a friend sold his ML320cdi back to Mercedes Norwich, his GFV was £14000, the dealer valued it at £19000.
After deciding what car to buy he ended up going to a Discovery 4, Land Rover could only give him £17000 for the ML though, which was book price.

I told him to ask Mercedes if they wanted to buy it anyway, so he asked Robinsons and they agreed on £18500 as a straight sale, they paid the £14000 off the Mercedes finance and wrote him a cheque for the £4500.

 

[gIzzE]

You just have to think of your dealer as any other buyer, just because it has Mercedes over the door doesn't mean you have to get your pants pulled down.

 

[hawk20]

Sorry, that isn't correct.

Only last week a friend sold his ML320cdi back to Mercedes Norwich, his GFV was £14000, the dealer valued it at £19000.
After deciding what car to buy he ended up going to a Discovery 4, Land Rover could only give him £17000 for the ML though, which was book price.

I told him to ask Mercedes if they wanted to buy it anyway, so he asked Robinsons and they agreed on £18500 as a straight sale, they paid the £14000 off the Mercedes finance and wrote him a cheque for the £4500.

None of that contradicts what I said.
He was offered a part ex figure of £19,000 which gave him a surplus of £5,000 over the GFV. As I said you need a part ex figure bigger than the GFV to have a surplus, if you are right at the end of the agreement. You may do even better -as I said- if you sell the car yourself for more than the GFV figure and more than the part ex figure - as in your example where he sells to the trade for £18,500 and the GFV figure was £14,000.

If selling before the end of the agreement, if you want a surplus, you need the Part ex figure to exceed the settlement figure from MB finance in order to have a surplus (or you need to sell the car yourself, for more than the part ex figure, and more than the settlement figure).

Worth noting it is always worth finding what deal you can get without a part ex for comparison with part exing etc.

 

[gIzzE]

Sorry, I read the following .........

"If you settle before the end of the agreement, you only get equity towards the next car,...."

.......as you saying you only get equity towards a new car, that you couldn't get cash back, it is only money towards a new vehicle.

Apologies.

 

[cumblechook]

If I were in your position I would get a settlement figure from Mercedes finance tomorrow and then advertise the car privately, sounds like you will have sod all left in it through Mercedes, where as you may get a couple of grand selling private.[/QUO


Settlement and GTV are different?

GTV on my Docs are £13720

What is settlement? GTV + the remainder of my monthly payments till June effectively?

 

[gIzzE]

GFV is what Mercedes guarantee to buy the car back off you for, it is also what you will owe them on the final payment, in your case you will have to pay them £13720 or hand the car back if it is worth less than that or if it is worth more use the equity towards a new Merc.

If you fancy something else you need a settlement figure, if you leave it to the last day they will take the £13720 out of your account, so you need to sort out what you want to do before then.

If you are only 4 years into a 5 year plan you will owe them quite a bit more than £13720 obviously.

 

[Rory]

Bear in mind the GFV is only guaranteed at the end of the deal. In theory (and this actually happened a couple of years ago with 4x4's) they may value the car at less than GFV if you settle the finance early.

 

[hawk20]

Bear in mind the GFV is only guaranteed at the end of the deal. In theory (and this actually happened a couple of years ago with 4x4's) they may value the car at less than GFV if you settle the finance early.

Please somebody understand: what he needs is a part ex figure (to see if and by how much it is better or worse than the settlement figure i.e. what they will give him against the next car of his choice). Then see what another MB dealer will give. But first he should go to Glass's Guide website and get a full valuation so he knows what his car is worth. They will give him part ex, private sale and likely dealer prices. And he should ask MB finance what the settlement figure is (or ask his MB dealer to do that for him).

Even if he decides to sell privately (which he hasn't suggested yet has he?) he still needs to know the best he can do in part ex. Might not need the hassle of trying to sell himself.

If all else fails he can wait till June and accept the GFV unless they will give him a part ex figure then that beats the GFV.

 

[Rory]

But first he should go to Glass's Guide website and get a full valuation so he knows what his car is worth.

I know it's only £3 but it's a waste of money really. The dealer will likely show you the Glass's guide prices anyway (several times I've been given a print out from the online system the dealers usually use now) but it's pretty irrelevant as the car is worth what the dealer will pay for it. It is only a "guide" after all.

A better bet would be to look at how much similar cars are up for sale for, and start there.

 

[hawk20]

I know it's only £3 but it's a waste of money really. The dealer will likely show you the Glass's guide prices anyway (several times I've been given a print out from the online system the dealers usually use now) but it's pretty irrelevant as the car is worth what the dealer will pay for it. It is only a "guide" after all.

A better bet would be to look at how much similar cars are up for sale for, and start there.

NO. a) Far quicker and simpler to use Glass's than to spent ages trawling ads.
b) Looking at ads gives you a very small sample compared with the huge samples that Glass's get. Glass's Guide is the best available guide and is used by dealers for that reason. It is based on large samples of what cars are really being bought and sold for.
c0 Ads show prices varying wildly. They are asking prices and you have no idea what price they really achieve. Glass's is based on actual prices paid.

Not all dealers will show you their guide. Many won't. Not all customers know how to use the guide even if you let them use it.

And without a printed out full valuation he will be most unlikely to see trade price, part ex price, private sale price and dealer prices which is what Glass's will give him. And they give different prices for different mileages and different conditions.

I have often taken the valuation with me and used it most effectively to get a better price. All the cars I've sold I have never failed to equal or better the Glass's part ex price for a car with my mileage and condition.

Forewarned is forearmed.

 

[cumblechook]

Please somebody understand: what he needs is a part ex figure (to see if and by how much it is better or worse than the settlement figure i.e. what they will give him against the next car of his choice). Then see what another MB dealer will give. But first he should go to Glass's Guide website and get a full valuation so he knows what his car is worth. They will give him part ex, private sale and likely dealer prices. And he should ask MB finance what the settlement figure is (or ask his MB dealer to do that for him).

Even if he decides to sell privately (which he hasn't suggested yet has he?) he still needs to know the best he can do in part ex. Might not need the hassle of trying to sell himself.

If all else fails he can wait till June and accept the GFV unless they will give him a part ex figure then that beats the GFV.

Read the earlier posts on here....

I have given a glass valuation for my car.

 

[hawk20]

Read the earlier posts on here....

I have given a glass valuation for my car.

Well done.

When the critical moment comes and the salesman says: “So what do you want for your car, sir? it’s no good saying “I don’t know”, nor giving a totally unrealistic figure as then they’ll think you have little idea of value.

Nor are they likely to be impressed by saying that you saw a few ads in Autotrader and some were asking £X,000 because you can’t know what condition the cars were in, and anyway those were asking prices –some of which are pretty crazy.

The tool they most use for finding out what the market is valuing your type of car at is Glass’s Guide. Best you arm yourself with the same. If you are going to a gunfight, don’t take a knife.