New SL not selling - Massive discounts

[Red C220]

I think the R230 pre-facelift is such a curvy, stunning car that the SLs that followed always looked a bit boxy.

The R230 SL65 is definitely on the future list of cars I will own.

I think this could be an age thing.

To me an SL was the R107 as that's what I grew up watching on "Hart to Hart". It was quite square and boxy, but it was the flagship convertible luxury car.

However if you grew up when the R129 was the car to have I can see why that curvy slanted back front is what appeals.

The R231 which I bought is boxy in the same way the R107 was, I think that's actually part of it's appeal to me.

 

[c63chris]

I think the R230 pre-facelift is such a curvy, stunning car that the SLs that followed always looked a bit boxy. The R230 SL65 is definitely on the future list of cars I will own.

Have to say I love the looks of my SL63 and every time I start the engine it reminds why I chose it! Would never buy new though.

 

[F1YMS]

None of the above really, it's just the way the industry has developed in the UK.

Thanks for the info. I am looking to buy a car.

 

[C240Sport97]

even better SL deals on orangewheels.co.uk

 

[C240Sport97]

Porsche are an anomaly in the Auto industry in the UK. They only sell through their own dealerships (as opposed to Franchises like most other manufacturers) and control the price as a result. Discounts are available elsewhere, particularly mainland Europe.

In the UK, Porsche AG owns Mayfair, West London, Guildford, Reading and Hatfield.

All other UK dealers are franchises.

 

[Red C220]

In the UK, Porsche AG owns Mayfair, West London, Guildford, Reading and Hatfield.

All other UK dealers are franchises.

I didn't know that.

 

[StuartK]

In the UK, Porsche AG owns Mayfair, West London, Guildford, Reading and Hatfield.

All other UK dealers are franchises.

Explains why Solihull are crap

 

[DickiPhitt]

Given the heavy discounting on new SLs I would expect corresponding adjustments in the used market to be filtering through soon.
My specific interest is in an R230, post 2006 and probably post 2008, so I'm waiting with interest for prices to tumble.
A new SL400 at £54k, discounted, new translates into a price for a 3 year old car of around £27k, the level some dealers are trying to sell 6-8 year old R230s for.
Unless I'm missing something......

 

[PenelopePitstop]

Problem is, at the price level, used car market is controlled by dealers. So you get discount when car is new, then you get low trade-in price when changing the car and dealer puts it on forecourt at the price he thinks he will sell it, with high markup.

 

[DickiPhitt]

True. I always run the plate through WeBuyAnyCar to get a pretty good idea of what the dealer will have paid. Just don't want to be buying used when I can see the new market discounting so heavily which IMHO has to mean a tumble further down.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Problem is, at the price level, used car market is controlled by dealers. So you get discount when car is new, then you get low trade-in price when changing the car and dealer puts it on forecourt at the price he thinks he will sell it, with high markup.

I tried to open this up for discussion a few years ago but was shot down as if I didn't understand business.

It only takes a couple of larger dealers to adopt a fairer practice around trade-in values and the industry will follow to an extent. The current business model is weighed heavily against the consumer.

The curious thing when this was raised previously was that the defenders of high purchase/low part-ex culture were consumers themselves.

 

[JBD]

Given the heavy discounting on new SLs I would expect corresponding adjustments in the used market to be filtering through soon.
My specific interest is in an R230, post 2006 and probably post 2008, so I'm waiting with interest for prices to tumble.
A new SL400 at £54k, discounted, new translates into a price for a 3 year old car of around £27k, the level some dealers are trying to sell 6-8 year old R230s for.
Unless I'm missing something......

You don't just divide the new price by two! That's definitely not how it works [emoji23]


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[JBD]

I tried to open this up for discussion a few years ago but was shot down as if I didn't understand business.



It only takes a couple of larger dealers to adopt a fairer practice around trade-in values and the industry will follow to an extent. The current business model is weighed heavily against the consumer.



The curious thing when this was raised previously was that the defenders of high purchase/low part-ex culture were consumers themselves.

This is simply not true. Margins are smaller than ever at the moment and I'm sure they will decrease even further. Dealers have to make a profit somewhere or they won't exist any more. If you are getting huge discounts off list price and all the money for your part ex, there's no profit opportunity. That's happening on more and more transactions and I really can't see it continuing


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[Deleted member 6183]

You don't just divide the new price by two! That's definitely not how it works [emoji23]


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'That's how it works' just won't cut it in an evolving business world. Isn't it curious that the young guys take a business model as 'set in stone' when wiser heads are prepared to think about evolving the process?

This is simply not true. Margins are smaller than ever at the moment and I'm sure they will decrease even further. Dealers have to make a profit somewhere or they won't exist any more. If you are getting huge discounts off list price and all the money for your part ex, there's no profit opportunity. That's happening on more and more transactions and I really can't see it continuing


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Again, old school.

Business evolves and the car industry is due a massive shift in the way that it operates. Buyers don't feel valued or that they are getting value for money and this must change. It might take time but the industry is way overdue a rethink and technology will lead the way.

 

[JBD]

'That's how it works' just won't cut it in an evolving business world. Isn't it curious that the young guys take a business model as 'set in stone' when wiser heads are prepared to think about evolving the process?









Again, old school.



Business evolves and the car industry is due a massive shift in the way that it operates. Buyers don't feel valued or that they are getting value for money and this must change. It might take time but the industry is way overdue a rethink and technology will lead the way.

If anything, cars are cheaper these days. They're more affordable than ever and the process is getting more and more transparent because of the internet. The rethink isn't going to happen, it already is a gradual process of change.

Referring to 'how it works' as old school isn't right. I was just saying that that isn't how it works, as in that's definitely not how values are calculated. Conclusively


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[Deleted member 6183]

The retail motor business will definitely change, it might be slow but it will. Look at posts from the likes of Pontoneer about how his dad bought Mercedes cars.

You're a young guy, you will see change during your career where older guys might not.

Don't you see dealers referred to as 'stealers', why do you think that is?

I agree that margins are tightening, I believe that they should. maybe there are savings to be made? Look around you in work tomorrow, I'll bet you could save a lot of money in minutes if you held the purse-strings.

 

[JBD]

The retail motor business will definitely change, it might be slow but it will. Look at posts from the likes of Pontoneer about how his dad bought Mercedes cars.

You're a young guy, you will see change during your career where older guys might not.

Don't you see dealers referred to as 'stealers', why do you think that is?

I agree that margins are tightening, I believe that they should. maybe there are savings to be made? Look around you in work tomorrow, I'll bet you could save a lot of money in minutes if you held the purse-strings.

We've already been through this in detail. If people want savings, order online. If you want to order from a real person who you can go and see when things go wrong, order from a dealer. If we carry on, you're only going to be able to order online and I doubt that's what customers or the brand want.

I find it absolutely amazing that people think dealers margins should be reduced. Do you expect the same of Tesco, your corner shop or a restaurant? We shouldn't feel bad for making a profit, it keeps people in jobs and keeps the industry running.


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[Deleted member 37751]

Buyers don't feel valued or that they are getting value for money and this must change.

I would take an educated guess that if you took out the professional internet whingers, the majority of main dealer customers will be happy with the service they receive.

The big change is that more and more people are likely to complain and make a big fuss, the trade has evolved immensely due to the internet, whatever anyone says.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

We've already been through this in detail. If people want savings, order online. If you want to order from a real person who you can go and see when things go wrong, order from a dealer. If we carry on, you're only going to be able to order online and I doubt that's what customers or the brand want.

I find it absolutely amazing that people think dealers margins should be reduced. Do you expect the same of Tesco, your corner shop or a restaurant? We shouldn't feel bad for making a profit, it keeps people in jobs and keeps the industry running.


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So, if things go wrong and I've ordered online I have no support?

If TESCO believe that they are thought of as thieves they will change their business model pronto.

In fact they already have, you can buy from a supermarket, a hypermarket, a small (Metro) store or online and receive an excellent after sales service regardless of sales channel.

The motor trade needs to adapt or it will be lost.

 

[JBD]

So, if things go wrong and I've ordered online I have no support?



If TESCO believe that they are thought of as thieves they will change their business model pronto.



In fact they already have, you can buy from a supermarket, a hypermarket, a small (Metro) store or online and receive an excellent after sales service regardless of sales channel.



The motor trade needs to adapt or it will be lost.

You know that it's much easier to resolve an issue with someone who you have a good relationship with than it is with someone on the phone or online that you haven't met.

WE don't believe we are thieves. I believe I put in a **** load of work and a **** load of hours to make the dealership money, to provide a high level or service and to make sure customers are happy. It's sick making when people speak of the whole trade in a bad way.

Buying a TV or a loaf of bread does not require the same level of thought as a car and it's certainly not a stressful. Can you honestly say you'd buy online having never seen a car in the flesh or even driven it? I doubt it

You're argument is very one sided, misinformed and outdated.


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