Remapping

[crockers]

I'm a little confused...so a remap is better than a tuning box? If so why do Brabus offer a tuning box - and why is this MB approved?

Or isn't it a tuning box?

 

[bigyin1]

This isn't true all my cars have been mapped live and has been previously posted by others its the only exact way of doing it. You can do it as you suggest but the results won't be as good you need to adjust the parameters under load at different speeds in different gears at different revs etc, something that cannot be accurately replicated on a dyno. My scooby being a race car permanently records to a data logger we then compare the performance data to what we actually want and adjust fuelling / boost etc on the ECU map accordingly. Modern ECU's aren't that complicated the hardest part of doing this is establishing a reliable and continued connection to the ECU, out of Interest all our local Police road crime unit cars ( Evo, Scooby and Focus RS) are all mapped live the new map for the Ford RS is absolutely awesome.

Scooby/Evos are the exception to this rule, most of the current European cars running Bosch/Siemens ECUs cannot be live mapped. The main problem is the security on the latest Bosch/Siemens is very complicated, bank level security.

 

[flango]

I'm a little confused...so a remap is better than a tuning box? If so why do Brabus offer a tuning box - and why is this MB approved?

Or isn't it a tuning box?

There are all sorts of different tuning boxes, the high end ones like Brabus, Kleeman, Spider etc are effectively 2nd ECU's in a box that can be easily removed come service or warranty time with no one ever knowing they were there, this is not the case with a remap which is always detectable.

 

[flango]

Scooby/Evos are the exception to this rule, most of the current European cars running Bosch/Siemens ECUs cannot be live mapped. The main problem is the security on the latest Bosch/Siemens is very complicated, bank level security.

I also see that some of the new Bosch/Siemens units are running encryption , but there is always someone one step ahead

 

[bigyin1]

I also see that some of the new Bosch/Siemens units are running encryption , but there is always someone one step ahead

Yes indeed, you can't even modify these diagnostically now, ECU off the chassis to reprogram.

 

[bigyin1]

There are all sorts of different tuning boxes, the high end ones like Brabus, Kleeman, Spider etc are effectively 2nd ECU's in a box that can be easily removed come service or warranty time with no one ever knowing they were there, this is not the case with a remap which is always detectable.

Not strictly true as a diagnostic port re-map on some cars you can erase the flash counter that increments with each flash re-program so it is invisible so that when you then return the vehicle to its original settings it is asthough no-one has been there.

 

[flango]

Not strictly true as a diagnostic port re-map on some cars you can erase the flash counter that increments with each flash re-program so it is invisible so that when you then return the vehicle to its original settings it is asthough no-one has been there.

Not quite true either although you can reset the flash counter there are plenty of other ways you can tell if someone has been in there and there are insurance companies out there who pay us a nice fee for doing so before authorising repairs.

 

[bigyin1]

...there are insurance companies out there who pay us a nice fee for doing so before authorising repairs.

Likewise.

 

[skymastor]

Not quite true either although you can reset the flash counter there are plenty of other ways you can tell if someone has been in there and there are insurance companies out there who pay us a nice fee for doing so before authorising repairs.

If you can afford a re-map then I'm sure you could afford a spare ECU laying around to replace the mapped one after a tragic event!! If your capable or if not get someone else to replace it, or if your skint after the remap, take out the ECU (or someone on your behalf if you cant) before the insurance mob move in..

Oh god!! Someone has stolen my ECU!! Nothing like being kicked when your down!! You just cant trust those nice people down the Garage nowadays!!

Simples...

hehe...

 

[bpsorrel]

Well, 2 days into my Hirsch remap (12 days to go before I pay for it!) and I have to say, all technicalities asside - it ROCKS!! The car is soooo smooth now and power delivery is utterly seemless, hardly any lag at all now. Also, I noticed at 80 mph I'm only using 1500 rpm instead of around 2500, so that's where the fuel saving comes in I think - the car recorded 63mpg on a steady 70mph run and overall 47 for the entire mixed driving trip, which is better than previous. For fun (and in a safe place!!!) I did the 0 to 60 (ish) flat out run and it was kneck snapping fast! Couldn't time it accurately, but I reckon well under 8 seconds would be about right, down from about 10 before! So, at the moment I'm a happy bunny for sure!

 

[wemorgan]

. Also, I noticed at 80 mph I'm only using 1500 rpm instead of around 2500, so that's where the fuel saving comes in I think

are you quite sure about that, as I thought you'd need a new gear ratio to reduce the rpm?

 

[bpsorrel]

Positive!! Can't explain it, but next time I do that speed, I'll photograph it and post!

Maybe the Hirsch remap alters the auto gearbox programming also....?

 

[crockers]

Positive!! Can't explain it, but next time I do that speed, I'll photograph it and post!

Maybe the Hirsch remap alters the auto gearbox programming also....?

Be careful.

 

[bpsorrel]

Be careful.

Why?.... the Hirsch upgrade is fully warranted and approved by Saab and was uploaded by a Saab dealer....

 

[Stratman]

I'd love to see the software that can carve a new gear train and install it in a gearbox.

 

[bpsorrel]

Well, unbelievable as it may sound, 80 mph was showing as 1500 rpm....could the rev counter be wrong? the engine felt very smooth and unstressed...

Do you guys think i should have it removed and the original map put back?

 

[Stratman]

Just a wild guess, but if the tacho is driven by the ECU an untrapped bug in the remap could be sending the wrong information to the tacho.

Might be worth mentioning it to hirsch.

 

[flango]

I would very much doubt there is a bug in an Hirsch remap but you never know, Easy way to tell is just wind the window down and listen the difference between 2500 and 1500 is considerable and would be audible.

I have seen remaps drop the revs by a few hundred rpm but never anything as significant as this. Maybe Stratman is right ?

 

[gazzz]

Umm - maybe showing my ignorance here but with a fixed gear train rpm and speed are locked for any given gear as it's just a mechanical ratio.

CVT is differnt of course but we're not talking about a CVT box here are we (confused).

 

[bpsorrel]

Think I'll talk to the dealer on monday and see what they say. Although I enjoy the extra performance on offer now, I don't need it that badly and I'm not willing to risk damage to the engine! Just as well there's the 14 day trial period!!