Uneven tyre wear

[rirhill]

When I bought my car 2 years ago after 2 months I notice that the 2 front tyres were wearing very heavy on the inside so much that they were getting close to the metal bits in the tyre. I complained to them that the car was tramlining and maybe the tracking needed checking.
After this 2 months they told me that they would set the car up and do a full check on the geometry and they would pay for one of the 2 tyres. Well
I noticed that the tyres are again bolding heavy on the inside edges, so I took to a decent local garage to check the tracking. He said that he has adjusted the adjuster thingees as much as he can but on one side its at its full limit. I am annoyed that this was not pointed out by MB and they have hidden from me the fact that they couldn t adjust fully as some part of the suspension must be slightly bent.
I am not sure what to do? Do I go back to MB and complain and does anybody have any ideas of what maybe be bend that I can replace?

I would appreciate any comments.

Regards
Ian

 

[guydewdney]

take note that mb's requie a 4 wheel geo-check NOT an alignment check... unfortunatly this = loads of dosh.. like 200 quid.

go to an indy with the right kit.?

 

[rirhill]

Well guydewdney I did but he can t adjust the left front any more as its to its full tolerance. Thats the problem. MB said that they did the fully geometry £200 worth but if the indy garage can t adjust it then nor could MB when they did it.

Cheers
Ian

 

[jgevers]

Hi,

The print out from your geometry check should be able to tell you more. What are the Camber, Caster and Included Angle like? Is the setback more then 10mm?

regards,

Job

 

[rirhill]

I will dig it out and let you know.

Thanks
Ian

 

[garystu1965]

Geometry check ? Load of rubbish. Simple tracking (maybe) and a four wheel balance is all that's required. I remember BMW telling me it needed a geometry check (£300 I think) because the car was wobbling at 56mph and showed uneven wear. I took it to about four different tyre places for a balance and none got it right. I eventually took it to a place in Cheshire who told me "Look mate - we balance Ferrari's, Astons, Lambourghinis etc so we'll be able to balance your BMW". £18 and 20 minutes later the car drove better than when I bought it. Super smooth at all speeds. This geometry nonsense is just a fancy name for tracking anyway.

 

[jgevers]

This geometry nonsense is just a fancy name for tracking anyway.

Not quite. Tracking is normally referred to when talking about front toe measurement and adjustement.

A full geometry check will measure:
Wheel runout, caster, camber f&r, toe f&r, thrust angle, SAI, included angle, toe out on turns, maximum turns, toe curve change, track width difference, wheel base difference and if need be ride heights and frame angle.

With the measured information the necessary adjustments can be made and if something is out of specification a recommendation can be made.

It is obvious that there is a huge difference between basic 'tracking' and a full geometry check. The machines used for these operations are very different as well. A basic tracking machine will consist on a string, light or laser guide that will show the toe settings (these will cost between £600 and £3000). A proper geometry machine has a full 3d camera set-up, electronic turntables etc. (the starting cost will be approx. £9000. but with all the bells and whistles more like £17000. I know, I have such a set up in the garage).

It is probably better if you don't make rash conclusions based on your experience rather than actual knowledge.

regards,

Job

 

[rirhill]

I don t know if I made it clear but MB did the full geo thingy. When I had it checked it was ok apart from one side. That side could not be adjusted any further as it was at the most it could be adjusted. The 2nd check said that he though some part of the suspension must be bent slightly as it couldn t be corrected. I need to know what suspension part may need renewing so I don t keep wearing out the tyres early.

Any ideas would be appreciated

Cheers
Ian

 

[grayb]

Our tame mechanic told us that W202's wear the inside edges of the front tyres when the wishbone ball joints wear out. Maybe the E-class is similar?

We've just had the nearside one done at 50K miles - £35ish part and an hour or two labour.

 

[guydewdney]

has it ever been kerbed? the most likely culprit is the wishbone arm I'd guess - as its the weak point. the ends of this are attached to the chassis, which is unlikely to bend.

unless its been crashed, the wishbone replaced, and the chassis is slightly bent...

or as grayb says - worn components..

 

[rirhill]

guydewdney

No I bought it from the Stealership and first thing I checked was the HPI report.
As for the kerbed I never let the girlfriend drive it as she seems to use the kerbs to assist in her steering.

grayb
Thanks I will look into that. Is there any tell tale signs that they have gone?

Cheers
Ian

 

[Dieselman]

Did the dealership give you a print out of the settings when they performed the alignment? All the correct settings and the actual values are listed on the print out.

Firstly if the track rod cant be adjusted on one side it would be worth counting the exposed threads to check there is an even amount showing.

On the W210 the steering needs to be centered using the markers on the pinnion housing. Possibly the steering wheel has been removed and fitted off centre so the steering has a greater number of turns in one direction than the other.

When the castor and camber are checked the steering should be set to zero and a full tank of fuel or equivelant weight, I suspect this wasn't done.

In addition your non standard wheels wont be helping the wear and tramlining.
Are you sure the wearing isn't just a case of enthusiastic driving stressing the suspension bushes more and liberal use of the power steering causing scrubbing?

Maybe the dealer will run a free check of the alignment given that you have had previous problems. Worth a shot.

 

[janner]

Have you lowered your suspension at all?

 

[Dieselman]

Have you lowered your suspension at all?

This could well be the answer if the car has been lowered at all.

http://mbclub.co.uk/forums/showpost.php?p=91030&postcount=5

 

[janner]

That could be your problem. If it's lowered beyond normal MB sports settings you will not have enough adjustment. Wider tyres just makes it worse.
All MBs are very critical on alignment. It's not a job for Quick-Fit!.

 

[jgevers]

Hi,

It could be a variety of parts that are bent. Lower wishbone/balljoint is the most likely. However I have seen a couple where the hub carrier was deformed and quite few with chassis damage. In order to determine what the vehicle needs might be more difficult than you think.

To put this into perspective, the local bodyshops in this area will replace all suspension parts on a corner if the vehicle does not line up correctly, but shows straight on a jig.

Modern cars normally bend more than 1 part if curbed heavily.

regards,

Job

 

[Benzowner]

Have you lowered your suspension at all?

Just a point, when I recently had some new tyres fitted to my E300TD Avantgarde, the tyre company did a full suspenson and steering check. They too could not get the correct figures, the fitter then noticed the badge on the car, Avantgarde cars are lower than the Elegance and Classic, and will need a totally different set of figures.

 

[grayb]

grayb
Thanks I will look into that. Is there any tell tale signs that they have gone?

We had a clonk from the affected suspension when going into a corner and the weight transfered onto the worn component. Interestingly only really heard when there was moisture about! That, and the worn tyre.

 

[Dieselman]

To check the lower balljoints jack the car up so the wheel hangs then try to lift the wheel. Any wear will be evident.

 

[rirhill]

Thanks for all your comments. Here are the figures as I have replaced two tyres and got tracking report. See below:
Camber --- Left Front -1' 30------------ Right Front -1'47

Castor ---- 5'27 ------------- 5' 07

Toe ------- 0'02 ------------- 0'15

Total Toe 0'17
Steer Ahead -0'07

I hope this may mean something to someone.
Thanks again
Ian