w124 230 gearbox removal tricks?

[Sp!ke]

I'm planning to whip out my gearbox on Tuesday in order to sort out my poorly clutch.

Just wondering if there is anything to watch out for , any snags or shortcuts?

Anyone done one before?

Autodata states removal and refit of the gearbox is 3 hours and 20 minutes and the master cylinder replacement I did a little earlier as 2 hours and 20

The master cylinder was an absolute pig of a job as in meant working upside down in the footwell.. next time I'll remove the drives seat first

 

[bigstuff]

with a older car it down to luck . i did my 300te autobox on my back with a pair of ramps at home & that took 6hrs of pain but worth it

 

[Sp!ke]

Luck?

 

[Ian B Walker]

Jonathan, if you want me to talk you though it give me a call at work. To remove a manual box should take no longer that a couple of hours at home. In a workshop we have done one in less than an hour. There is a way to do it that makes everything so easy. The box is very light and can be lifted with ease by one person.

 

[bigstuff]

Luck?

yes if your lucky bolts ect will come off & not sheer off or be rounded

 

[Sp!ke]

yes if your lucky bolts ect will come off & not sheer off or be rounded

Thats not luck, thats down to having the right tools for the job and the skill to know what you're doing surely? When I had few tools and even less experience I used to round off bolts all the time. As my toolset has grown, my bolt rounding has eased in a near linear fashion.

I'd rather not call for this kind of advice if you donm't mind Ian. I'd much rather I had something I can read over again and again and refer back to. Besides, whats the use of the thread if the crucial facts are hidden away in a private phone call.

If you have the time to jot down some of your wisdom however, that would be great.

 

[Ian B Walker]

Understood. Ok.


Disconnect Battery
Remove exhaust as it makes access easier.
Support gearbox and remove carrier, lower box. (13mm x 2 and 17mm x 4 bolts)
Remove prop shaft from gearbox and centre support. (Tie up out of the way. 16mm spanner and depending on doughnuts 8mm allen key)
Remove shift rods from gearbox end. (Passengers side)
Remove speedo drive (Passengers side 10mm spanner)
remove reverse plug (drivers side of the gearbox at the back)
Remove clutch slave cylinder and support (think they are 13mm but not quite sure. Don't lose or break the plastic spacer)
Use 900mm extension with a 17mm socket to remove upper bell housing bolts
Support gearbox before undoing the remaining bolts.
Pull starter motor forward.
Pull gearbox backwards and lower.

Re fitting is a reversal of the removal. I may have forgotten some steps and if so I apologise.

 

[Sp!ke]

Thanks for the tips Ian. :bannana:

Well, the job wasn't so hard to do despite being only on axle stands with limited space to work. Crucial tool for the job was wobbly ended ratchet extensions and rather a lot of them. ...to do the upper bell housing bolts it needed about a 3ft extension (as Ian so rightly said).

Started about 1pm had an hour for lunch and had the gearbox back in and it all back together around 5:30pm. I'll put my findings in the other thread. HERE

 

[bigstuff]

Thats not luck, thats down to having the right tools for the job and the skill to know what you're doing surely? When I had few tools and even less experience I used to round off bolts all the time. As my toolset has grown, my bolt rounding has eased in a near linear fashion.

I'd rather not call for this kind of advice if you donm't mind Ian. I'd much rather I had something I can read over again and again and refer back to. Besides, whats the use of the thread if the crucial facts are hidden away in a private phone call.

If you have the time to jot down some of your wisdom however, that would be great.

you talk like a tool

 

[Sp!ke]

In the absence of any smilies, I can only surmise that this was an insult.

Good day to you too bigstuff.

 

[bigstuff]

Thats not luck, thats down to having the right tools for the job and the skill to know what you're doing surely? When I had few tools and even less experience I used to round off bolts all the time. As my toolset has grown, my bolt rounding has eased in a near linear fashion.

I'd rather not call for this kind of advice if you donm't mind Ian. I'd much rather I had something I can read over again and again and refer back to. Besides, whats the use of the thread if the crucial facts are hidden away in a private phone call.

If you have the time to jot down some of your wisdom however, that would be great.

your own quote above proves the point .when you did round bolts ect someone got that car after you & had to deal with it

 

[Sp!ke]

I'm not sure what your problem is exactly bigstuff and I'm not going to bother rising to this nonesence.

However, I will say that whenever I have rounded off a bolt it promptly went in the bin as soon as it was removed. I take it from your remark that you'd reuse the same bolt?

 

[bigstuff]

I'm not sure what your problem is exactly bigstuff and I'm not going to bother rising to this nonesence.

However, I will say that whenever I have rounded off a bolt it promptly went in the bin as soon as it was removed. I take it from your remark that you'd reuse the same bolt?

a bit late to do a u-turn

 

[Dieselman]

you talk like a tool

I don't want to get in the way here but would have to agree with Spike.
When one is young and inexperienced, usually with a lack of and poor quality tools, one tends to have issues with fasteners.
As one gets more experienced and has deeper pockets such experiences reduce vastly.

Of course, only the brave admit to their errors.

 

[Ade B]

Have to say I'm mightily impressed with your street repair antics Spike. I managed some fairly ambitious alfresco spannering in my teens with my Dad (or should say my Dad managed some fairly ambitious spannering without me getting in the way too much).

I'm currently contemplating with some reluctance risking the chilly outdoors to do a driveway oil service and clamber round prodding bits of undercarriage this weekend.. so hats off.

Out of genuine interest, as someone who has sheared and rounded a few bolts in the past, any tips on how to avoid it.. I've tried penetrating oil, snapped the odd stud extractor in the past and even managed to fit a helicoil following some less than accurate drilling out, but they still stick and snap.. Do I need an impact driver, Snap-on sockets or just more patience?


Ade

 

[Dieselman]

Do I need an impact driver, Snap-on sockets or just more patience?

All of the above.
If the threads are rusty de-rust with a wire brush before attempting to undo, if they are just stuck a good clout, tight fiting socket, penetrating oil and patience can work wonders.
If a nut is corroded onto a stud it can be best to split it off to save the stud.

 

[Ian B Walker]

Always try to use a six sided socket or spanner when undoing tight nuts or bolts. If by any chance you do round some off (it does happen, even to the most proficient of people) then I use a left handed spiral nut extractor, someone will remind me of the name before long.

 

[Sp!ke]

I didn't do the job single handed, I did have some considerable help from a friend. Although I tinker a lot with motorcycles, my car specific knowledge is pretty basic really but as others have said, the gearbox removal isn't actually that hard to do. The hardest part is committing yourself to do it in the rain in the street and having to spend the best part of the day lying down in a puddle and breathing asbestos.

As for tips to prevent rounding off bolts, the important thing is to use brain not brawn. Good quality tools help lots but they don't have to be overly expensive, they just need to fit.The right tool just as important, so you can reach OK and get the tool to sit properly on the bolt and get the right purchase. Some tools are made of a special steel eating cheese, I don't quite understand it but they do I swear.

I rarely use penetrating oil, finding a little heat and/or shock is the preferable option (as well as having a bigger, longer spanner/ratchet). Every tool set should have at least a 600mm breaker bar, preferably 900mm, a blow torch and a copper hide hammer.

When reassembling, I put copper-slip one everything that allows me so as to make it easier to undo next time.

oh, and if all else fails, an angle grinder and a Dremel are both indispensable.