W211 estate buying advice needed

gIzzE

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Well, if you think that the gap between a modern Ford and a modern MB is as broad as that then you certainly haven't driven a Ford recently - or (more likely) you have massively rose-tinted spectacles on when you look at your E-Class.

Secondly, I could ask you why you aren't driving a Bentley? One can be bought for less money than a decent used E-Class and it is a hell of a lot better car.
Because if I put the dog in the boot I would get some nob head moaning that I was being cruel to animals. ;)
Problem is, as good as a Bentley may be I would feel a complete **** driving it, so would never entertain it.


I have driven quite a few Fords recently, and to be honest the fact they are FWD is enough to ruin it for me. They are perfectly fine in every area, but they just don't excite me or feel special in anyway.


I would put the W211 up against loads of new cars, for me it beats the new 5 series, certainly better than the A6 and in may ways I prefer it to the W212 as a family load lugger as it is softer and more comfy, plus I like a light interior.
At least the Volvo V70 is a complete comfort wagon and doesn't pretend to be anything else which is where so many cars seem to fail these days, they try and be to many things. And that is what I love about the W211, it doesn't try and do anything other than be a very smooth. comfortable everyday car.


Edit: The gap can be tiny between the two, the fact is I enjoy one and not the other.
 

st4

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211 all the way, and to be honest, the 220cdi will be fine for the OPs needs. I like the V6cdi but hate the 7g.

The 220cdi is a very reliable engine attached to a very reliable gearbox and if they are looking at an S Max, the 220cdi will more than cover their driving needs refinement and performance wise.
 

Biglips

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Just got back from holiday where I had a brand new Ford focus hire car for a couple of weeks. I was quite impressed. Well screwed together and handling through the corners was particularly good. Had all the gadgets, air con ice cold. In fact I was discussing with my wife whether I should sell the Merc and get something more modern - possibly an S-max.

However, when I got home and got in the merc it was soooo much nicer to drive. She oozes quality despite 265k miles on the clock. Driving experience is on another level and so will be keeping the old dear for a while longer. I just cant get on with diesels either (he takes cover from the likely barrage of abuse) - but that is for another thread.
 

Red C220

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Problem is, as good as a Bentley may be I would feel a complete **** driving it, so would never entertain it.

If I could afford to buy and run a Bentley I could live with being a nob!

It would have to be an Arnage T though, and I'd even get some strawberry coloured Chino's and yellow loafers so I looked the part.:cool:
 

prprandall51

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Because if I put the dog in the boot I would get some nob head moaning that I was being cruel to animals. ;)
Problem is, as good as a Bentley may be I would feel a complete **** driving it, so would never entertain it.
Why be so precise about a conceptual comparison? Choose any other car that you fancy with a budget equivalent to the value of yours. The point is that the OP chose two cars that were actually quite similar and, to most people's viewpoint, perfectly comparable.


I have driven quite a few Fords recently, and to be honest the fact they are FWD is enough to ruin it for me. They are perfectly fine in every area, but they just don't excite me or feel special in anyway.
This is always the bit on this forum that I love the best. The almost religious deference to the "handling" of the 211. The fact is, it is a very uninvolving car to drive and even a Focus will run rings round it in terms of feel, precision, body control and entertainment value. The 211 E-Class has only two saving graces: RWD and the option of Airmatic. Amazingly, Airmatic - the one feature of the car that redeems the otherwise lacklustre feel of the car (from a "driver's" point of view) - is not even specified by many owners who then rave about their car's handling.

I haven't driven a 212 but I hear it's good, but the 211 is one of the soggiest cars I have ever driven.

I would put the W211 up against loads of new cars, for me it beats the new 5 series, certainly better than the A6 and in may ways I prefer it to the W212 as a family load lugger as it is softer and more comfy, plus I like a light interior.
At least the Volvo V70 is a complete comfort wagon and doesn't pretend to be anything else which is where so many cars seem to fail these days, they try and be to many things. And that is what I love about the W211, it doesn't try and do anything other than be a very smooth. comfortable everyday car.
Now you are on to the S211's real strength - load carrying and comfort and, in those departments, I agree with you that it is unequalled. However, I can only assume that you have never driven the current V70 for it is neither well sprung (it has a harsh, choppy ride that feels under-developed - as if the designers got part way through the chassis tuning and then went on strike) nor is it spacious, having the smallest interior of any 70-series Volvo ever, in fact it is cramped in both the front and rear cabins and the tailgate section isn't that big, either.


Edit: The gap can be tiny between the two, the fact is I enjoy one and not the other.
It was you who implied that the gap between the two was enormous with you analogy of a bottle of meths and a bottle of fine wine. The problem is you were so dismissive of the OP's choice of cars that you set yourself up rather.

If you are now acknowledging that (in some ways) the gap between an S-Max and an S211 is quite small, then I would agree with you - and I would choose the 211 as well.
 

gIzzE

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If I could afford to buy and run a Bentley I could live with being a nob!

It would have to be an Arnage T though, and I'd even get some strawberry coloured Chino's and yellow loafers so I looked the part.:cool:


It's all about the coloured chinos at the moment, I even bought a pink pair!!


This was a murder mystery night, I was some extravagant photographer who liked wearing bright colours, so thought I would use it as an excuse to buy some coloured chinos!





And the dog took quite a shine to them too!!

I had fallen asleep in the conservatory and rather than wake me up to let me know he was humping my trousers they got the camera out instead!!!
 

gIzzE

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If you are now acknowledging that (in some ways) the gap between an S-Max and an S211 is quite small, then I would agree with you - and I would choose the 211 as well.

So ignoring all the other stuff, cause that was just you arguing for the sake of arguing??
At the end of all this you agree. :doh::wallbash::(

:D


If I were you I would join a local debating team mate, get it out of your system. :thumb:
 

gIzzE

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Why be so precise about a conceptual comparison? Choose any other car that you fancy with a budget equivalent to the value of yours. The point is that the OP chose two cars that were actually quite similar and, to most people's viewpoint, perfectly comparable.

Huh??
What you going on about? :dk:




This is always the bit on this forum that I love the best. The almost religious deference to the "handling" of the 211. The fact is, it is a very uninvolving car to drive and even a Focus will run rings round it in terms of feel, precision, body control and entertainment value. The 211 E-Class has only two saving graces: RWD and the option of Airmatic. Amazingly, Airmatic - the one feature of the car that redeems the otherwise lacklustre feel of the car (from a "driver's" point of view) - is not even specified by many owners who then rave about their car's handling.

I haven't driven a 212 but I hear it's good, but the 211 is one of the soggiest cars I have ever driven.




The thing I don't like about FWD is when my car is loaded up, which is usually is the front wheels scrabble around trying to pull out of junctions on anything but the driest of days, the back end squats down and the front end lifts as you try and accelerate and the front wheels struggle to get traction.

Just the other day our friend mentioned it about her S-Max, and said that pulling out of her drive is a real problem in the morning as the gaps are so small, she is finding it a real problem, said she never had that with her old Rav4. But most people don't think about the little differences FWD, RWD and AWD make, they always think it is about making it feel 'like a sports car'.



Now you are on to the S211's real strength - load carrying and comfort and, in those departments, I agree with you that it is unequalled.
I thought that was what he was looking for?



It was you who implied that the gap between the two was enormous with you analogy of a bottle of meths and a bottle of fine wine. The problem is you were so dismissive of the OP's choice of cars that you set yourself up rather.

If you are now acknowledging that (in some ways) the gap between an S-Max and an S211 is quite small, then I would agree with you - and I would choose the 211 as well.

I used the bottle of meths as you didn't strike me as the sort of chap who would have got the difference between a 2005 Fleurie and a 2006 Nuits St. George. :p

Just kidding of course. I think that maybe I was just having a bit of a chuckle on a forum, didn't realise I was being analyzed whilst doing it, I shall try my very, very best in future to be sensible at all times. Promise.
 

gIzzE

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I don't see the difference myself. Look at this eBay advert, for example:

2007 Mercedes-Benz C-Class 2.1TD C220 CDI Avantgarde SE | eBay

:D

I don't get what I am meant to be looking at??
Edit: I now get it, read the title properly.




At the end of the day, until you have owned a Merc I don't think you really get why Merc owners love them so much, I certainly didn't and only bought one because I like German and needed the space an E Class estate provided, however, now I am hooked.
Would I have liked it as much if it was a C Class, or a 4 cylinder?? I don't know, maybe, maybe not.
I just know that after 30 odd cars in the last 15 years in our house including some of the best that Audi and BMW have to offer the E Class Estate is the best of the lot.
 
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Troon

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Thanks for all your advice, everyone. Picked up a 2006 post-facelift E220 CDI Avantgarde auto in Cubanite this morning, nicely run in at 72k miles. Loving it so far. :D

The kids think it's great, with their favourite feature being the pop-out bins in the rear doors... :dk:
 
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Troon

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Well, I've had the beast (my first MB) for 100 days now, and have covered about 6000 miles. Generally good, but lots of work needed and more to come:

  • Car was on four different mostly cheap tyres, all replaced with Hankook all-seasons
  • Fitted a Viseeo MB-2 for Bluetooth
  • I didn't notice the cracked o/s door mirror indicator lens when I bought it, and have since managed to crack the other side to match. Luckily parts aren't crazily expensive and WIS shows the method.
  • Service record showed no signs of ATF change at 72k miles, so I had that done and a leaky #3 injector seal fixed at Inchcape Stratford-upon-Avon. They recommended ball joints and n/s caster arm needed replacing soon, but wanted over £500 for that.
  • Above two jobs completed at Independent Autos UK of Coventry for £300, also did an alignment and replaced an incorrect exhaust clamp bolt that was allowing the exhaust to knock into the bodywork.
  • n/s/f caliper was sticking, to the point of leaving me stranded. Eventually fixed by stripping and rebuilding caliper, also replaced brake fluid while I was at it, and fitted new Pagid discs as the old ones were scored.
  • Did my own service: oil and three filters. Reset the ASSYST and told it about the brake fluid change.
  • The passenger sunvisor light didn't work: a new microswitch sorted that out.
  • Fitted my Harman-Kardon Drive+Play system to allow control of my iPod playing into the car system
  • The spare wheel bounced on bumps as the retention system didn't clamp it properly. A roll of masking tape has temporarily sorted that out.
  • Front and rear wipers blades have both been replaced
  • I have replaced the scuttle drain pipe (centre of cowl to wheel arch) as the old one was mysteriously cut.
  • Another injector seal leaking, this time #2, and I fixed it myself.
  • Still to do: o/s caster arm bush has leaked all its fluid out, the nav disc is quite out of date (v6), the door mirror indicators could both do with replacing and I'm still chasing a slight "out of balance" noise when driving that isn't the wheel balance. Also, I think the tailgate gas struts are tired and could do with replacing. I want to get the cornering fog lamps disabled and UK mode removed to allow permanent temperature display.
Despite all that, I'm still pleased with the car and looking forward to its first proper long fully-laden runs over the Christmas break.

I'm now a convert to automatics: apart from sluggishness and too much drama at very low speeds, it's great. The interior is fantastic: very solid and comfortable, and it's a lovely relaxing car to drive, particularly in poor conditions. The electric luggage cover (see last couple of posts) is too noisy for everyday use and is only pulled across when I need to hide something. With the rear seats down, it makes a great dump run car!

I've signed up to the official club, and have my card that gives me 10% off parts at dealers, and (the best bit) full WIS and EPC access.

I'd like to thank everyone who has helped me with answers and advice over the last few months. :)
 
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SPX

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What is the harmon-kardon iPod thing that you speak of?

How do you fit that?

Good to see that you're enjoying the car...
 

A210AMG

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^ I have one but never got round to fitting it.

What do you plug it into?

I was going to put the control knob in the little cup holder type cubby near the front arm rest.
 
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Troon

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D-18

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Sounds like you're well on your way to getting all the niggles sorted out. Glad to hear you're pleased with the car - it's great when the reality matches the anticipation.

I had a 220 before I bought my current car and one thing you might want to check is the software version for the ECU/transmission. When I had the 220 I had mine updated (late last year I think?) and this dropped the idle speed by about 100rpm when in 'C' mode. If you pressed the button for 'S' the idle speed came back up. Just mentioned it because it made the engine a bit more 'calming' in traffic and I preferred it after the update.
 

Benzowner

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Thought of an engine remap? the E220 is 150bhp and can easily acheive 170bhp the same as the old E300 TD
 
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Troon

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Thought of an engine remap? the E220 is 150bhp and can easily acheive 170bhp the same as the old E300 TD
The facelift E220CDI is 170PS... :rolleyes:
 

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