Why do people react when they are in the wrong?

[E55BOF]

cb1965, I'd leave it there; they won't shut up; they never do....

 

[tali]

When I had my Jag (XJ) it was the opposite, everyone used to let me in and nod appreciatively at the car..... I even got automatic entry to the VIP car park at Haydock Race Course just because the car looked the part .... hmmmm, sometimes I wish I still had it.

When my mate had a XJ40 he took it to Uni and got cheered by his fellow students.(he was' nt studying ecology btw!)
When his brother took it to work ,co -workers totally blanked him.
Another friend had s -type and always got fast tracked into works car park

 

[markjay]

A friend who is a traffic management engineer told me once that they plan and optimise the narrowing-down of roads based on the premise that motorists will drive right up to point when the lanes merge, and he could never understand why drivers move out of the outer lane as soon as they see the warning sign thus causing longer tailbacks than necessary.

But on another note... setting aside the lane merge... on a three lane road, if a car in the inner lane and a car in the outer lane move into the middle lane at exactly the same time, who has the right of way?

 

[Giantvanman]

on a three lane road, if a car in the inner lane and a car in the outer lane move into the middle lane at exactly the same time, who has the right of way?

Neither.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

But on another note... setting aside the lane merge... on a three lane road, if a car in the inner lane and a car in the outer lane move into the middle lane at exactly the same time, who has the right of way?

As GVM says: neither. The Highway Code opens with this in the general rules, techniques and advice for all drivers and riders:

The rules in The Highway Code do not give you the right of way in any circumstance, but they advise you when you should give way to others.

In the example you gave, there would be far less chance of confusion and possible collision if both drivers gave adequate notice of their intention to change lane by the use of their indicators. Additionally an observant driver moving to the middle lane from the outer lane may be able to evaluate the relative speeds of vehicles in the inside lane to determine the likelihood of the faster vehicle moving out, possibly without warning.

There are many other clues there if only we all looked out for them. The choice is to be wary of what others may do incorrectly and stay safe, or blame someone else from your hospital bed!

 

[Deleted member 65149]

Forget why you/they drove like you did... why make generalisations about people based on their motors? In my experience it's only people with fancy cars that believe that stuff...

Not from what I've read elsewhere. The small Ford/Vauxhall/Nissan/Skoda/etc drivers regularly cite the BMWs in particular but also Audis and Mercedes as being too fast, aggressive and "up there [sic] own a****". So let's be realistic here, if you're not driving a Mercedes with a petrol engine that has at least six cylinders, you're a total c**k.

 

[meeeb]

A friend who is a traffic management engineer told me once that they plan and optimise the narrowing-down of roads based on the premise that motorists will drive right up to point when the lanes merge, and he could never understand why drivers move out of the outer lane as soon as they see the warning sign thus causing longer tailbacks than necessary.

What would happen in an ideal world is that vehicles would merge like a zip, close to the closure, to keep traffic moving optimally, but as we all know, in the motorway gladiatorial arena, that requires co-operation and gaps in traffic large enough to accommodate the manoeuvre. What happens is that vehicles on the inside lane are moving too close together, often deliberately so, to allow this to happen leaving no room for 'zipping', so all but the most forceful of drivers move early into the left-hand lane to avoid being thwarted near the narrowing.

Highways agencies even tried signs encouraging merging, but without much success.

I'm sure we've all seen HGVs blocking two lanes for a long distance to prevent efficient 'zipping'. Seems the world is full of self-appointed guardians of the road.

Unfortunately the reality is that driving is all about not letting other drivers 'get one over on you'. It's a brownie point thing.

 

[219]

But on another note... setting aside the lane merge... on a three lane road, if a car in the inner lane and a car in the outer lane move into the middle lane at exactly the same time, who has the right of way?

Putting my pedantic hat on , both have right of way , but neither has priority .

 

[Deleted member 65149]

As for the main and original part of this thread, I can see both sides of the argument (ouch - I just got a splinter in my bum!).

The OP expressed incredulity at something most of us will have experienced at some time - road rage from someone we've perceived to have been in the wrong themselves. It happens; possibly as an unconscious reaction to the realisation of having made a mistake. Mr Freud may have been able to explain it, but not me.

To illustrate his point, the OP provided a relatively brief account of the circumstances leading up to the incident. Because he wasn't giving evidence for a court hearing, his account lacked some detail and accuracy. Because it was no more than an outline of what happened, his account was wide open to interpretation; so of course being this forum it WAS interpreted. The views expressed were all valid as generalisations, but perhaps unnecessarily over-critical in view of the limited evidence. As the OP had to say a few times, the critics weren't there to see exactly what happened. A fully detailed account would have done no more than help all the readers get to sleep so late at night!

MY interpretation of the OP's initial post was that he did nothing wrong himself, ASSUMING that he didn't cut in sharply on the other driver. Others chose to think otherwise, and so the late hour led to some heated discussion with neither side being able to appreciate the other's viewpoint. Lots of headlight flashing and horn pushing ensued - just like in the incident that the OP originally reported! Is this forum a microcosm of the roads we all travel?

 

[Deleted member 65149]

Putting my pedantic hat on , both have right of way , but neither has priority .

As a fellow pedant, I like that. It slightly goes against some wording in the Highway Code, but it's a commendable way of thinking.

 

[91dm]

I travel on that part of the M66 every day, people seem too lose all driving ability as the three lanes merge into two. On numerous occasions, people have pulled out in front of me from the inside lane, without realising people are merging from the outside lane. No need for half of the posts in this thread.

 

[John]

Driving up the M66 this afternoon and just north of Bury the outside lane merges into the middle lane reducing the road from 3 to 2 lanes. I was in the third lane behind a black VW van as we were passing slower traffic and when he moved over I passed him and started to move into the middle lane just before the outside lane merged.

I had just about got myself into the middle lane when a car on he inside lane pulled out to begin to overtake the car they were behind. The car was moving considerably slower than I and obviously hadn't seen me given how close I was when it pulled out in front of me so I went round it just nipping in before the chevroned area marking the end of the outside lane.

Well I got a full display of horn and lights from the car despite the fact he had pulled out on me..... why do people do that?

It just reminded me that you see it quite often where someone does something stupid and then gets irate at the poor driver they have just nearly caused an accident with.

It's very odd.

They are the same sort of people who flash when you overtake them for no apparent reason.

Clearly, only they know why they do this.

 

[E55BOF]

I rather think they flash you because, if you drove the way they do, you would not have overtaken. Mind you, we all cut it a bit fine sometimes, don't we?

 

[cb1965]

OK I have been reliably informed that threads of this nature are dragging the forum down so I am not going to get involved in any more heated debate, but will just make a couple of comments if I may.

You obviously didn't do physics .........

Only hitting a car that is in front of you at an angle will cause it to spin.

Therefore, it would not have been in a position to pull in safely and with due consideration to other road users (ergo. leaving enough room for an emergency braking manoeuvre to be carried out by the vehicle you have passed and pulled in front of).

You are simply not going to win this one on simple maths, physics, law and logic.

I am no lawyer, but quite good at the maths and physics thing thanks... I still say you'd be on dodgy ground rightly or wrongly, but what's more to the point is that you avoided my question about your middle lane comment... I didn't cut across anyone on the middle lane so why make your comment about encountering you on the middle lane? If a vehicle had been there such that I would have ended up cutting them up I would have moved in behind the van rather than overtake it

Looks like you've joined the trend!

I think you missed the wink emoticon at the end of my comment... just to spell it out I was joking

Unfortunately the reality is that driving is all about not letting other drivers 'get one over on you'. It's a brownie point thing.

In the UK that is absolutely the attitude of a great many drivers. I have driven all over the world including Australia, America, Thailand, Indonesia, Spain and Italy and nowhere has such genuine aggression on the road as you experience routinely in the UK. Sure in some of those countries there is a passive aggression about wanting the bit of road you want, but there is no malice with it unlike here sadly!

I travel on that part of the M66 every day, people seem too lose all driving ability as the three lanes merge into two. On numerous occasions, people have pulled out in front of me from the inside lane, without realising people are merging from the outside lane.

Yep

 

[John]

I rather think they flash you because, if you drove the way they do, you would not have overtaken. Mind you, we all cut it a bit fine sometimes, don't we?

I've certainly cut it fine in the past but not for a long time and don't put myself in that situation - I'm never in that much of a hurry.

Ironically, I've been flashed most when the overtake was as safe as it could be which makes it all the more bizarre.

 

[Mrhanky]

Yet another innocent thread ruined by the few. I wonder sometimes whether people simply do not bother to post anymore, with the not so merry band of pedants this forum has.

 

[Mrhanky]

I've certainly cut it fine in the past but not for a long time and don't put myself in that situation - I'm never in that much of a hurry.

Ironically, I've been flashed most when the overtake was as safe as it could be which makes it all the more bizarre.

+1

It seems to happen on dual carriage ways a lot where there is a central reservation. I think a lot of people don't realise for a car it's a 70 mph limit.

 

[John]

+1

It seems to happen on dual carriage ways a lot where there is a central reservation. I think a lot of people don't realise for a car it's a 70 mph limit.

Maybe it is encouragement.

 

[renault12ts]

+1

It seems to happen on dual carriage ways a lot where there is a central reservation. I think a lot of people don't realise for a car it's a 70 mph limit.

...unless signed as a lower speed.

 

[cinek]

OK I have been reliably informed that threads of this nature are dragging the forum down so I am not going to get involved in any more heated debate, but...

These 'buts' are exactly what drags the forum down, because nobody wants to let it go, and everybody wants to have the last say.