Witnessed a big "off"

[Swiss Toni]

Corroboration

I read that as meaning that supporting evidence is required where the only evidence of excess speed is somebody's opinion - eg I saw him go past and in my opinion he was going far faster than 30mph. It implies therefore, that the opinion of 2 civilians would suffice.

I agree and believe this has been done, where it was shown that the experience of both people was appropriate and reliable.

An admission of speeding

An admission is not the opinion of a witness, but a confession by the person committing the offence, which would therefore not require corroboration.

A voluntary admission or confession [voluntary = no trick, torture, etc etc to obtain it] is acceptable evidence in a criminal case, which could give rise to a successful prosecution in many circumstances.

But the only evidence would be that of confession - and that is not sufficient to prosecute in any offence.


Operor non puto a male in t'internetium

 

[robert.saunders]

My signed witness statement doesn't include reference to my speed; I have an opinion, for all it's worth, of the speed of the 2 vehicles who were "racing". The condition of the car prior to fire service extraction is indicative of the speed involved, and I'm sure the police would conduct their own speed survey. However, no-one was seriously hurt so that's the main thing.

I accept the issues pointed out here in their best intentions, so I thank you for that. It's enjoyable to read opinions, despite the medium presented here. It's no different to chatting down the pub

Besides, I know enough traffic division officers; how dare they possibly implicate me in anything!!!!

 

[glojo]

I agree and believe this has been done, where it was shown that the experience of both people was appropriate and reliable.



But the only evidence would be that of confession - and that is not sufficient to prosecute in any offence.


Operor non puto a male in t'internetium

I understand your point and yes, if a person walked into a police station and stated that yesterday they travelled at 45mph through the High Street, no one saw me, no one was inconvenienced, then the person would undoubtedly be shown the door.

But

Constable Bloggs hear's the throaty roar of a motor cycle, the bike goes pass Mr Bloggs at a sedate speed, turns the corner, disappears from sight then the officer hears this bike's engine accelerate and tracks the noise as it does a huge loop, all this takes place out of sight.

As the bike comes back into view the officer steps out into the road, stops the rider and discovers they are a disqualified rider. During the ensuing interview the rider admits to slowing down when he saw the officer, and as soon as he knew he was out of sight he accelerated to 60 mph along the whole length of the High Street. This act was not witnessed by the officer, at no stage did he see the bike speeding, and the only evidence of speeding would be the rider's which would be corroborated by the speedometer.

The defendant makes the statement under oath, they are told that if they say anything that is false or known to be untrue then they face further prosecution? Their decision, their choice, their stupidity.

Operor non puto a male in t'internetium

John

 

[Guy]

I understand your point and yes, if a person walked into a police station and stated that yesterday they travelled at 45mph through the High Street, no one saw me, no one was inconvenienced, then the person would undoubtedly be shown the door.

But

Constable Bloggs hear's the throaty roar of a motor cycle, the bike goes pass Mr Bloggs at a sedate speed, turns the corner, disappears from sight then the officer hears this bike's engine accelerate and tracks the noise as it does a huge loop, all this takes place out of sight.

As the bike comes back into view the officer steps out into the road, stops the rider and discovers they are a disqualified rider. During the ensuing interview the rider admits to slowing down when he saw the officer, and as soon as he knew he was out of sight he accelerated to 60 mph along the whole length of the High Street. This act was not witnessed by the officer, at no stage did he see the bike speeding, and the only evidence of speeding would be the rider's which would be corroborated by the speedometer.

The defendant makes the statement under oath, they are told that if they say anything that is false or known to be untrue then they face further prosecution? Their decision, their choice, their stupidity.

Operor non puto a male in t'internetium

John

Perfect example, John, IMHO - in the first case, no real public interest in a prosecution; second example, prosecution may well follow.

I don't think the law requires a confession to be supported by independent evidence; it's just good practice to ensure that some attention seeker doesn't get prosecuted for either something that hasn't happened, or something that someone has else has done.

Anyway, I was glad to read Robert's post that much of this now seems academic. I was also shamed to see what time Swiss Toni was up and about this morning, having slept in until 9.45...

 

[glojo]

I was also shamed to see what time Swiss Toni was up and about this morning, having slept in until 9.45...

I was up at 4am but did not log on until about 6-ish. I thought I might try reading to get back to sleep Failed miserably and should have read the FIA's verdict regarding the Renault saga, thnat might have put me back to sleep

I'm certain our posts are an academic exercise as no doubt the CPS would have kittens at the thought of prosecuting the alleged offender

John.

 

[fredfloggle]

Back on topic I just witnessed a 56 plate ford GT40 wedge itself in the undergrowth near the M10 roundabout St Albans - are they expensive them GT40 things?

 

[robert.saunders]

Probably. I know a thing about the M10 but I can't mention it on this forum sadly

 

[Simon]

Here's another one from Peterborough last week?

http://www.peterboroughtoday.co.uk/news/Werrington-crash-First-on-scene.3551456.jp

Let's be careful out there eh?

 

[robert.saunders]

That was an extraordinary incident; where it happened it's not a "black spot" for incidents. The road is higher than the nearby residential area, which is very close to the roundabout, which itself is at the end of a NSL dual-carriageway, going onto a restricted dual.

 

[SimonsMerc]

Car: I love MB so much, I bought a Ford (sorry!) - it's only temporary

This whole discussion on how fast the OP was going is irrelevant, since there is clearly no way he could have gotten to the speed he describes in a Ford...

On a more serious note, I wish there were more honest people around who'd go back and offer to act as a witness like this. I've been at the point where I needed it, and no-one did....

-simon

 

[robert.saunders]

This whole discussion on how fast the OP was going is irrelevant, since there is clearly no way he could have gotten to the speed he describes in a Ford...

On a more serious note, I wish there were more honest people around who'd go back and offer to act as a witness like this. I've been at the point where I needed it, and no-one did....

-simon

Scary thing is, the Mondeo in its current form is somewhat scary-lary faster all round than my previous C220

I don't have it in me to ignore a crash like that; I stopped when I could and offered my support. The van driver though didn't stop at the time (he may have reported it later of course) - it happened directly in front of the driver, their view on the matter would be ~50% better than mine I would guess.

 

[jeremytaylor]

Back on topic I just witnessed a 56 plate ford GT40 wedge itself in the undergrowth near the M10 roundabout St Albans - are they expensive them GT40 things?

Put it this way - they're not cheap. Circa £100k, I think. A mate has one, but it is sooo wide, it is almost undriveable on our lanes. Give me a nice SLK 55 AMG at half the price any day!

 

[BTB 500]

I just witnessed a 56 plate ford GT40 wedge itself in the undergrowth near the M10 roundabout St Albans - are they expensive them GT40 things?

That would be a Ford GT (GT40 was the 1960s original). They stopped making them in 2006 so the last ones were on 07 plates, IIRC UK price was about £120k when new.

 

[st13phil]

That was an extraordinary incident; where it happened it's not a "black spot" for incidents. The road is higher than the nearby residential area, which is very close to the roundabout, which itself is at the end of a NSL dual-carriageway, going onto a restricted dual.

I know that bit of road pretty well. I lived off the north-eastern end of Hodgson Ave until mid-1999 and used to drink in the Crab & Winkle which is almost opposite Danish Court. What a sad loss of life. RIP