Xenons and vehicle mods in general - re Insurance cover.

[BTB 500]

When my OEM zenons are fitted to the 43 i will update the VIN card negating the need to tell the insurance.

But replacing a xenon hid headlight after a minor shunt will cost the insurance company a lot more than replacing a standard light. Same if I fit an AMG bodykit to my SL - an AMG bumper is a heck of a lot more than a normal one. So seems reasonable enough to have to declare things that aren't standard for that model.

 

[andy27168]

If the data card is updated it would be the same as any other with zenons fitted.

 

[BTB 500]

Yup - not standard spec. for the model & year.

 

[Tan]

When I insured the E500, I was asked to declare any modifications or options. I declared the AMG bodykit Wheels, Parktronic and Panoramic roof. As these are the things that could be damaged or would make the car more appealing to a thief / vandal.

Some insurance companies wanted to know the value of these mods, how they expect you to know this on a second hand car is beyond me.

I suspect there are many people out there who believe that the options on their car were actually standard. For example apart from some of us MB fans / geeks, how would someone know that Xenons were standard on the W211 E-class Avantgarde models, but an option on an Elegance models.

 

[ringway]

Original article at http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/moneybox/7861184.stm

Insurers warn on car alterations
By Bob Howard
BBC Radio 4's Money Box


Drivers who significantly modify their vehicles must alert insurers or risk losing cover, insurers caution.
Changes include anything which affects a car's performance, safety, or the odds of it being stolen or vandalised.
These can include fitting alloy wheels, built in sat-navs or entertainment systems.
The Financial Ombudsman Service says insurers must prove that there has been a significant change to the associated risks for cover to be withdrawn.
'Important' changes
Mohammed from Leicester claimed on his insurance after a BMW he bought for £20,000 second hand was badly vandalised, causing £5,000 worth of damage.
He was not aware that some of the car's features were a result of modifications requested by the original owner.
When the insurance assessor discovered modified headlamps, sat-nav and seats it refused to pay out until he agreed to pay an extra £1,000 on his premium and excess.
He agreed, but still thinks it was unfair:
"I shouldn't have been penalised like that as obviously I wasn't aware of it."


Insurers have different policies over what changes they expect drivers to alert them to. Insurance brokers have seen other examples of controversial decisions.
Peter Staddon, from the British Insurance Brokers Association, says whilst drivers have a duty to disclose important changes, some insurers extend the definition too far:
"We've had silly situations where we've had an insurance company try and throw claim out on the grounds that they had a roof box."
Onus on insurer
Norwich Union says it has several hundred disputes on this issue each year.
It exempts any changes made for an owner before a car leaves the factory, but it requires any alterations after that to be declared.
Nigel Bartram is the company's motor underwriting strategy manager:
"We price the risk on the information we're given and if that proves not to be right we're fully within our rights to void the policy."


Insurers concede that some changes, like some engine modifications, may be impossible for many people to detect. Unresolved disputes can end up at the Financial Ombudsman Service.
Peter Hinchcliff, its lead ombudsman for insurance, says the onus is on the insurer to explain their actions:
"We'll expect the insurer to explain why the work that was done was relevant for them.
"It's got to be something that makes a difference to the risk they are taking on."
The consumer's group Which? advises anyone buying a second hand car to ask the seller if there have made any modifications and consult a local dealer if they are still not sure.


BBC Radio 4's Money Box was broadcast on Saturday,
31 January 2009 at 1204 GMT.

I did listen to the programme. Mohammed not only had sat nav but also TV and if this was declared to the insurance company it would have added to the cost of the premium.
Also things like the non standard seats are expensive and there is no way he could expect to pay the standard premium with such extras. But if the insurance company quizzed him about any "possible modifications" when he applied for the insurance he may well have been able to establish for himself that he did in fact have extras that would need to be covered.

Maybe the insurance companies don't want to know too much about such modifications sometimes, because if the worst happens they then may not have to pay out, or as in Mohammeds case when the worst happens they get retrospective payment to contribute to thier costs...

In this situation a lot of us may sweep declaration of modifications under the carpet and then plead ignorance if the worst happened.


To be fair to everyone the insurance companies should encourage people to come clean about modifications - if they know about them or suspect they are there - and the offer two premiums.

One for replacement of car and, or parts as original spec.
One for replacement of car and, or parts with the enhancements.

In this way Mohammed could take his pick of a lower premium for standard replacement or repair, or a higher premium for covering all the modifications.

Trouble is in this sort of situation, a lot of us want to have our cake and eat it and although paying for insurance is an another expense, you can't expect the insurers to cough up the extra if you didn't cough up the extra.

Full of grey areas though...

 

[verytalldave]

I am sure a significant amount of this is so the insurance companies can bump up the premiums and make a little more profit.

 

[219]

Very few MBs sold in this country would be 'standard spec' anyway .

Just go over to Germany and get into a taxi - you will see MB Tex upholstery , manual windows , manual gearbox and not much else . On my last trip to Berlin , I looked in the window of a parked W126 300SE to see cloth seats and manual windows .

You really don't get cars so basic here , therefore practically every car sold in the UK has options fitted . MB is marketed in the UK as an upmarket , bespoke car with every car being specced up by the original owner who placed the order . Apart from a fleet order where an number of cars might be ordered together , it would be very hard to find two IDENTICAL cars out there . I remember reading somewhere that after W123 production ended with so many millions having been produced , that because there were so many options available , the greatest number of identical cars produced to any spec was something like EIGHT !

So , with Mercedes at least , there is no 'standard spec' .

 

[jaymanek]

a cupholder is proof that you drink whilst driving

 

[Dieselman]

Very few MBs sold in this country would be 'standard spec' anyway .

Just go over to Germany and get into a taxi - you will see MB Tex upholstery , manual windows , manual gearbox and not much else . On my last trip to Berlin ,
You really don't get cars so basic here , therefore practically every car sold in the UK has options fitted .
So , with Mercedes at least , there is no 'standard spec' .

Of course there is and loads of dars conform to that. The standard spec is 'Classic', Elegance', 'Avantgarde', 'Sport' and a few other derivetives which make up the standard spec of UK cars. The equipment fitted is a standard list but he insurers know about them so can calculate the risk accordingly.

Non standard options are those not listed as the standard spec for that model.

'Taxi' spec is an optionable spec, Taxi meter, radio, MB Tex, Yellow paint, higher final drive ratio, etc.

 

[fyonn]

When I put a HID kit in my old SLK, I tried to tell directline several times about the mod, and each time they listed it on my account as "clear headlight lenses".

after the third time, I gave up.

that said, if I had been in a front end crash I wouldn't have expected them to put brand new oem xenons in for me, though I would have liked it

 

[stevesey]

a cupholder is proof that you drink whilst driving

Not necessarily - if you are using the cupholder you are not drinking - perhaps it's those of us without cupholder who are more likely to be drinking and driving.

 

[A210AMG]

I use my cupholder for

a) my phone
b) Babys bottles

 

[PXW]

I use my cupholder for

a) my phone
b) Babys bottles

Not a bad idea but I still think it's risky. A sharp eyed policeman will be able to spot that the bottle contains scotch rather than apple juice...drinking and driving AND using the phone - they'll throw away the keys

 

[Piff]

I was filling in an online application form for an insurance quote on one of the comparison sites last night and ticked the box for extras fitted. It then opened up a page with loads of boxes to tick for many possible extras.
I just ticked the tow bar box and at the end, just one company out of dozens would offer a quote!

 

[ringway]

I was filling in an online application form for an insurance quote on one of the comparison sites last night and ticked the box for extras fitted. It then opened up a page with loads of boxes to tick for many possible extras.
I just ticked the tow bar box and at the end, just one company out of dozens would offer a quote!

There you go: Declaration, you're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't.

They don't exactly encourage declaration of extras do they...