Are there any sensible economists left in Britain?

tommy2

Active Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2010
Messages
60
Dont underestimate our politicians,we are in debt,the whole world is in debt,and the best way to reduce debt, is with inflation. The best way to encourage inflation, is over supply of money, ie print money, just like banana republics have been doing for years, leading to failure, oh and Germany did it in the early 1930's. "But surely a modern day,western country would not do that" I hear you say, leading to savings being wiped out. The solution thay have come up with, is to give it a name,that they think will fool the public,"Quantitative easing",make no mistake the bank of England, have no intention of keeping inflation under control, quite the reverse. The only problem they have at the moment,is hiding the figures from the public,as it takes hold, but they managed to hide some 4000,000 people from showing up on the unemployment figures for years,so I guess they will find a way.
 

stevieb15

Active Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2009
Messages
868
Location
west sussex
Car
98 sl 500, 90 w126 500se, 03 CLK 320 Convertible, 90 W124 CE300
I am sure this is wrong. QE keeps the pound low- encouraging exports, reducing imports and discouraging deflation.

(I am not an economist but I do expect some people employed at the BoE are so I will assume they know what they are doing)

I think simply put provided growth is greater than the rate of inflation we don't have a problem, but when we have positive inflation and negative growth we have a real problem and the larger the delta the greater the problem
 

clever dicky

Active Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2010
Messages
421
Car
Jag
So what do you (they ) mean by growth exactly, if it isnt inflation? Turnover ? Then why not say that.

Of cause if just means the 'increase' in turnover it must relate to something.
How about the break even point?
Because most of us are already broke.
 

stevieb15

Active Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2009
Messages
868
Location
west sussex
Car
98 sl 500, 90 w126 500se, 03 CLK 320 Convertible, 90 W124 CE300
So what do you (they ) mean by growth exactly, if it isnt inflation? Turnover ? Then why not say that.

Of cause if just means the 'increase' in turnover it must relate to something.
How about the break even point?
Because most of us are already broke.
Not meant to be trite if it appears that way.
I think if our sales output period against period is greater than the input cost increase over the same period we have growth.
Right now it would appear to me we have no growth worth mentioning
 

grober

MB Master
Joined
Jun 22, 2003
Messages
28,181
Location
Perth, Scotland
Car
W204 C200CDI Estate
It's called the Monopoly Money Solution. No we are not going to borrow any more money from anyone else --- we are going to make it ourselves --so there. :p
 

Red C220

MB Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 30, 2011
Messages
4,196
Location
Surrey
Car
2015 SL400 : 2017 S6 Avant
Questions about QE. Forgive my ignorance.

1/ Where does the money come from?
If it's created, who creates it and how is this actually physically done? Is it electronic only?

2/ Where does the money go?

Are £50/£20 notes actually printed?
Is the money simply channeled into the financial institutions?

3/ Can someone explain to me in laymans terms how this directly helps the man on the street - the shafted business owner, the 4 million or so unemployed.

I understand this is necessary and having listened to the news on a few channels I'm still not entirely sure how it helps or physically how it's introduced into circulation.
 

SPX

MB Club Veteran
SUPPORTER
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
16,310
Location
Yorkshire
Car
That one
Questions about QE. Forgive my ignorance.

1/ Where does the money come from?
If it's created, who creates it and how is this actually physically done? Is it electronic only?

2/ Where does the money go?

Are £50/£20 notes actually printed?
Is the money simply channeled into the financial institutions?

3/ Can someone explain to me in laymans terms how this directly helps the man on the street - the shafted business owner, the 4 million or so unemployed.

I understand this is necessary and having listened to the news on a few channels I'm still not entirely sure how it helps or physically how it's introduced into circulation.
To answer questions 1 & 2;they won't print £75 billion, they just put some numbers on a screen and hey presto!

3. It means nothing to the man on the street, these idiots in charge just keep throwing money at the banks hoping they will 'fix' it instead.
 

Red C220

MB Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 30, 2011
Messages
4,196
Location
Surrey
Car
2015 SL400 : 2017 S6 Avant
To answer questions 1 & 2;they won't print £75 billion, they just put some numbers on a screen and hey presto!

3. It means nothing to the man on the street, these idiots in charge just keep throwing money at the banks hoping they will 'fix' it instead.

Here's the thing, I'm aware that is most people impression of what is going on.

So - who pressess the button - what screen does the hey presto appear on and who controls this newly produced money?

How is this money being thrown at banks? Is it being used as capital reserve to bolster their fractional reserves?

Is it simply sucked up into bonuses?

I'm genuinely interested in this but find it hard to get any form of straight answer.
 

SPX

MB Club Veteran
SUPPORTER
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
16,310
Location
Yorkshire
Car
That one
I see the economy like a smackhead;

If you just continue to supply the drug, you're just delaying the inevitable.

Instead, they should be going cold turkey and sweating the bad out.


I wouldn't trust that George Osbourne to run a bath, nevermind the economy.
 

SPX

MB Club Veteran
SUPPORTER
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
16,310
Location
Yorkshire
Car
That one
Here's the thing, I'm aware that is most people impression of what is going on.

So - who pressess the button - what screen does the hey presto appear on and who controls this newly produced money?

How is this money being thrown at banks? Is it being used as capital reserve to bolster their fractional reserves?

Is it simply sucked up into bonuses?

I'm genuinely interested in this but find it hard to get any form of straight answer.
I don't think that there is a definitive answer, it seems to me to be a waste of time pumping money into establishments that were the main reason why we're in this mess.
 

clever dicky

Active Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2010
Messages
421
Car
Jag
It seems to me to be a bit like a failing company. How's this scenario, and see if there are any similarities ...

No cash reserves in the bank but everyone at the top in the company gets paid well and gets a bonus.
The workers are asked to stay at home with out pay because there are no orders so management employ a few scabs to do the repetitive low paid work, while the skilled workers sit at home.
Because the company is on hard times all its prices have gone up.
There's no (actual ) money because there has been no sales, So the md puts a few quid in the cash float to pay the lunch time bar bill. Of course this will all come out of the workers pay when they get any, but they wont ever see any of it.
Eventually the company will be bought out and taken over. But if not the workers will strike or be laid off permanently. The building will suffer and fall into disrepair. The staff will nick all the plants and sell off any stock.
In twenty years when its all been forgotten, Tesco will come along and build a car park for its new store and sell the rest of the site to a developer who will build a block of flats. These will be rented by the workers who still have no jobs. The rents will be paid for by benefits. They will then call this growth and everyone will be happy.

The End.
 

NOMONEYBUTAMERC

MB Enthusiast
SUPPORTER
Joined
Aug 27, 2010
Messages
1,212
Location
Weston super Mare
Car
BMW X1 . Porsche 968 Boxster
I just love the fact that we can "produce" £75 billion to give to the banks so that they can consider lending more . Having some difficulty reconciling that with the letter my wife received on monday. This was to advise her that under planned changes in the welfare system it is probable that she will lose her ESA allowance in april 2012 . ( as the result of a stroke 3 years ago , at the age of 56, she is now disabled , limited mobilty , permanent tiredness ,etc) and was told by her consultant that she would never be able to work again . With some concern , she phoned the number given in the letter to enquire what alternative benefit she may get. The answer " if your husband works more than 24 hours a week , probably nothing " . Her benefit of £92 a week is "contributions based " , as she has worked for most of her adult life.On querying whether the fact that we have ( to us ) a fairly large monthly mortgage payment , she was advised that it would not be taken into account. I do not need an economist to point out that our economics willbe somewhat strained . Sorry to digress from the thread , but this Government is really winding me up . Perhaps I should tell one of my customers to **** off , get sacked , default on my mortgage , be made homeless , then present myself to the council to get looked after .:mad:
 

Dryce

MB Enthusiast
Joined
May 17, 2006
Messages
7,715
Car
..
So what do you (they ) mean by growth exactly, if it isnt inflation? Turnover ? Then why not say that.
It's supposed to be what the economy produces in goods and services.

So if we each produced £100 of goods last year then if we all manage £101 this year that's 1% growth.

There are issue as to how you measure the output value. If the value of £ fell by 10% then that £101 is really more like £90.90.

Banks and financial institutions contribute to what the economy produces. I think that has an ongoing contribution to the mindset problem. To understand where the country really is you have to revise the value of what the banks actually 'produce'.
 

clever dicky

Active Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2010
Messages
421
Car
Jag
I just love the fact that we can "produce" £75 billion to give to the banks so that they can consider lending more . Having some difficulty reconciling that with the letter my wife received on monday. This was to advise her that under planned changes in the welfare system it is probable that she will lose her ESA allowance in april 2012 . ( as the result of a stroke 3 years ago , at the age of 56, she is now disabled , limited mobilty , permanent tiredness ,etc) and was told by her consultant that she would never be able to work again . With some concern , she phoned the number given in the letter to enquire what alternative benefit she may get. The answer " if your husband works more than 24 hours a week , probably nothing " . Her benefit of £92 a week is "contributions based " , as she has worked for most of her adult life.On querying whether the fact that we have ( to us ) a fairly large monthly mortgage payment , she was advised that it would not be taken into account. I do not need an economist to point out that our economics willbe somewhat strained . Sorry to digress from the thread , but this Government is really winding me up . Perhaps I should tell one of my customers to **** off , get sacked , default on my mortgage , be made homeless , then present myself to the council to get looked after .:mad:
After having a stroke and not able to work, your wife can claim benefits. This is regardless of you working or any other benefit or pensions etc. You have to apply for Disability. Forget job centre benefit help / advice. (W@nkers)

Http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTa...itsAndOtherSupport/Disabledpeople/DG_10011925.


Believe me its not to be sniffed at, you can apply online or with forms. Certain phrases and 'key words to use so PM me if you want. This

Serious disability - she (you on her behalf,) can get full attendance allowance.
The other option is disability living allowance, which come in three stages.
It can get complicated but you need to apply.
When you do, you are eligible to claim for carers allowance. This give you some cash (only if your not working) but helps in other ways ie. reduced council tax etc. But your wife can also benefit by other help, social services can provide carers for help with cooking, washing etc. Then there's mobility allowance (payments for a car, adaptations etc. ) and Occupational support for hand rails and 'functional help.

You must get advice and the help you need. Nasty things strokes, Make sure your wife gets her neck scanned for blockages or anything likely to break off assuming she didnt have an aneurysm. To explain briefly, Corotid artery bifurcates, this is where build up occurs mostly. Bits break off get washed up to the brain and block blood vessals. The blood clots which cause even more. Without blood and Oxygen sections of the brain die. You can get an ultrasound scan to see how bad it is. Also ask for an HDL LDL homocysteine level check. Make sure she eat lots of B12, folic acid, and potassium rich foods, :bannana: which will help repair artery damage.
 
Last edited:

nick mercedes

MB Enthusiast
Joined
Jan 8, 2003
Messages
7,106
Location
far far away
Car
Ford Expedition
"This is the most serious financial crisis at least since the 1930s, if not ever,” bank chief Mervyn King said,"

So if Merv think's we've had it, there's not much hope.

Do we end up like Somalia or Nigeria?
 
OP
OP
davethemus

davethemus

Active Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2009
Messages
570
Location
glasgow
Car
mercedes c280 1999
mervin king looks too much like david starky to be taken seriously
 

nick mercedes

MB Enthusiast
Joined
Jan 8, 2003
Messages
7,106
Location
far far away
Car
Ford Expedition
mervin king looks too much like david starky to be taken seriously
Mervyn King: this may be worse than the Great Depression - Business News, Business - The Independent

"One of the reasons China's production industry is so successful is that they have a state bank which provides cheap finance to manufacturers. Similar circumstances helped to create Germany's "Wirtschaftswunder" before the political gaggle presently in Berlin got out of the asylum. Provide money for manufacturing industry, training and infrastructure. Make what you and others need instead of paying China to do it. Do not give the money to robber banks. And tell the woodentop at the Bank of England that it is not his job to make loud gloomy predictions in a casino economy. Can somebody please explain to him what a self-fulfilling prophecy is"
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Top Bottom