Billy's W124 Coupe Project

[kth286]

..interesting

i didn't know the lower control arm can be adjusted as well??

If i'm reading the above info correctly, am i able to move the bottom control arm inwards slightly..?

As you know roads are not flat, but consist of crests and dips, therefore the suspension will both compress and expand.

Question is how much can your suspension expand before the tyres rub against wing at 70 mph ? Expansion causes the wheels to become more positive.

As a test I would be jacking the rear corners up inch by inch until they rub, then at least you will know how much allowance you have.

 

[RBYCC]

..interesting

i didn't know the lower control arm can be adjusted as well??

If i'm reading the above info correctly, am i able to move the bottom control arm inwards slightly..?

Billy

It appears that the early assembly drawing showed a rear camber adjustment which never made it to production as WDB124066 indicated.

Looking at your pix, you don't seem that far out of spec with the drop you have.

Ed A.

 

[mazza]

As you know roads are not flat, but consist of crests and dips, therefore the suspension will both compress and expand.

Question is how much can your suspension expand before the tyres rub against wing at 70 mph ? Expansion causes the wheels to become more positive.

As a test I would be jacking the rear corners up inch by inch until they rub, then at least you will know how much allowance you have.

inch by inch??? he should be so lucky, we are talking mm's with the stance

suspension travel has been calculated and tested

example

mazza

 

[WDB124066]

..interesting

i didn't know the lower control arm can be adjusted as well??

If i'm reading the above info correctly, am i able to move the bottom control arm inwards slightly..?

As far as I am concerned it is the best way to adjust camber, by shortening the spring link centres. So far I can think of doing it one of three ways.

Plug and redrill the outboard spring link hole 5 mm closer to the other hole = not adjustable.
Put in a set of those cam bushes RBYCC posted from K-mac = adjustable.
Slot your subframe mounts and put cam lock bolts in at the inboard end = adjustable.

Check your subframe mounts if you can, they just may be slotted already..??


The Engineer in me doesn't like these threaded adjustable camber arms, they carry a lot of load from tension to compression on each suspension movement cycle, you may notice MB and almost everybody else avoids this on threaded assemblies as they give more reliable performance when principally loaded in one main direction - not constantly changing their main load direction.
The thought of replacing that big heavy section camber link with a little bit of threaded rod and lock nuts grates with me a bit, although they probably work well in the real world - for a while...??

That's all Billy, your post yesterday got me thinking a little - maybe I think too much...??

 

[WDB124066]

As a side issue the optimist in me would really like to know if and for how long the adjustable rear spring link made it into production. I saved that picture of the wagon as it looked to me like it had, although it is possible it has the cambushes.

Slots in the subframe mounts would give it away, has anybody ever seen subframe holes slotted where the little red bushes are in this pic...?

 

[RBYCC]

I found a pic of the W201 rear suspension when it was at the pre introduction phase.



Appears to be an eccentric or cam bolt on the LCA

The real answer is probably contained in this 1983 SAE paper:

http://papers.sae.org/831045/

 

[WDB124066]

Now that would be a good read, did you download it...?

 

[WDB124066]

If anyone has pictures of this area of the subframe without the spring link in place I sure would appreciate it if you could post it, if they are slotted all you need will be cambolts.

 

[WDB124066]

^^ ^^

 

[kth286]

As a side issue the optimist in me would really like to know if and for how long the adjustable rear spring link made it into production. I saved that picture of the wagon as it looked to me like it had, although it is possible it has the cambushes.

Slots in the subframe mounts would give it away, has anybody ever seen subframe holes slotted where the little red bushes are in this pic...?

NIL slots in my 1995 coupe subframe at those points.

 

[carat 3.6]

Yes it is is AFAIC. 4a is toe and is still in use but 3A was cancelled early on if I remember correctly.

The eccentric bolt in the torque arm (3a) was a design carry over from the 190, they didn't include it after April 1986.

The mounting hole in the subframe for the lower arm is not slotted, but it looks like there would just be enough room to modify it for use with an eccentric bolt. It would only be a few mm of movement though...

 

[WDB124066]

I see, might only need 5 mm or so. Would it be a good fit for a cambolt, would the cam rub on the subframe pressing on the line through the two holes without touching the top and bottom of the subframe pressing...??

 

[carat 3.6]

I see, might only need 5 mm or so. Would it be a good fit for a cambolt, would the cam rub on the subframe pressing on the line through the two holes without touching the top and bottom of the subframe pressing...??

Difficult to say until you tried it, perhaps borrow the cambolt from from the other link and see how much room it needs?

 

[WDB124066]

Yes, that's it, the cambolt with the round head [and a sockethead drive] it saves room.
I don't have mine apart so I can't get in there and have a look but the cam needs to rotate touching on the subframe retainer location only on the line between the two mounting bolts on the spring link. If you look at that T model shot I put up before it looks to me like they may have cut a bit of the return on the subframe lobe to get the cam rubbing in the correct location...

 

[WDB124066]

relax bruv....

good things comes to those who wait..hehe

mazza

Mazza, this looks indicative, what have you got tucked away up your sleeve for Billy – anything we should know about....??

 

[mazza]

Mazza, this looks indicative, what have you got tucked away up your sleeve for Billy – anything we should know about....??

Hey

Billy should be ok with the present Camber but if he ever plans to replace the camber/pull/push/track with new struts, then why not make the whole lot adjustable.

This may not be to everyone's taste and some may even oppose but can be done and more importantly, can be done using parts that have been tested under much harder conditions compared to everyday driving.

Billy's car will go through some handling tests when its turn key ready, but so far so good..rear end feels fine and we all love a nice bit of rear end dont we...hehe

cheers
mazza

 

[WDB124066]

Would be alright if Billy took a video during these " handling tests"......

I keep seeing Ed's 11's and wonder if there was a vid?

 

[mazza]

Would be alright if Billy took a video during these " handling tests"......

Its funny you should say that, I have been talking to my IT man to sort me out with a a camera system to rig to my 16v.

Cameras will go on suspensions areas and film the suspension at work, this would also include the ARB .

I think Mr.Carat is also planning to have Billys car detailed in some special way, so cameras will also be strategically placed for that event.

something like this I believe... disclaimer"if you are under 16 plse leave this thread, or ask your dad if its ok to look..he'll be looking"

mazza

 

[BillyW124]

cameras will also be strategically placed for that event.



mazza

hahaha!

 

[WDB124066]

Check out the spring link mount on this Braubus 6.5 124!

Brabus - Cars for Sale - BRABUS 6.5 (E 500 W124)