Caught doing 79mph in a 70 zone

[DuFFmAn]

Hey Guys,

Just got a letter through the post for doing 79mph in a 70 zone and I am 100'000% sure I was not speeding!.. I recall the van that caught me, I recall my exact speed of being no more than 70mph (Using Satnav).

What on earth do I do now? How do I prove it that I wasn't speeding? How do I prove that their sh*tty guns are useless and do not work!..

Sorry for the rant. It's crap like this that does my head in. I pay my taxes to get taxed!!!!!!!

Any ideas on what to do next? So far I've just received a letter asking who the driver was. I have 28 days to respond.

 

[st4]

Ask to see the calibration certificate of the gun, pictures/evidence etc...

Challenge in court if you are 100% sure you were not speeding.

 

[Stratman]

pepipoo

 

[tippandy]

Hi, If you are that sure of your speed then you need to challenge the calibration of the device that was used to record your speed. Not sure how you do this but maybe some of the others can help, I would think it needs to be done as a matter of urgency though.

Andy

 

[Neilos]

pepipoo

Cheers, good link, there is some helpfull stuff in there.

I find it grim that it even needs to exist though

 

[Neilos]

Hey Guys,

Just got a letter through the post for doing 79mph in a 70 zone and I am 100'000% sure I was not speeding!.. I recall the van that caught me, I recall my exact speed of being no more than 70mph (Using Satnav).

What on earth do I do now? How do I prove it that I wasn't speeding? How do I prove that their sh*tty guns are useless and do not work!..

Sorry for the rant. It's crap like this that does my head in. I pay my taxes to get taxed!!!!!!!

Any ideas on what to do next? So far I've just received a letter asking who the driver was. I have 28 days to respond.

About 10 years ago, I too was absolutely sure, but when I contested, the photo they sent me was from a different part of the road.
Be sure, real sure before you contest. I got hammered, i'm sure its because I insisted they had it wrong and wanted to contest in court

 

[nick.ged]

i got a summons for speeding on my bike about a year ago. i knew i haddent done it and contedsted it.
when i sent a pic of my bike in, it turned out it was a cloned bike with my reg on it but it took a lot of proving on my part, the system was set up to convict the registerd keeper no matter what.

 

[martin_a]

If you are sure, check pepipoo and try to remember everythign you can about it. What was your speedo showing? To get a reading of 79 your speedo (not sat nav) would have been showing above 80mph. Did the sat nav have full satellite link? If it was missing a part of the signal it won't have been accurate... Also, was there anything else on the road? Anythign in the way of their view of you etc etc. I remember one of the bike mags managing to clock a wall doing 30+mph just because of the angle they were at!

m.

 

[NormanC]

Don't forget that your Sat Nav isn't necessarily accurate.

In addition to any inbuilt inaccuracy with its speed calculating algorithm, it can be influenced by where you are, time of day, number of satellites, level of solar radiation (i.e. sunspots), local level of electromagnetic radiation/interference, etc., etc.

I think it would, in practical terms, be impossible for you to prove how accurate your Sat Nav was as some time in the past and don't forget that it will be up to you to prove that they are wrong!!

 

[chiefski26]

Just got a letter through the post for doing 79mph in a 70 zone and I am 100'000% sure I was not speeding!

are you sure ?

 

[chiefski26]

sent you pm

 

[Matt's Dad]

I had to fight a speeding ticket for one of my HGV’s - it took months of letters going backwards and forwards, and numerous confirmation by me that I would take it to court. I eventually got a letter saying no further action would be taken.

Just aswell, as they were claiming my truck was doing 62mph in a 30 zone - even though all my trucks are limited to 52mph, and it was a flat section of road with built up traffic - AND I could show the drivers tachograph chart!

Also, on a separate occasion I received a NIP through the post for my Wife’s car - after the above battle with the law, I was a bit bitter, so decided to be a bit awkward - I said as the car was insured for my complete family, and the alleged offence was so near to my house and family business, I couldn’t be sure who was driving at that time, and asked for a photo as proof of the driver. The photo came back, and it was taken from the rear of the car (strange as it was a camera van) - I wrote back and said as the picture was taken of the rear of the vehicle, I didn’t know for sure who was driving. I got a reply saying no further action will be taken, with a lot of paperwork explaining why I must make a note of who drives the car

 

[jonnyboy]

Also, on a separate occasion I received a NIP through the post for my Wife’s car - after the above battle with the law, I was a bit bitter, so decided to be a bit awkward - I said as the car was insured for my complete family, and the alleged offence was so near to my house and family business, I couldn’t be sure who was driving at that time, and asked for a photo as proof of the driver. The photo came back, and it was taken from the rear of the car (strange as it was a camera van) - I wrote back and said as the picture was taken of the rear of the vehicle, I didn’t know for sure who was driving. I got a reply saying no further action will be taken, with a lot of paperwork explaining why I must make a note of who drives the car

i'd love more info on this as i am currently fighting a "failure to identify driver" with little success.

 

[LTD]

Clean licence ?

Mmmm ....

 

[Neilos]

Don't forget that your Sat Nav isn't necessarily accurate.

In addition to any inbuilt inaccuracy with its speed calculating algorithm, it can be influenced by where you are, time of day, number of satellites, level of solar radiation (i.e. sunspots), local level of electromagnetic radiation/interference, etc., etc.

I think it would, in practical terms, be impossible for you to prove how accurate your Sat Nav was as some time in the past and don't forget that it will be up to you to prove that they are wrong!!

Norman, are you absolutely sure about that. i'm not saying your wrong, because i really don't know myself, I don't even own a satnav, but almost everyone I know who does own one, says they are very accurate, as long as the reading is taken on the flat, not going up or down hill.

 

[Matt's Dad]

i'd love more info on this as i am currently fighting a "failure to identify driver" with little success.

I didn’t know if I’d get anywhere, but thought I’ve got nothing to loose - So I wrote back saying I was dreadfully sorry, but I couldn’t remember who was driving that car at that time (I was careful with my wording, as a friend had said previously that he couldn’t remember if it was him or his Wife driving - his photo wasn’t that clear, but they said the figure driving was of a mans build, and not a Women’s???)

I got all sorts of letters, and they seemed to get more and more threatening - but I maintained that I needed photographic proof, as I honestly didn’t know who the driver was at the time. When they did send the picture through, it was very clear, and it was obvious it was one of my cars - but the photo was taken of the rear and partial side of the car.

When I received the letter stating no further action would be taken, it said I had a legal duty to keep a record of who drives each vehicle - But as far as I know, there isn’t a penalty for ‘not being able to remember things’

I kept the picture and put it on the wall in the office

 

[Neilos]

I didn’t know if I’d get anywhere, but thought I’ve got nothing to loose - So I wrote back saying I was dreadfully sorry, but I couldn’t remember who was driving that car at that time (I was careful with my wording, as a friend had said previously that he couldn’t remember if it was him or his Wife driving - his photo wasn’t that clear, but they said the figure driving was of a mans build, and not a Women’s???)

I got all sorts of letters, and they seemed to get more and more threatening - but I maintained that I needed photographic proof, as I honestly didn’t know who the driver was at the time. When they did send the picture through, it was very clear, and it was obvious it was one of my cars - but the photo was taken of the rear and partial side of the car.

When I received the letter stating no further action would be taken, it said I had a legal duty to keep a record of who drives each vehicle - But as far as I know, there isn’t a penalty for ‘not being able to remember things’

I kept the picture and put it on the wall in the office

Be interesting to know if it would work a second time with the same owner

 

[NormanC]

Norman, are you absolutely sure about that. i'm not saying your wrong, because i really don't know myself, I don't even own a satnav, but almost everyone I know who does own one, says they are very accurate, as long as the reading is taken on the flat, not going up or down hill.

I'm sure!! But what do you define as very accurate. Personally, accurate to me in this case would be within +/- 1% and very accurate within +/- 0.1%. At mere accurate were talking of an error of +/- 0.5 mph at 50 mph and none of the Sat Navs that I have owned have displayed anything but whole numbers!

The only way to check is to use a stopwatch and a measured mile (anything shorter justs creates errors) and measure the time taken at a steady speed.

Problems:-

Where do you find an exact measured mile? I know that there is one at MIRA and possibly at Bruntingthorpe but where else? Don't forget that the posts alongside a motorway are placed where suitable and NOT an accurate distance apart. If it's a bit hard to dig a hole they'll move along a bit to find some softer ground.

How do you hold an exact steady speed? I don't know!! Don't forget that at 50mph a 1mph variation is a 2% error!

How accurate is your stopwatch? It really needs to be certified by a chronometer authority. They are available (I have one but I've lost the certificate!!) but are expensive and have to be bought specifically.

Without being rude to anyone, can I just ask how people KNOW that their Sat Navs are accurate? I think that it is just a perception rather than a known fact, as they probably read a bit less than the car speedo so are deemed "accurate".

Certainly, the positioning of any typical Sat Nav isn't very accurate (I think that no better than +/- 7m is typical or am I wrong). To get to a high level of accuracy you need to spend an awful lot of money. This will then get you a system similar to those used by reputable motoring magazines for carrying out performance tests.

I will try and find the photo that I have of my Sat Nav showing that my maximum speed was 1263mph. Not even my Celica gets up to Mach 2!! Perhaps I should question the Sat Nav's accuracy.

But remember... I'm only some idiot on the internet!!

 

[Neilos]

I'm sure!! But what do you define as very accurate. Personally, accurate to me in this case would be within +/- 1% and very accurate within +/- 0.1%. At mere accurate were talking of an error of +/- 0.5 mph at 50 mph and none of the Sat Navs that I have owned have displayed anything but whole numbers!

The only way to check is to use a stopwatch and a measured mile (anything shorter justs creates errors) and measure the time taken at a steady speed.

Problems:-

Where do you find an exact measured mile? I know that there is one at MIRA and possibly at Bruntingthorpe but where else? Don't forget that the posts alongside a motorway are placed where suitable and NOT an accurate distance apart. If it's a bit hard to dig a hole they'll move along a bit to find some softer ground.

How do you hold an exact steady speed? I don't know!! Don't forget that at 50mph a 1mph variation is a 2% error!

How accurate is your stopwatch? It really needs to be certified by a chronometer authority. They are available (I have one but I've lost the certificate!!) but are expensive and have to be bought specifically.

Without being rude to anyone, can I just ask how people KNOW that their Sat Navs are accurate? I think that it is just a perception rather than a known fact, as they probably read a bit less than the car speedo so are deemed "accurate".

Certainly, the positioning of any typical Sat Nav isn't very accurate (I think that no better than +/- 7m is typical or am I wrong). To get to a high level of accuracy you need to spend an awful lot of money. This will then get you a system similar to those used by reputable motoring magazines for carrying out performance tests.

I will try and find the photo that I have of my Sat Nav showing that my maximum speed was 1263mph. Not even my Celica gets up to Mach 2!! Perhaps I should question the Sat Nav's accuracy.

But remember... I'm only some idiot on the internet!!

Ha ha, mate I love that, showing 1263mph, you sure your not a fighter pilot!
So I take it there is indeed, a fair margin of error

I'm not questioning you opinion Norman, i'm very gratefull that you have given the time for such an eloquent reply.
If that is the case, and they are within 2%, then that is fairly accurate, but I guess, unlike a car speedo that ALWAYS over reads, this could be either way with the satnav?

I was going to go for a Garmin Zumo 660 waterproof motorcycle one, so I can use it on my various bikes, car and van. Around £500, so have been hesitating and gathering info before taking the plunge.
The speedos on all my machines seem to vary wildly, so I was hoping the satnav would give me some idea of whats what.

I'm not one for speeding, but my sprinter, argh, that seems ludicrously out at 30mph, and it torments me thinking i'm slowing others down sticking to indicated 30, and worry every time I sit at 35 incase I get a ticket, just can't take the pressure

 

[219]

I don't know about the accuracy of satnavs either , although I have observed that they read 'slightly' less than the speedometers of any vehicles I have been driving . Typically , 70 on the satnav corresponds to an indicated 74 or so on my W126 speedo - I have never had a problem setting my cruise control to the satnav 70 .

There are a pair of milestones on Turnhouse Road , Edinburgh , which I know L&B police used to use to check speedos against - that was 25--30 years ago . I'd guess the biggest variable is how close to the markers the stopwatch is pressed . Probably the best bet is to time over a much longer known distance - perhaps between two motorway junctions , distance verified by OS maps , 'flying' start at a set speed on cruise control and constant speed maintained for 10,20 or more miles : the longer the distance , the less significant errors will become .

Of course , if you have access to a calibrated 'fifth wheel' setup then you have the definitive answer , but not many do .

I wonder how accurate the roadside electronic signs : your speed ....... are ? I guess some racetracks have accurate speed measuring equipment ? What about MOT test 'rolling roads' - how accurately are they calibrated ?