Has UK enough generating power for electric cars , heat pumps and all other requirements

[Doodle]

If it was true the network would crash every morning and especially on Winter mornings

Grid capacity is planned to cope with the peaks. Most of the time the network is operating at a tiny fraction of its capacity

Which is part of the appeal of EVs which use batteries and energy from off peak charging. It’s drawing energy overnight or at least off peak

That's generation, not distribution. The former is easily and routinely changed to meet planned demand, but has to operate within the limits of the latter.

There were plans to upgrade the substation to support a new development but that's been canned by the local council so SSE are still dragging their heels, and this is the crux of the matter. We have time yet to figure out the capacity requirements (both in generation and distribution) to meet the demands of the future, but only if the politicians, beancounters and overpaid boards pull their fingers out and get on with it.

 

[Dryce]

So if I switch from a 200 watt to a 100 watt light bulb hanging from the centre of a living room, I won't be able to reduce my lighting bill any further?

Switching from a 250 watt desktop PC to a 150 watt PC - will be as far as we can go?

So take your 100w and replace it with a 9w LED or previous low energy types and that's major *overt* saving.

take your PC down (or use a laptop where you'd maybe use a desktop0.

And then physics and nature play their tricks. That bulb at 100W on a winter evening 'wasted' energy as warmth - so your heating system works that bit harder. Again that computer in your house in winter put out warmth. So your heating system works a bit harder. If it's gas you use then your electricity bill is saved - but if using electricity to heat then not so much.

There's no point in improving home insulation, because our homes and offices are as thermally perfect as they'll ever be?

Les point in *further* inmproving home insulation beyond a given point.

When I replaced my 20 year old boiler, we saw a 30% reduction in our gas usage, just from the boiler change alone.

Yes - and a further 30% reduction would in absolute terms be smaller. If technology doesn't get you that jump next time - maybe 10% then really you're only getting 7% against the original.

As I said earlier, if we push up our electricity consumption by a 33%, we would be back to 2005 electricity consumption levels. We've already reduced our electricity consumption by 25% in two decades, despite the increased population and the new electricity applications.

As I mentioned - reduction in industry plus shifts in technology. If you take lighting down from 100W to 10W then you can't save 90W again.

Boiler and refrigeration and computer were the three big impact items in our household in the last 15 years. Insulation and windows less noticeable - but we already had older double glazing and a lot of insulation as a starting point for those. It's hard to find an equivalent big impact approach to take things further.

If we changed to electric heating and switched to EVs with mainly home charging then our electricity consumption would likely double or triple.

 

[markjay]

That's generation, not distribution. The former is easily and routinely changed to meet planned demand, but has to operate within the limits of the latter.

There were plans to upgrade the substation to support a new development but that's been canned by the local council so SSE are still dragging their heels, and this is the crux of the matter. We have time yet to figure out the capacity requirements (both in generation and distribution) to meet the demands of the future, but only if the politicians, beancounters and overpaid boards pull their fingers out and get on with it.

What you describe goes back to the age-old debate of where the power should lie, with central government or with local councils. There are good arguments both ways.

But ultimately, if local councils have the power, then they can override central government initiatives (and then you get alarmist 'postcode lottery' articles in the Daily Mail...).

I am lucky enough to live in Westminster where the council has been encouraging the uptake of EV for over 5 years now, with public chargers everywhere, free resident parking permits, free parking in pay-and-display bays, etc.

Other councils have other priorities and spend their budgets differently. Perhaps they worked-out that promoting EV ownership is not a vote winner among their constituents.

The government can only do that much to get local councils onboard their nationwide plans.

 

[BTB 500]

If we changed to electric heating and switched to EVs with mainly home charging then our electricity consumption would likely double or triple.

At the rates that apply from 1st April our annual electricity bill will be £500 (1,100 kWh), so we're in much the same boat. We've already had all the 'quick wins' e.g. changing to LED lighting throughout the entire property, so there's really no cost/benefit case for replacing big appliances to chase small improvements in efficiency.

Same with gas. We have a 30+ year old gas Rayburn (Aga) that does heating/hot water/cooking, plus a separate 4-ring gas hob. From April 1st our annual cost for gas will be £1,000 (15,000 kWh), so a 30% improvement in efficiency would save £300 a year. That's significant, but so is the up-front cost of a new boiler (and a new oven in our case) - 15 years to break even?

 

[markjay]

At the rates that apply from 1st April our annual electricity bill will be £500 (1,100 kWh), so we're in much the same boat. We've already had all the 'quick wins' e.g. changing to LED lighting throughout the entire property, so there's really no cost/benefit case for replacing big appliances to chase small improvements in efficiency.

Same with gas. We have a 30+ year old gas Rayburn (Aga) that does heating/hot water/cooking, plus a separate 4-ring gas hob. From April 1st our annual cost for gas will be £1,000 (15,000 kWh), so a 30% improvement in efficiency would save £300 a year. That's significant, but so is the up-front cost of a new boiler (and a new oven in our case) - 15 years to break even?

True, though you should amortise the current appliances. A typical boiler is good for 10 to 15 years, and so you're only 'losing' the remaining service life, depending on the original installation date. Or you could wait for the current boiler to need replacing before changing etc.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

So take your 100w and replace it with a 9w LED or previous low energy types and that's major *overt* saving.

take your PC down (or use a laptop where you'd maybe use a desktop0.

And then physics and nature play their tricks. That bulb at 100W on a winter evening 'wasted' energy as warmth - so your heating system works that bit harder. Again that computer in your house in winter put out warmth. So your heating system works a bit harder. If it's gas you use then your electricity bill is saved - but if using electricity to heat then not so much.


Les point in *further* inmproving home insulation beyond a given point.


Yes - and a further 30% reduction would in absolute terms be smaller. If technology doesn't get you that jump next time - maybe 10% then really you're only getting 7% against the original.



As I mentioned - reduction in industry plus shifts in technology. If you take lighting down from 100W to 10W then you can't save 90W again.

Boiler and refrigeration and computer were the three big impact items in our household in the last 15 years. Insulation and windows less noticeable - but we already had older double glazing and a lot of insulation as a starting point for those. It's hard to find an equivalent big impact approach to take things further.

If we changed to electric heating and switched to EVs with mainly home charging then our electricity consumption would likely double or triple.

So you think that the whole country is all well insulated and using efficient heat and light? In London, we’re so poor that a lot of people still don’t even have double glazing

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

So you think that the whole country is all well insulated and using efficient heat and light? In London, we’re so poor that a lot of people still don’t even have double glazing

It’s grim down South.

 

[GeeJayW]

It’s grim down South.

‘appen


Cardboard box!!

 

[BTB 500]

True, though you should amortise the current appliances. A typical boiler is good for 10 to 15 years, and so you're only 'losing' the remaining service life, depending on the original installation date. Or you could wait for the current boiler to need replacing before changing etc.

I think not changing a boiler until you have to generally makes the most sense financially - that's certainly been the advice I've had from professionals in the past! I suspect the 10-15 year lifespan that's often quoted is a bit pessimistic for older/simpler models. I lived in my first two houses for 21 and 16 years respectively and the boilers already in them when we moved in were still going strong when we left.

 

[markjay]

"Asda switches off electric car charging points"

MSN

 

[zipdip]

Well there is no way there is enough electricity,but thankfully EV's are not catching on,and Heat pumps are another dead loss,lets look at the pumps,3 years ago the government made enough money available to fit 750 systems to homes,amd it was decided to use Newcastle as it was deemed a cold city?anyway households were asked would they be interested in having the systems fitted for free,thousands said yes please we would like more info,after that when they found out that all the rads would be removed and all the old pipework just 13 decided to do it,and thats where the problem is it is not just old houses that are unsuitable,but new ones as well,many of those will have micro bore feeding the heating system and thats no good,also floors have to come up and many new house have chipboard floors.
For me we need Nuclear power and make enough electricity to heat all the properties all thats happening at the moment is they have set these crazy green ideals a time limit and none of them can be met,and no matter if it is air to air, heat pumps orHydrogen none will be the answer.

 

[ALFAitalia]

At the rates that apply from 1st April our annual electricity bill will be £500 (1,100 kWh), so we're in much the same boat. We've already had all the 'quick wins' e.g. changing to LED lighting throughout the entire property, so there's really no cost/benefit case for replacing big appliances to chase small improvements in efficiency.

Same with gas. We have a 30+ year old gas Rayburn (Aga) that does heating/hot water/cooking, plus a separate 4-ring gas hob. From April 1st our annual cost for gas will be £1,000 (15,000 kWh), so a 30% improvement in efficiency would save £300 a year. That's significant, but so is the up-front cost of a new boiler (and a new oven in our case) - 15 years to break even?

Pretty much the same combined bill as me... I pay £ 150 per month for both fuels on a fixed rate.... so about £1800 per year...... but we usually over pay by two or three hundred a year.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

It’s grim down South.

Aye.

I hear tell that in Scotland and Germany, they triple glaze their houses and double glaze their garages.

No wonder these folks from up North think there are no further energy gains to be had from insulation and boiler updates.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I think not changing a boiler until you have to generally makes the most sense financially - that's certainly been the advice I've had from professionals in the past! I suspect the 10-15 year lifespan that's often quoted is a bit pessimistic for older/simpler models. I lived in my first two houses for 21 and 16 years respectively and the boilers already in them when we moved in were still going strong when we left.

When we changed our 20 year old boiler in 2020, our annual gas usage dropped by a third. Which was nice.

Octopus project our bill for 2024/5 to be £950. (6 bed house)

Sadly changing the boiler eliminated the dry heat in our airing cupboard because there's no heat loss from the boiler and hot water tank. Modern boilers don't leak heat.

 

[rf065]

Aye.

I hear tell that in Scotland and Germany, they triple glaze their houses and double glaze their garages.

No wonder these folks from up North think there are no further energy gains to be had from insulation and boiler updates.

I've seen triple glazing advertised in Scotland, never seen it in anyones house though, maybe not all you hear is true? Never saw double glazing in a garage either, not many even have windows.

 

[BTB 500]

When we changed our 20 year old boiler in 2020, our annual gas usage dropped by a third. Which was nice.

Octopus project our bill for 2024/5 to be £950. (6 bed house)

Sadly changing the boiler eliminated the dry heat in our airing cupboard because there's no heat loss from the boiler and hot water tank

What was the cost of replacing the boiler, and had the old one died?

Interesting about the airing cupboard - that's similar to @Dryce 's earlier point about 'wasted' energy from less efficient lights/appliances providing some degree of heating.

 

[DrNick]

When we changed our 20 year old boiler in 2020, our annual gas usage dropped by a third. Which was nice.

Octopus project our bill for 2024/5 to be £950. (6 bed house)

Sadly changing the boiler eliminated the dry heat in our airing cupboard because there's no heat loss from the boiler and hot water tank. Modern boilers don't leak heat.

Can use a dehumidifier. It will work well in the confined space of an airing cupboard. Certainly much better than a tumble dryer.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I've seen triple glazing advertised in Scotland, never seen it in anyones house though, maybe not all you hear is true? Never saw double glazing in a garage either, not many even have windows.

Ah, so maybe there is potential to insulate better "up North" as well as in the impoverished South East.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Can use a dehumidifier. It will work well in the confined space of an airing cupboard. Certainly much better than a tumble dryer.

SWMBO refuses to use our tumble dryer. She's now a washing line addict.

It's good to have Staff.

 

[BTB 500]

I hear tell that in Scotland and Germany, they triple glaze their houses and double glaze their garages.

Joking aside, in Germany they have all sorts of rules that apply now when you buy a house ... the heating, insulation, etc. have to meet all sorts of standards. This has seriously affected the market for older properties due to the cost (and inconvenience) of doing this ... it's easier to just buy a newer place that already complies.