Help me choose a Summer-fun classic-car

[mattc]

an old nissan?

one of these?

 

[manalishi]

What's that, Matt?

I couldn't think of a classic Datsun when I started out. I guess there are fairly modern kei series Nissans (probably similar to the Honda Beat, Mazda AZ1, etc), but that's an oldy. Not one of those rarities that now fetches £20k?

BlackC55 - so the chassis is over-designed for safety? Same true of the Brabus-tweaked version?

 

[Bellow]

Bellow - OK, let's put the Smart Roadster back on the list. Budget might just stretch to a Brabus version.

That Montecarlo does look good!
Roadster - first advice is take your time to decide which one.
There are some fantastically helpful (just steer clear of the winter tyre threads!) fora and even better 'how to' guide sites such as Evilution and FQ101 for smarts.

If you want a car that handles don't buy a Smart roadster. They handle terribly. The understeer is horrendus!

Curable? How bad compared to a standard fortwo?

My fortwo came with 145 front tyres and 175 rears and the understeer was a joke. Next tried the 175 on the front and 195 rear - much improved, but not perfect. Next, fitted Roadster steel wheels (wider than previous alloys) with 195s all round. Understeer banished.
Is similar not possible with the Roadster?

I've never driven a Roadster but I do remember the road tests criticising the understeer, and the general consensus was that they were more fun on the steel wheels and narrower rubber.
Noticably, the fortwo has a rear anti-roll bar whereas the Roadster does not. First tweak?

I also found that driving technique made a world of difference as to how it handled. Took me a lot longer to master than I would have expected!

 

[camerafodder]

A guy I know had the Brabus roadster. I think our company Navara with manual box was quicker!

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Real petrolheads have Monte Carlos. That red one looks incredible

 

[Bellow]

A guy I know had the Brabus roadster. I think our company Navara with manual box was quicker!

Depends how far up the brief performance is.
No one pretends smarts are quick. What they offer is something entirely different. Not available since the demise of fun little roadsters such as the Midget etc.

Has the MGF been suggested yet?

 

[prprandall51]

In order to help boost the chances of the MonteCarlo, here are some snaps of mine looking tasty:

And here it is after a quick, hard, memorable lesson about lift-off oversteer:

 

[wemorgan]

^ looks fantastic, except the last photo that is.

Lancia Montecarlo Spider Series 2 For Sale (1981) on Car And Classic UK

 

[bpsorrel]

Telking of Lancias, a few years ago, I had a couple of very fun years with a Delta Integrale. It was only the 8 valve, but it went like stink and was a great deal of fun!! I think the 8 valve versions are still fairly reasonable to buy and contrary to what some people may tell you, they ARE fast and fun!

 

[manalishi]

And here it is after a quick, hard, memorable lesson about lift-off oversteer:

Crikey. Glad you're here to tell the tale.

I did spin my previous X1/9 once. In Leeds at low speed (downhill turning into a side road with a change of camber). It did a 180-degree spin within its own body length. Another lesson in mid-engines and 'low polar moment of inertia' that I remembered LJKS mentioning.

Luckily for me, I ended up nestled into the curb as if I'd just done some stunt parking.

 

[manalishi]

^ looks fantastic, except the last photo that is.

Lancia Montecarlo Spider Series 2 For Sale (1981) on Car And Classic UK

Yes - it's now a very nice one. It was the one I mentioned earlier that the dealer had scooped up for £4000 on Ebay. There are a couple more here: Richard Thorne Classic Cars

Montecarlo definitely has the rarity factor going for it. Maybe 5 for sale at the moment. CRX and X1/9 both have perhaps 10 for sale, so still quite rare. (MX5s... squillions for sale)

Smart Roadster... conflicting views. Well, I won't know until/unless I drive one. But it is about fun in the curves and not raw straight-line performance (otherwise the 85bhp X1/9 would have been ditched very early!)

Lancia Delta I'd overlooked. Were they LHD-only? (fingers crossed)

 

[prprandall51]

..I think the 8 valve versions are still fairly reasonable to buy and contrary to what some people may tell you, they ARE fast and fun!

Who would ever say that a Delta Integrale was not fast or fun? They were legendary.

 

[Howard]

There's an article in Classic Car this month on small racers , original mini coopers , old renault gordinis etc ...

They've got Paddy Hopkirk driving them around Herts ....

Worth a read ...

Just to clarify , it's not 'Classic Car' , it's 'Practical Classics'

Honestly , i can't recommend the CRX VTEC enough , when you test drive it , just make sure you VTEC it , when i was selling mine , everyone who was test driving it went to change up at 6k .... i was saying 'Go on , Go on !! You've got 2k more to go !! '

The VTEC noise is addictive ! like a touring car whine ! The CRX's go forever as long as you change the oil every 6k miles , rust can be a problem as can the usual rips in the drivers seat , but all is curable and all parts are available easily.

There's very little torque in them , so to get the best out of them you have to keep it on the boil ..... but thats part of the fun ...

 

[prprandall51]

Yes - it's now a very nice one. It was the one I mentioned earlier that the dealer had scooped up for £4000 on Ebay. There are a couple more here: Richard Thorne Classic Cars

Montecarlo definitely has the rarity factor going for it. Maybe 5 for sale at the moment. CRX and X1/9 both have perhaps 10 for sale, so still quite rare. (MX5s... squillions for sale)

Smart Roadster... conflicting views. Well, I won't know until/unless I drive one. But it is about fun in the curves and not raw straight-line performance (otherwise the 85bhp X1/9 would have been ditched very early!)

Lancia Delta I'd overlooked. Were they LHD-only? (fingers crossed)

If you are seriously thinking of a MonteCarlo I have some suggestions on things to look out for:

Although the twin headlamp conversion looks better, it is a serious dent to its originality. Likewise the painted nose panels, bumpers and body kits. The best colour to ameliorate the issues with the original parts is (in my opinion) black.

Look out for Beta wheels fitted in place of the orignal MC wheels. Beta wheels have round bolt holes and MC wheels have oval bolt holes. Check the spare, too.

Check for rust in the roof mechanism of the Spyders.

It has to be a Mk II (glass and flying buttresses rather than solid rear pillars).

Try to find a car with the correct passenger door mirror - they look silly with one mirror (as shipped) but many people did a conversion with other Lancia parts that doesn't look original.

Go for it! They are beautiful and feel really special. PiniFarina produced this car just before moving on to do the Ferrari 308 - the interior feels really similar - a great place to be.

 

[manalishi]

The VTEC noise is addictive ! like a touring car whine ! The CRX's go forever as long as you change the oil every 6k miles , rust can be a problem as can the usual rips in the drivers seat , but all is curable and all parts are available easily.

There's very little torque in them , so to get the best out of them you have to keep it on the boil ..... but thats part of the fun ...

As it happens, my 2nd car (for hauling stuff around for the business) is a VTEC Honda; an Accord Exec, but it's SOHC and auto. I do like the VTEC sound - it just starts to sound that bit meaner and harder. The effect is rather muted in my lardy Accord, so I'm sure a VTEC CRX would appeal.

Intriguingly, there are/were some posts on that forum (thanks for the pointer, by the way) which show that the non-VTEC 16V CRX with the 130bhp D16 engine was actually more powerful through most of the rev range than the 160bhp B16-engined VTEC version. The dyno charts in that thread have been deleted unfortunately, so you can only go by the context of the other postings.

 

[Howard]

I saw that too ( i was a member of CRXUK for some time , think i still am ) and it surprised me too ....

All i can add to that was that i had several traffic light GP's over the years i had the VTEC with non VTEC CRX's and they never came out on top ....

What you must make sure though , unless it has an aftermarket exhaust system on it , is that the backbox is the single large tailpipe ( 3in AFAIK ) with the chrome oval trim on.

Because there weren't many VTEC's made , exhaust centres tended to put on the standard twin tailpipe box from the normal CRX's and apparently this can sap power. Had many rows over this ....

Yes ...

No ...

 

[Bellow]

Some thoughts/questions.
How's the girlfriend going to enjoy a revaholic buzz box VTEC? Isn't it just a hatch with a trick engine?
A 3 cylinder smart with a decent exhaust sounds glorious - in the way that triples do.
On looks alone, the Montecarlo! They look fabulous. But they are more than just lookers. Should be sweet drive with some torque about it.
What's the girlfriend steering you towards?
I kind of think there are 2 types of car. One so focused only the driver can enjoy and only then if alone. The other type can be 'shared' with a passenger.
That should explain my line of questioning!

 

[Bob S]

That's absolutely stunning, I'm partial to a TR. I'd eventually like to work up to a TR5 or 6. Lovely photo too. Sorry for going off-topic.

Many thanks......... I've had it for 9 years so I reckon it's a keeper now! The photo was taken early May a couple of years ago off the west coast near Aultbea. We are rather spoiled for great roads and scenery up here

 

[Smarties]

Nothing at all wrong with the Smart Roadster gearchange, The Brabus version is quicker still. As for finding a good one for 5k, let me know if you do, I'm looking too!

 

[Classic_car]

Trouble with VTEC, is that they have no torque and sometimes, you do not want to be at 8k rpm, some low down power is nice. Not my cup of T to be honest.

Smart Roadster - flop

Integrale, would be a good choice, a stunning car . Im considering one myself in the new year, but it will no doubt be hard to find the right car, that is also RHD.

Original Alfa Spider would fit in a small garage. £5K, should bag something decent...

Not sure why a British car is a problem? But, a TVR S must fit in your garage, they are reliable if properly maintained and they are simple cars to work on. Much more interesting than MX-5 etc.

There are so many good cars being suggested, i've got the itch to buy another car now!