Mercedes broke my car and are pointing the finger my way!

[DansSlk]

Pleased your happy with it but i would just like to point out - New part fitted by dealer / competent Indy to MB spec = Warranty on said part regardless of the status of the rest of the vehicle.

If the part goes bang after a month and its been correctly fitted and not subjected to anything it was not designed to handle then MB cover it.

 

[grober]

One question. Did you take a third party ( engineer/mechanic/knowledgeable friend) with you to this meeting. If you didn't you placed yourself immediately at a disadvantage and its essential ( and perfectly reasonable) to get the details of the meeting recorded in writing as already suggested.

 

[Petermcu]

One question. Did you take a third party ( engineer/mechanic/knowledgeable friend) with you to this meeting. If you didn't you placed yourself immediately at a disadvantage and its essential ( and perfectly reasonable) to get the details of the meeting recorded in writing as already suggested.

I didn't take a third party with me and feel that perhaps before I pickup the car it should be assessed as you suggest. It can only help...
I am not without a fairly strong technical understanding of the situation however when it comes to casings and reliabilty of patch repairs...

they are posting me there understanding of our discussion and will not be accepted until everyone spits and shakes on it!

 

[IanA2]

I go along with Crockers on the independant expert. but would add that the subsequent inspections should also have an independant element.

 

[timskemp]

Hello peoples!

Just got off the phone to MB repair shop who have informed me that whilst accessing the transmission to replace the oil a casing bolt froze resulting in the head shearing off . (Thats no good I thought but at least a new bolt will fix it) He then proceeded to tell me that whilst attempting to remove the broken bolt they broke a peice of the casing around it .

I think the key thing here is they informed you AFTER breaking the casing and didn't notify you of the corrosion issue (which I would think is normal on a 7 yr old car) before commencing works.

It's highly likely that removing the bolt was a task given to a less experienced employee who attempted to remove it using methods you'd use to remove a sticky wheel bolt or similar, probably a long handle and a mallet - I would firmly but politely let them know you entrusted them to work on your car in a careful and considered manner and that they should rectify this at their cost to a standard commensurate with the condition the gearbox was in on presentation to them.

Failing that you would want in writing from them how the damage happened, and if correct procedure was not followed then it's their fault, if it was followed but they "accidentally" damaged the car it's still their fault...

 

[glojo]

I hate making suppositions about what may or may not have happened, or what equipment may, or may not have been used, The way I read all this is quite simple.

The car went in for repair.

It had a perfectly good undamaged gearbox.

The garage broke the gearbox casing.

They are now offering to repair said casing.

It went in undamaged and comes out with a welded part.

If they had scratched the bonnet, would we expect a new bonnet, or let them 'repair' the old one?

My heart says a new gearbox, but my brain says let them repair the old one IF that is possible.

If the damage was to a part that had corroded through fair wear and tear then I would expect the owner to cough up, but a damaged casing probably does not fit into that category?

Regards
John

 

[Mudster]

If they had scratched the bonnet, would we expect a new bonnet, or let them 'repair' the old one?

My heart says a new gearbox, but my brain says let them repair the old one IF that is possible.

If the damage was to a part that had corroded through fair wear and tear then I would expect the owner to cough up, but a damaged casing probably does not fit into that category?

Regards
John

In this scenario I would expect them to repair the bonnet not replace it.

It is also unreasonable to expect them to replace the entire gearbox with new.

There is an insurance term for this, it's "Betterment". Insurance is designed to put you back into the position you were before an incident occurred, or as close to it as possible.

To request a new bonnet or new gearbox would actually put you in a better position than you were before the incident.

Repainting to bonnet to the same standard as the rest of the vehicle, or repairing the gearbox until it is in as usable condition as it was or replacing with a used item of similar age condition are solutions that are deemed acceptable.

To request a new replacement in either situation would be unreasonable.

 

[jaymanek]

Agree with mudster.... i think this is a good result especially if they guarantee it for a reasonable period..

 

[stevesey]

Wondering what happens next time you want the gearbox oil changed (several years time?) That may probably be the only time the strength of the repair will get really tested. Wondering the inspections offered should include losening and re-tighening the repaired bolt (or similar depending how it's done)?

 

[jaymanek]

this was not the drain plug was it?

 

[stevesey]

I understood it to be a pan bolt.

 

[timskemp]

There is an insurance term for this, it's "Betterment". Insurance is designed to put you back into the position you were before an incident occurred, or as close to it as possible.

To request a new bonnet or new gearbox would actually put you in a better position than you were before the incident.

In the case of paint damage only the paint need be repaired. In the case of putting a hole in the bonnet, a filler repair would leave it in a worse state, betterment would not apply. If the gearbox casing has been damaged and was not in a state of disrepair before, an reconditioned gearbox is certainly not going to be seen as betterment. A brand new one might be, but only if a reconditioned one is not available. If a recon is available and a new one is insisted on the price difference would form the betterment and be funded by the owner.

 

[Petermcu]

Wondering what happens next time you want the gearbox oil changed (several years time?) That may probably be the only time the strength of the repair will get really tested. Wondering the inspections offered should include losening and re-tighening the repaired bolt (or similar depending how it's done)?

The damaged area was to the bolt hole at one of the corners of the gearbox sump. The casing cracked perpendicular to the thread so to ensure there were no future problems the casing was repaired and then rethreaded. Removing the bolt I am assured is no different to replacing any of the others.
The repair was load tested to a higher torque than the bolt requires however as this tested the performance under compression force it probably isnt saying alot. A better test would probably involve a impact tension load.
Appears they have done a proper job of the repair.

 

[vijilants]

The sump bolts on the auto boxes do tend to seize. This can be a common occurence.

However, if they do shear, using the right tools and applying some heat you can get them out easily.

I took mine to be oilchanged at in independent mercedes gearbox specialist called Martins Autos in Wimbledon, and I watched the process.

Sure enough, one of my sump bolts was seized and the head sheared off.

Martin, managed to take out the offending bolt with no fuss or bother.

He has done loads of them

The reason why you are having this problem is because the guy that was working on your car simply does not have the experience.

What you must realize is most folks nowadays that work for mercedes are not mechanics and also have very little experience when it comes to jobs such as this.

 

[jaymanek]

Desilva, i dont think he was fortunate enough to have the bolt shear... the whole casing went with it!

 

[vijilants]

Desilva, i dont think he was fortunate enough to have the bolt shear... the whole casing went with it!

Yeah....cause I think the guy doing the job tried to force the thing and god knows what he was doing to it to make the casing break.......unless there was a flaw in the casing.

 

[television]

With many tight bolts, the back pressure forces the load onto the thread and they can stick, by doing up a touch, this releases the binding that can take place, to be double sure, if the bolt is tight all the way, then spray a lubricant onto the thread and do it up again, then it will come out with ease

 

[jixi]

Sorry to come in a bit late here but surely the gearbox casing is alloy / ally in which case it can't corrode?

 

[Petermcu]

Sorry to come in a bit late here but surely the gearbox casing is alloy / ally in which case it can't corrode?

jixi it was not the casing that was corroded but the bolt.

heading down to pickup the car today. What I haven't mentioned in this post is that it has just had 7 panels sorted under mobilo so basically a new car!! :bannana:
Thanks again to all of your posts and MERRY CHRISTMAS!!