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R Class versus Q7

So when is the estate car version and seven seat version of the R class going to hit the showromms? Anyone know?

There's a pic of the new 3-seater rear seat in this month's Mercedes Enthusiast. And it's very depressing.

Considering how wide this car is, and how it (should be) an ideal family car, rather than provide 3 equal width seats, as in many smaller 'family' cars, Merc have decided in their wisdom to (apparently) keep the over-wide septic-size outer seats and replace the former centre console with an extremely narrow seat which looks incredibly uncomfortable even for midgets.

A wasted opportunity IMHO. R-class off the list as a future buy for us, I'm afraid!
 
I followed a Q7 for a short time on the way to work this morning and its huge, and looks bloated.

I'd even go as far as saying it makes the Cayenne (a 'minger' by all accounts) quite attractive.
 
There's a pic of the new 3-seater rear seat in this month's Mercedes Enthusiast. And it's very depressing.

Considering how wide this car is, and how it (should be) an ideal family car, rather than provide 3 equal width seats, as in many smaller 'family' cars, Merc have decided in their wisdom to (apparently) keep the over-wide septic-size outer seats and replace the former centre console with an extremely narrow seat which looks incredibly uncomfortable even for midgets.

A wasted opportunity IMHO. R-class off the list as a future buy for us, I'm afraid!

I think that is sensible. The E class estate is really four comfortable seats plus an optional two in the back and that seems very popular. Not many people want three abreast in the back for more than short trips. I know some do but for most people four good seats is fine. Setting it up as a big estate car could be the saving of it.

Certainly in the US there is a big market for an estate car bigger than the E class. And something of a market here I'd guess.

By the way it isn't that wide. See the dimensions I gave a lot earlier in this thread -about 2 inches wider than an E class.
 
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Just like to put something right for the record.

When the R class came out most dealers had the SWB as more suitable for UK. That is all my local dealer had. When I had the problem of too little legroom in the front (see earlier in this thread) I asked if the LWB would solve this. The salesman said the Merc blurb said the LWB would have more room in the back and in the boot but not in the front. And that is what all the Press reports said at the time.

But lo and behold, sat in one today and it also has more legroom IN THE FRONT. Hooray. However, it would not have affected my decision not to go for the R class as the LWB is longer than the S class, and that is long enough to park in the UK IMO. What could have changed my decision would be the rumoured estate car version with 5 seats and an optional two in the back (like a bigger E class estate), with lots of legroom in the front all in the length of the SWB.
 
I think that is sensible. The E class estate is really four comfortable seats plus an optional two in the back and that seems very popular. Not many people want three abreast in the back for more than short trips. I know some do but for most people four good seats is fine. Setting it up as a big estate car could be the saving of it.


Yes, I think many people only expect to get 2 in comfort on the back seat (my E estate was a bit of a squeeze for 3 adults). I guess I was just hoping that a 3-seat R could be a possible replacement for our Citroen C8. That has 3 full size seats in the back and is comfortable for 3 adults.

The width of the centre seat in the R, and in particular the positioning of the seat-belt buckles suggests to me that an E estate would be more comfortable for 3 people than the R.
 
BUT SUV's are involved in more accidents and have a higher kill rate tahn other classes of car. i.e. the safety is only a perception, the reality is different.

Says who? I thought that statistics showed that SUVs were involved in far less accidents per 100,000 cars. But I might be wrong so don't quote me.
 
Says who? I thought that statistics showed that SUVs were involved in far less accidents per 100,000 cars. But I might be wrong so don't quote me.
Glad you picked it up. In a 4x4 you are 50 times less likely to be killed in a head on crash than in an average car. That is the British Dept of Transport. Some US data in the early days suggested US suv's were more likely to roll. Here's a recent Press report: -

People in 4x4s are 50 times less likely to be killed in crashes with another car than those of small and medium-sized cars, according to the Department of Transport.
The safest cars for drivers are the Land Rover Defender, Mercedes ML class, Toyota Landcruiser and Isuzu Trooper.
The cars with the worst records for driver deaths and serious injuries are the old-style Mini, the Fiat Panda, pre-1993 Nissan Micra, Daewoo Matiz and Suzuki Swift.
The DoT looked at police reports of more than 138,000 crashes from 2000 to 2004. Drivers of small and medium-sized cars involved in collisions with another car had a one in 200 chance of being killed, compared with fewer than one in 10,000 for drivers of people-carriers and 4x4s.
Just three per cent of 4x4 drivers were killed or seriously injured in collisions, compared with seven per cent of small-car drivers.
The figures were published on the DoT's website but the study has not been publicised. Some small cars bucked the trend and showed it was possible to combine fuel efficiency with safety.
The Citroen C3, which weighs less than a tonne and travels 48 miles to the gallon, is twice as safe as the Honda CRV 4x4 which weighs 1.5 tonnes and gives 31mpg.
Some models have improved markedly over the past 15 years as makers have added features such as air bags and side-impact protection.
The Mini showed the biggest improvement with 14 per cent of drivers killed or seriously injured in collisions involving the original model, compared with five per cent of the new, BMW-produced version. The new Mini is twice as heavy, as well as taller, wider and longer.
Other models, such as the Nissan Sunny, Vauxhall Astra and Rover 200/400 and 25/45, improved little or not at all over the years.
 
Glad you picked it up. In a 4x4 you are 50 times less likely to be killed in a head on crash than in an average car. That is the British Dept of Transport. Some US data in the early days suggested US suv's were more likely to roll. Here's a recent Press report: -

People in 4x4s are 50 times less likely to be killed in crashes with another car than those of small and medium-sized cars, according to the Department of Transport.
The safest cars for drivers are the Land Rover Defender, Mercedes ML class, Toyota Landcruiser and Isuzu Trooper.
The cars with the worst records for driver deaths and serious injuries are the old-style Mini, the Fiat Panda, pre-1993 Nissan Micra, Daewoo Matiz and Suzuki Swift.
The DoT looked at police reports of more than 138,000 crashes from 2000 to 2004. Drivers of small and medium-sized cars involved in collisions with another car had a one in 200 chance of being killed, compared with fewer than one in 10,000 for drivers of people-carriers and 4x4s.
Just three per cent of 4x4 drivers were killed or seriously injured in collisions, compared with seven per cent of small-car drivers.
The figures were published on the DoT's website but the study has not been publicised. Some small cars bucked the trend and showed it was possible to combine fuel efficiency with safety.
The Citroen C3, which weighs less than a tonne and travels 48 miles to the gallon, is twice as safe as the Honda CRV 4x4 which weighs 1.5 tonnes and gives 31mpg.
Some models have improved markedly over the past 15 years as makers have added features such as air bags and side-impact protection.
The Mini showed the biggest improvement with 14 per cent of drivers killed or seriously injured in collisions involving the original model, compared with five per cent of the new, BMW-produced version. The new Mini is twice as heavy, as well as taller, wider and longer.
Other models, such as the Nissan Sunny, Vauxhall Astra and Rover 200/400 and 25/45, improved little or not at all over the years.

That's when they hit another car but SUV's are less stable due to a higher centre of gravity which is the opposite of the security felt by their drivers so, they roll more and come off the road more. they also have longer breaking distances. Sources - I'm not looking them upo but various US studies and various tets that i ahve seen on TV.
 
Spent today being driven around in a Q7. Must win the ugly stakes from the outside but a very impressive, smooth, comfortable car on the inside. V. high quality and the one I was in had three rows of seats.
Depending on how and when it will be on the list when repalcement time comes up.
 
That's when they hit another car but SUV's are less stable due to a higher centre of gravity which is the opposite of the security felt by their drivers so, they roll more and come off the road more. they also have longer breaking distances. Sources - I'm not looking them upo but various US studies and various tets that i ahve seen on TV.

Yes. That is US ones. I've not seen any data on UK ones but I've driven the main contenders and they are excellent for ride and lack of roll. Amazing in fact.
 
I saw a Discovery that had rolled on the M25, it was in the middle lane. Looked nasty, didn't seem to have been any other vehicles involved.
 
I have an Audi Q7, its a 3.0 Tdi S-Line Model.
The reasoning behind the choice was the drive of the vehicle. It doesnt feel like driving a 4x4 its more like driving a car, and it handles beautifully. I got a fully specced version with all the toys, sat nav/tv, panoramic roof, tiptronic paddleshift, and electric everything.

It looks like an A6 estate with a big bodykit, but hey I'm in it for the drive.
 
I saw a Discovery that had rolled on the M25, it was in the middle lane. Looked nasty, didn't seem to have been any other vehicles involved.

I saw a BMW 3 series rolled on its side on the Christchurch bypass. Nobody else involved.
 
Hello,


Recently my dad was looking at changing his 3yr old E320 cdi Estate and we went round the stealers looking at the cars on offer he liked. He likes the E class for its ability to carry stuff, fuel economy and looks.

1) Audi A6 all road 3.0tdi Quattro, nice and looked well built with lots of toys but not 'that' special.

2) Audi Q7, he said was actually too big for his needs, although at the same price near enough to the All road looked great value.

3) Range Rover sport, too small, boot useless, dealer he went to even more useless.

4) Merc R class, un decided over looks (I like it) but it does look like a even fatter B class especially front on. ML320cdi was nice but the GL next to it looked even nicer (again too big really for his needs)

After looking at all these cars and deciding what his is worth, putting the best part of 25K + and his car to swap and none of them felt 'that special'

So much so he sold his weekend SLK 230 and bought an SL500 and keeping the estate. Happy days all round
 
I saw a BMW 3 series rolled on its side on the Christchurch bypass. Nobody else involved.

Really? To genuinely roll a 3 series (as opposed to it flipping after hitting a kerb, for example) would be quite an achievement.

Whereas plenty of demonstrations have shown that an abrupt high speed lane change (what I assume had happened on the M25) can put an SUV on it's roof. The best that modern electronics can do is to prevent a rollover by reducing the turn - not ideal if you're trying to avoid something. They can't change the laws of physics - a high C of G is not conducive to rapid change of direction.
 
Really? To genuinely roll a 3 series (as opposed to it flipping after hitting a kerb, for example) would be quite an achievement.

Oh, I don't know. You know how bad these 3-series drivers are! ;)
 
Yes. That is US ones. I've not seen any data on UK ones but I've driven the main contenders and they are excellent for ride and lack of roll. Amazing in fact.

The Q7 comes with air suspension :) it really is great to drive. 3.0 tdi is a little sluggish for my liking tho. 4.2 TDI looks more like it.
 
Really? To genuinely roll a 3 series (as opposed to it flipping after hitting a kerb, for example) would be quite an achievement.
.

To genuinely roll an ML or an X5 (as opposed to it flipping after hitting a kerb, for example) would also be quite an achievement.
 

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