W202 C230 Kompressor tuning Q's (exhaust, remap, supercharger bypass valve, etc)

[StavFC]

Few things...

Has anyone fitted aftermarket exhaust parts to their W202 C230 Kompressor and got any proven gains?
Ive seen claims of aftermarket manifolds giving 20bhp and exhausts similar mounts, but after looking under the car, I find it hard to believe
The manifold is a tubular steel 4-2-1 item that is fantastic for a standard car, and the rest of the system is a decent diameter and even doubles as it goes through the restrictive cats; only potential big restriction is if the silencers are, but without removing them to look, I cant tell.

The electronic supercharger bypass throttle thing. How/when does it operate? Open on light/off throttle, and closed at all other times I presume?
Has anyone tried blocking the pipe so the air is always fed through the s/c? Reason being I cant see it being all that air tight, making for a permanent, and performance losing, boost leak.

As a pulley change for more boost looks stupidly expensive (unless I missed a better priced version?) thats out the window, but have seen remaps for sale with no mention of more boost. Has anyone had their 230K remapped without a pulley and it made a worthwhile difference?

A decent intercooler sprang to mind straight away, but looking at the way the pipework is just before the IC, there no chance without big changes, due to the pipe being a v.odd squashed setup to clear the radiator etc
Unless ive missed something?

Anyone tried pre-compressor water injection? Ive done it loads of times on other turbo and supercharged cars, and tbh it should help a lot, but would be interested if anyone had done it.

Traction control- Does it turn totally off? I heard it doesnt, but sure seems to by pressing the switch on the dash? Smokes the tyre (just one, damn open diff!) through 1st and 3nd with it 'off' so? Mines a 'Sport' if thats what makes the difference.

LSD- Is there one available? Open diff sucks and I wont want to have to settle for a welder if I dont have to.

FINALLY- Feels like a dual mass flywheel to me, correct? Is a single mass flywheel and clutch available for them? Cant imagine a dual mass lasting me 5mins...

THANKS!

 

[StavFC]

I guess im on my own on this one then, lol.

 

[d w124]

I guess im on my own on this one then, lol.

There`s a member here Adam that had a c230 and had about 220hp or something.All he did was chip it and an AMG backbox but he hed catfree system.

As I`ve said on your first post,not much you can do to old mercs
What you can do to your car is
Supercharger pulley
After market outlet manifold
Get rid of the cats and get a nice exhaust system and you should see some difference

 

[R2D2]

hi, Graham C230k went through the mods on a c230k and if you search you'll find reports of his dissappointments with various tuning solutions and dissappointing dyno results. I seem to recall that remapping achieved little without a pulley as well. There is also some debate as to whether or not MB ECUs apply a kind of limit to power-ie even if you mod above a certain bhp the engine works out it has more than MB wanted you to have and reigns you back in. If you read my read my thread The complete M271 engine thread you'll see discussions on all the tuning options and providers for my supercharged engine. Although you have a different engine much of the discussion and the product providers is relevant to you. HTH

 

[NISFAN]

Erm, perhaps re-evaulate whether you have bought the right car? 230K is not the most powerful C class

I don't have a 230K but to give my view on some of your Q's:

4-2-1 manifolds are for mid range, 4-1 can give higher top end power, although I doubt as much as 20bhp. Maybe another 5-8bhp up top, with a drop in the middle.

A re-map without pulley change will not do much. Again another few bhp just for optimised AFR's and ignition timing, that's all. (Unless there is a boost bleed off device, but this is not typical on SC'd engines)

Have you looked at a AIR-WATER intercooler? These can be very compact, and are used on the bigger 55AMG engines. Again a lot of exepnse for a small gain.

Pre-kompressor WI? Don't do it, would be my advice, as the kompressor is seriously expensive, and you don't want to damage it with water.

Diff? Try asking Quaife, or looking at Merc tuning firms like Kleeman, I am sure someone makes one. As for welding an open diff, there is no way on earth you would enjoy the drive on normal roads with that, unless you are some Dorifto Kingo wannabee. Ha ha.

My advice is to sell it standard, and buy it's bigger brother.

 

[Will]

Sell up and buy a C36 or C43. If anyone knows how to tune a W202 it was/is AMG

They're as cheap now as they ever will be, and the value of your W202 + modding costs will buy you a much better car - AMG brakes, suspension, wheels, exhaust etc.

A C43 with 300+bhp and lots of torque is the way forward

Will

 

[grober]

The alternative route to increase performance rather than increase engine power is to lighten the load it has to carry! In other words make the car lighter. Just how much weight can you can usefully shed from a W202 C class Mercedes remains to be seen. The standard heavyweight construction of the standard Mercedes bodyshell tends to work against you here so without extensive use of lightweight panels and ditching lots of the interior trim/equipment / glass you are going to struggle. It probably means the car will be unsellable after also. Still as an exercise in going faster by removing rather than adding stuff it might be interesting.

 

[StavFC]

Cheers for the replies

Erm, perhaps re-evaulate whether you have bought the right car? 230K is not the most powerful C class

For the money it cost me, as I wanted a decent daily drive and second car to my fun car, there was no beating it.

Pre-kompressor WI? Don't do it, would be my advice, as the kompressor is seriously expensive, and you don't want to damage it with water.

That coming from experience? Ive done it on plenty of turbo cars, inc my current car where im injecting 650cc a minute pre-turbo, with zero damage, so totally amazed that it could damage a supercharger, which spins far slower, has much bigger clearances, and much beefier moving parts.

As for welding an open diff, there is no way on earth you would enjoy the drive on normal roads with that, unless you are some Dorifto Kingo wannabee. Ha ha..

Ive ran 5 cars now with locked/welded/spool diffs, never bothers me one bit.

My advice is to sell it standard, and buy it's bigger brother.

An old C230K is worthless standard, bigger brother costs more which defeats the object of the car unfortunately.

Sell up and buy a C36 or C43. If anyone knows how to tune a W202 it was/is AMG

A C43 with 300+bhp and lots of torque is the way forward

Will

If money wasnt an issue, of course But this is just a cheap/fun daily, a C43 would still feel very slow to me.

The alternative route to increase performance rather than increase engine power is to lighten the load it has to carry! In other words make the car lighter.
Still as an exercise in going faster by removing rather than adding stuff it might be interesting.

Yup, does make a massive difference my main fun car is ~950kg down from 1250kg, and its like night and day in all aspects.
But thats the main reason I have this car, its comfy and nice to go to work in, unlike my other car!

 

[flango]

Don't water inject a supercharger unless you want to kill it, the principle of water injection on turbo's is fine pre turbo but does not have the same effect on a SC

Take a look over at some of the US threads on how to mod SC's plenty have died with water injection and at around £1800 a pop I wouldn't risk it far easier and cheaper to learn from someone elses mistakes

 

[StavFC]

Don't water inject a supercharger unless you want to kill it, the principle of water injection on turbo's is fine pre turbo but does not have the same effect on a SC

Any links to this? I cant see why tbh, same principle of why it works, so must be some odd issue.

 

[flango]

Any links to this? I cant see why tbh, same principle of why it works, so must be some odd issue.

Will try and find the links to the articles I read when I was looking at more power but once you have done the overdrive and underdrive pulley upgrade you are then into old school tuning. I have a head away in Germany at the moment being ported and polished and fitted with bigger valves and high lift cams, with that fitted I'm hoping to be the right side of 250 bhp

 

[StavFC]

If you can that'd be great, I had a google for it and drew a blank, and cant logically think why, if done right, it would.

Delving into the internals at less than about 150bhp per litre on a forced induction car sounds odd to me. Not to worry, I'll think of something.

Any idea what bhp/lbft the clutch is good for before it has enough and slips?

 

[NISFAN]

To give short answers, a Turbo is a positive displacment device, a supercharger isn't.

A TC has an all aluminium compressor, the SC has all steel internals, steel rusts, aluminium doesn't.

A TC compressor doesn't have any internal seals, a SC does.

Now for a piddly little gain at full throttle, is it worth the risk of damaging an £1800 device?

As for the driving characteristics of a C230k with a welded diff, I would rather go to work on a Donkey, atleast that way I would look like less of an Ass.

 

[moonloops]

Stop faffing about and buy a V8

 

[StavFC]

Ok, well I've got all the useful answers I'm going to get, cheers.

Stop faffing about and buy a V8

The 'fun' car has more bhp/ton than a McLaren SLR, this is just a cheap daily.

As for the driving characteristics of a C230k with a welded diff, I would rather go to work on a Donkey, atleast that way I would look like less of an Ass.

Considering there is nothing noticable running a locked diff unless you are doing full lock turns at sub 5mph, you must have one hell of a twisty drive to work!

 

[NISFAN]

Ok, well I've got all the useful answers I'm going to get, cheers.



The 'fun' car has more bhp/ton than a McLaren SLR, this is just a cheap daily.



Considering there is nothing noticable running a locked diff unless you are doing full lock turns at sub 5mph, you must have one hell of a twisty drive to work!

OMG, you clearly haven't driven a car with a welded diff!!!!

In the dry it is 'entertaining', in the wet you are literally sideways going through and coming out of EVERY roundabout. That and the rear tyres last about 1000 miles if your lucky. Not exactly desirable qualities in a daily driver.

 

[StavFC]

This thread is over for help I think, but I just had to reply to the comedy last post...

OMG, you clearly haven't driven a car with a welded diff!!!!

LOL! OMG to you too...

I've owned 5x Volvos (240 turbo, 1x 360 turbo, 2x 360 N/A, 1x 940 turbo), 2x Sierras (2.8 V6 and 400bhp Cosworth), and 2x Vauxhalls (2x 24V Senators), 2x Nissans (S12 Silvia and S13 200SX), and 1x BMW (E36 325) all with welded or spool diffs for some of their lives.

4 of them were daily drivers, and the daily drive is 110 miles a day.

Going by your explanations id be more inclined to say you havent actually had much/any experience of driving with a welder/spool