Which grade of fuel should be used in AMG's?

[pioneercollector]

Not many bikes need it...it can even take advantage of it...so its mainly just wasted money.

The issue with the E10 with the older bikes is when you 'winter' them, E5 is fine, but E10 can affect the rubber components and cause issues with the fuel after a period of time, Far easier just to use the better fuel rather than draining the tank. I am sure that 'modern'. bikes are 100% fine but my bikes i have owned for decades and intend to keep them running as best i can.....
The car is a different matter, it gets E5 ..... Back in the day it would have had 5*

 

[philnewmerc]

What does it show on your fuel flap i am not sure for the 113k, for the m156 it is 98 ron minimum - i always use 99ron v power.

It's definitely 98 ron in the manual. I just don't believe there's any danger using 95 because where are all the reports of engine failure/repairs? It was 50/50 98/95 ron usage in this forum thread, and these are people who really appreciate MB... Imagine what Joe Blogs thinks when he fills up (nothing). The car is powerful enough on 95 for me. But, I've never seen the price of Tesco momentum so I'll have a look at that before I abandon 98 for good.

 

[philnewmerc]

In my area the cost premium for 99 RON fuel over and above the same brand’s 95 RON fuel is typically 6-7p at Tesco and 14-18p at Shell.

Shell already charge 4-20p more for 95 RON than Tesco, so it’s increasingly difficult to justify buying Shell Vpower - you have to really “want” it.

I would say the Tesco 99 RON fuels is a no brained for anyone with a car requiring super unleaded or concerned about Etjanol content.

Good shout I'll look into Tesco 99 ron . In the past I've preferred not to use supermarket fuel but maybe for this it is a different argument...

 

[philnewmerc]

I have always used Super Unleaded in my SL, and for that matter both of my motorbikes ..... why use the cheap stuff ?

Of course i might have a different opinion if i was driving 500 miles per week, every week .... but there again....

My Moto Guzzi definitely runs nicer on super unleaded. But never noticed a car running better... Maybe on a track, or continuously redlined but i just pootle with an occasional 5 mins of madness

 

[Skd884]

It's definitely 98 ron in the manual. I just don't believe there's any danger using 95 because where are all the reports of engine failure/repairs? It was 50/50 98/95 ron usage in this forum thread, and these are people who really appreciate MB... Imagine what Joe Blogs thinks when he fills up (nothing). The car is powerful enough on 95 for me. But, I've never seen the price of Tesco momentum so I'll have a look at that before I abandon 98 for good.

Read the warning in your manual re using 95ron.

 

[philnewmerc]

Read the warning in your manual re using 95ron.

I have. It says avoid high revs (i like torque rather than redlines anyway). My point is on this very forum many amg owners don't use super, or more often don't even know you're supposed to: where are the reports of issues resulting from that? Having said that if Tesco super is only marginally more I'll start using that, but 15p/L is about 7 quid a tank... Bit steep for a daily driver imho.

 

[GVT]

I have. It says avoid high revs (i like torque rather than redlines anyway). My point is on this very forum many amg owners don't use super, or more often don't even know you're supposed to: where are the reports of issues resulting from that? Having said that if Tesco super is only marginally more I'll start using that, but 15p/L is about 7 quid a tank... Bit steep for a daily driver imho.

If AMG recommend 98 min. The extra £7 would surely be cheaper than any potential long term mechanical consequences….

 

[philnewmerc]

If AMG recommend 98 min. The extra £7 would surely be cheaper than any potential long term mechanical consequences….

What consequences though? It's a modern ecu controlled knock detection engine, the only consequence i can see is less power (not detectable to me) and maybe less mpg (but i haven't noticed that either) and perhaps issues if you were on a track day due to continuous high temperature running. Any reports of issues arising from 95 ron fuel in normal use? Only issues i can see on searches is using supermarket fuel rather than oil company brand... Remember MB also said gearbox oil is filled for life so I'm not 100% convinced by their info. Happy to see evidence to the contrary but if half of Mbclub are using 95 and no issues then it does make me wonder if 98 is overkill.

 

[Bellow]

. Maybe on a track, or continuously redlined but i just pootle with an occasional 5 mins of madness

It isn't rpm that demands octane.

I have. It says avoid high revs (i like torque rather than redlines anyway).

Where the torque is is where the detonation risk is and where octane is required.

What consequences though? It's a modern ecu controlled knock detection engine, the only consequence i can see is less power (not detectable to me) and maybe less mpg (but i haven't noticed that either) and perhaps issues if you were on a track day due to continuous high temperature running. Any reports of issues arising from 95 ron fuel in normal use?

The retarded ignition timing the ECU imposes when detonation is sensed leaves more heat in the exhaust stream which is hard on exhaust valves. Not necessarily catastrophically so, but not entirely benign either.
Hotter exhaust valves increase the detonation risk imposing further retardation of ignition timing - and on it goes.

Give it the octane it was designed for as specified by the manufacturer.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

What consequences though? It's a modern ecu controlled knock detection engine, the only consequence i can see is less power (not detectable to me) and maybe less mpg (but i haven't noticed that either) and perhaps issues if you were on a track day due to continuous high temperature running. Any reports of issues arising from 95 ron fuel in normal use? Only issues i can see on searches is using supermarket fuel rather than oil company brand... Remember MB also said gearbox oil is filled for life so I'm not 100% convinced by their info. Happy to see evidence to the contrary but if half of Mbclub are using 95 and no issues then it does make me wonder if 98 is overkill.

I feel like I’m saying this a lot at the moment: It will “probably” be OK to use 95 RON, but when it stops being OK the consequences (for your engine and wallet) will be significant.

The knock detection system will do its best to protect the engine but that’s designed to protect it by exception, and not constant use. Using 95 RON fuel constantly increasing the opportunity to fail rate.

You also mentioned in a previous post that you prefer to drive the torque rather than chase the redline (or similar), your engine really needs knock prevention from higher octane fuel when under load at lower revs.

You mentioned half of MBClubbers using 95 RON. I would say only a minority of MBClubbers would go against the manufacturers instructions to use super. Many don’t like doing it even in an emergency.

Remember earlier AMG models didn’t require super unleaded so some AMG owners might say they don’t bother, but their engines were designed to run in 95-RON fuel from the factory.

 

[Bellow]

You also mentioned in a previous post that you prefer to drive the torque rather than chase the redline (or similar), your engine really needs knock prevention from higher octane fuel when under load at lower revs.

Just to add - as I forgot earlier - at lower rpm, full torque is summoned long before the throttle pedal is on the floor.
(eg, half throttle at half (max) rpm is full throttle).

 

[BoristheBounce]

Not many bikes need it...it can even take advantage of it...so its mainly just wasted money.

I always remember when I was touring Europe regularly on my bike, the first time I did this I used as I would in the UK" regular" fuel, my bike was pinking like hell under load.

So, I tried Super next time I filled up, guess what the pinking disappeared, I'd always used Super in my bike in Europe since then, there is clearly a difference. I would think of using anything else in the SL wherever I am.

 

[Will]

I have. It says avoid high revs (i like torque rather than redlines anyway). My point is on this very forum many amg owners don't use super, or more often don't even know you're supposed to: where are the reports of issues resulting from that? Having said that if Tesco super is only marginally more I'll start using that, but 15p/L is about 7 quid a tank... Bit steep for a daily driver imho.

How many miles are you doing PA out of interest?

Just use Momentum 99, loads of Tesco filling stations around and about the same sort of price as ‘cooking’ 95 at Shell or whatever.

Or if you’re doing serious mileage and keeping the car long term, get an LPG conversion

 

[Spider10]

I only use Tesco or V power in both the AMGs wouldn't consider anything else tbh only as an emergency that's nearly as bad as people asking what it does to the gallon personally I dont care you don't buy an AMG and try to run it on the cheap !!!

 

[philnewmerc]

I only use Tesco or V power in both the AMGs wouldn't consider anything else tbh only as an emergency that's nearly as bad as people asking what it does to the gallon personally I dont care you don't buy an AMG and try to run it on the cheap !!!

But mamy would say using supermarket fuel is running it on the cheap!

 

[Spider10]

Tell that to the numerous tuners out there

 

[Sparkee]

Had a mx5 for a good while, you could tell the difference in the fuels in that. It liked v power the most, tesco or esso super after that. It most definitely didn't run as well on cheap unleaded.

Not to mention the super types all contain extra detergent stuffs that help prevent build up. Had an mx5 racing team do demos and explain what 15k mile of cheapo can do to a engine.

When your filling up and in mycase £110 to £ 120 what differance does a £5 note actually make?

 

[AMGeed]

I just don't understand the thinking behind putting 95Ron fuel in an AMG.
The fuel cap should recommend 98Ron (My 04 plate E55 did) and the 6/7p difference per litre (Momentum) is peanuts compared to reduced performance and possible detonation which is bad news for any engine.
As said time and time again, why try and run an AMG on the cheap?

 

[ALFAitalia]

But mamy would say using supermarket fuel is running it on the cheap!

Long since proven that super market fuels (regardless of grade) are in no way inferior to the big name brands. Google is your friend. Most are exactly the same base fuels (go to a refinery and you will see all different brands filling at the same silos....like we used to have at Fawley)....the additives are added at homeopathic quantities after the fuel is in the tankers....other than that it's the same. So whether it's Tesco or Shell 99 (or Tesco or Shell 95) you wont be able to tell it apart, no matter how much you think you can, as long as it's the right grade.
When I see adds with "only ever run in V Power" I think so what...just proves you are a bit gullible!...just as worthless as having a "perfect MOT history". As long as the correct grade of fuel is used it will make no measurable difference which brand it is.
That said would I put 95 in any car (not just an AMG) with a quoted minimum rating of
98? No I wouldn't. Would I be worried about damage if I did?....nope. The higher octane allows better knock resistance so you can run more ignition advance without destination. Lower octane will retard the ignition until it stops. Less power?...yes....engine damage? Imo very unlikely.

 

[Will]

For context, if the OP was doing say 10k miles PA and averaging 20mpg, with a difference of 6/7p a litre you’d be talking around £150 a year

And I suspect they would get a slight reduction in mpg anyway…