'A' Service = SHOCK Of My Life

[bpsorrel]

Now my car is out of warranty there's NO WAY I'll use those thieving b****ds again! Indie for me from now on! By the sound of it, a trip to Southsea will be well worth it..

By the way, I wonder if the service situation with MB will ever improve - surely as more people move to Indies they'll begin to notice...

 

[BenzedUP]

The coffee was nice though.

Thats the only thing thats free there apparently.. but knowing mercedes they probably have inclduded that in the price but it's hidden!

The merc stealers are a rip!

 

[Rory]

you need to make them understand you are savvy customer - not a "Merc experience customer" and that you want your car maintained not spoiled by buying it too many expensive presents.

I did all the research before I bought my Mercedes, including calling 2 dealers to check servicing prices, additional work, cost of changing pads and disks etc etc. They regaled me with huge lists of things that needed doing at enormous expense. Terrified by the prospect of uncontrolled expenditure, I signed up for the now defunct MB ServicePlus.

Turns out that now it's on ServicePlus my car needs virtually no servicing! ATF change at 4yrs? "Not on your car, sir". Rusty brake disks at MOT time? - "they're fine, sir". New wiper blades, please? "The existing ones are OK". Car drifts to left? "seems fine to us".

I saw the bill for the last B Service invoice that was sent to ServicePlus and it was well under £300.

 

[Robbo]

Like a lot in life, you can try to control a situation or just let it control you...if you use a Merc dealer:

The standard dealer approach is to say "we can't give you a price until we hook the car up - it tells us what needs doing".

You then get a low(ish) price for the oil change and quick look (a B service is an A service with a bigger quick look involving the wheels coming off). Cut £60-80 net off this by supplying your own oil from Costco.

On the day, you get a call listing two sets of extras:

a) mileage related (air filter, fuel filter, plugs, ATF).

for these, you get quoted book price for labour as if JUST that job was being done - i.e. paying again for the time to put the car on the lift, connect to STAR, take the wheels off etc.

negotiate and this always come down - a lot....or just decide that you always wanted to be trussed up and baked on gas mark 3 (and then complain at your weakness later).

(there is NO reason why these couldn't be addressed upfront as the ESS application takes your reg/VIN and the mileage you tell them at the time of booking and adds these items on)

b) extra work that "you might as well" get done while the car is in to avoid possible inconvenience later before the next scheduled service (pads, discs, wiper blades, cabin air filter, aircon "service")

nothing illegal here as you are being offered a convenience.

Learn how to look at the disc pads through the alloys and what they look like worn out and new. Make your own decision on how long they might last - they have wear sensors!

Decide to buy the blades/aircon filter from the parts desk with your discount and fit them in the time it takes to drink a cup or two of coffee.

If the a/c stinks, get a can of Comma stuff from Halfords for £11 and make the carpets and seats smell nice at the same time by running the car on recirc for 10 mins.

you need to make them understand you are savvy customer - not a "Merc experience customer" and that you want your car maintained not spoiled by buying it too many expensive presents.

Good post.

I think it helps if you let them know you are a bit savvy and are prepared to challenge them on the work being done. at my recent service, they suggested i had an aircon re-gas (on special offer you see) and a replacement poly V belt which i considered to be uneccessary at this point. I also supplied my own oil (the £900 figure i posted previously includes the cost of me buying the oil).

I got 40% off all labour and 10% off parts and they fitted the wipers without charging any labour, so I wasn't too disappointed. I wanted to preserve my mobilo life cover so it was worth it for me.

This equation may be different for other folks.

 

[ABBY]

hi

I find taking my car to the dealer they do a thorough investigation on what they can charge.ie last year they sugested replacing the main belt £50 pound labour +approx 50 pound parts, this was while replacing power steering pump.since this is a 10 min job i told them not to do it and a year later belt still ok same with rear pads which a year later still within tolerances.

 

[hawk20]

I just see expensive main dealer servicing as a fact of life of MB ownership. You know servicing is going to be expensive before you even buy the car, so there's not a lot of point in complaining really.

Robbo. Who last week spent £900 on a B service on my C320 due to additional service jobs (air, fuel and pollen filters, Brake fluid, spark plugs and new wiper blades, adjust parking brake and front wheel hub adjustment), even though the quoted B service cost was £330!

The coffee was nice though.

Check around and you'll find that MB service charges and labour rates are very similar to other luxury car makers. And the parts are often cheaper.

And all makes need new pads and discs from time to time and need fluids and filters replaced. The only surprising thing is that so many owners are surprised that these things are needed.

 

[hawk20]

This is not always the case these days. My dealer said that if the additional service items (filters, plugs etc) were not carried out as part of the service then they would not be not authorised by MB to stamp the service book.

This is often misunderstood. If you go in for a service and the plugs need changing then they will do them or not give you a stamp. (Fair enough; why should MB give free breakdown cover if necessary jobs aren't done when needed?)

BUT if you get the plugs done before you go in for a service -at a reputable indie- then they will stamp the book. Lots of owners have full MB service history but get major jobs done by indies and services done by the MB dealer.

 

[Rory]

Robbo. Who last week spent £900 on a B service on my C320 due to additional service jobs (air, fuel and pollen filters, Brake fluid, spark plugs and new wiper blades, adjust parking brake and front wheel hub adjustment), even though the quoted B service cost was £330!

The coffee was nice though.

Check around and you'll find that MB service charges and labour rates are very similar to other luxury car makers.

That's the thing - you're paying a lot because someone thinks you should.

OK, I know it's an entirely dfferent car, but I had my daughter's Mitsubishi Colt serviced at a franchsied dealer recently. The scope of the work was very similar to what Robbo had done - they didn't adjust the hub or change the wipers, but they did strip, clean and adjust the rear drums and handbrake and the brake fluid change was an integral part of the service too, not an extra cost item. Obviously the car has fewer plugs and takes a bit less oil (but still fully synth). Cost was £220.

 

[Rory]

BUT if you get the plugs done before you go in for a service -at a reputable indie- then they will stamp the book.

I would be astonished if they did that. Why would they warrant (which is what stamping the service book is doing) someone else's work?

 

[hawk20]

I would be astonished if they did that. Why would they warrant (which is what stamping the service book is doing) someone else's work?

Not at all. They are warranting the service they do. And if no other jobs need doing: fine.

 

[hawk20]

That's the thing - you're paying a lot because someone thinks you should.

OK, I know it's an entirely dfferent car, but I had my daughter's Mitsubishi Colt serviced at a franchsied dealer recently. The scope of the work was very similar to what Robbo had done - they didn't adjust the hub or change the wipers, but they did strip, clean and adjust the rear drums and handbrake and the brake fluid change was an integral part of the service too, not an extra cost item. Obviously the car has fewer plugs and takes a bit less oil (but still fully synth). Cost was £220.

No. You are just paying the normal market rate. Check out labour rates for other cars of similar quality and complexity and you will find there are very similar.

And dealers don't make much money. That is why they keep closing. There is only one hour of labour charged for an A service (about £100 at my local dealer) and for that miserly £100 they collect and deliver up to 25 miles, or provide me with a loan car, they wash and valet the car, and they provide all the specialist equipment and training for staff needed to service my car and keep it updated as needed. Plus all the inevitable overheads. Really good value IMO.

And I get free MobiloLife for which the AA want over £100 for man and wife plus another £100 for Euro cover which is all included free by MB. Servicing costs me about 2p per mile. It is small beer in the total cost of owning modern cars.

And do we want to end up in a world with no dealers. No showrooms. No feedback to and fro from servicing and repair to and from the manufacturer. I don't.

Worth bearing in mind that loads of people set up as independent garages. Some were once MB mechanics. But many have not been for training with MB for a pretty long time and don't know the changes that have occurred on newer models. Some don't even have STAR let alone all the equipment at my local dealer. Very few have any access to all the updates and service campaigns that are continually being done free when you go to an MB dealer for servicing.

Up to 4 years old I think FullMBSH is essential. After that, maybe you can make a case.

 

[Rory]

And dealers don't make much money. That is why they keep closing. There is only one hour of labour charged for an A service (about £100 at my local dealer)

Something's seriously wrong with the dealers' business model where they can charge £100/hr for labour and still not make much money.

How much do you think they made on Robbo's £900 service?

Dealers don't need to be in flash glass palaces. Servicing could be done in an industrial unit somewhere. Order your new car on the Internet. Test drive - they should bring one for a few days (several manufacturers do that now, and MB will if you're a company car driver).

 

[w124coupe]

Something's seriously wrong with the dealers' business model where they can charge £100/hr for labour and still not make much money.

How much do you think they made on Robbo's £900 service?

Dealers don't need to be in flash glass palaces. Servicing could be done in an industrial unit somewhere. Order your new car on the Internet. Test drive - they should bring one for a few days (several manufacturers do that now, and MB will if you're a company car driver).

Merc Solihull have done the split - glass shed for Sales and Tin shed for service and parts. They are still just as expensive as before!

They do seem to hold a fair parts stock though which is more than can be said of the "pretty" sites these days where almost everything seems to be special order/pay up front.

 

[saorbust]

I know somewhere on Merc's website you can put in your registration date and your mileage, and they'll produce a tailored service sheet for your car and it's mileage. You also need the first 6 digits of your chassis no - the bit after WDB or WDD. This gives model and variant (A class / Engine etc.)

Why not do that, and then confirm all the items on that list match the ones for the service quoted. At least then you'll know what you should be having done versus what's being done... I do it - saves a lot of hassle because it's from Merc....

Edit - Link is here. Mercedes-Benz ESS - Electronic Service Sheet.

 

[hawk20]

Dealers don't need to be in flash glass palaces. Servicing could be done in an industrial unit somewhere. Order your new car on the Internet. Test drive - they should bring one for a few days (several manufacturers do that now, and MB will if you're a company car driver).

Yes; we could make it all a really scruffy downmarket experience. How lovely.

 

[Dryce]

I would be astonished if they did that. Why would they warrant (which is what stamping the service book is doing) someone else's work?

Grey area.

What happens if you have a brake problem a month befor the service is done? Then at service should dealer demand to redo brakes to maintain FMBSH? I think as long as you can show brakes have been done then they just have to note that it was already done and that's it.

Real problem is value of FMBSH and Mobilo vs MB dealer labour rates which incentivises some of us cheapskates to try and play 'the system'.

 

[Rory]

Yes; we could make it all a really scruffy downmarket experience. How lovely.

It's exactly because of comments like that that we are where we are today with car dealerships.

Manufacturers think that we all want the floor tiles to be the same style in whichever dealership we go into, so dealers are forced to buy Mercedes floor tiles at stupid prices. If you talk to people who run franchised dealerships, the "dealer standards" costs are insane.

 

[Rory]

Grey area.

What happens if you have a brake problem a month befor the service is done? Then at service should dealer demand to redo brakes to maintain FMBSH? I think as long as you can show brakes have been done then they just have to note that it was already done and that's it.

I'm dead against mandatory dealer servicing, so don't get me wrong on this issue.

Brakes shouldn't be an issue as they're not a service item.

But say, as in the earlier point, you had the plugs changed at an indie or even did them yourself, then took the car to a dealership for a service at which a plug change was called for. I think that, unfortunately, the dealership would be quite right to refuse to stamp the book on the basis that the full work required hadn't been completed by either themselves or another MB Dealership or Authorised Repairer.

Real problem is value of FMBSH and Mobilo vs MB dealer labour rates which incentivises some of us cheapskates to try and play 'the system'.

I think the real problem is that MB and its dealerships seem to think it's perfectly acceptable to quote someone £330 for a B Service and then inflate the bill to £900. It's a con. How many people, who are running cars with their own money, would cheerfully take up the offer of a dealer service if they were quoted £900 up front. OK, hawk20 would, but who else?

 

[hawk20]

But say, as in the earlier point, you had the plugs changed at an indie or even did them yourself, then took the car to a dealership for a service at which a plug change was called for. I think that, unfortunately, the dealership would be quite right to refuse to stamp the book on the basis that the full work required hadn't been completed by either themselves or another MB Dealership or Authorised Repairer.
.

No. The plug change is not part of a service. It is done at a set mileage like, say, 50k. If you get that done, and then go for a service at say 53k, they would and should stamp the book.

Remember that you are perfectly entitled to leave dealer servicing for a while and come back and still qualify for such things as MobiloLife. (See my thread on this for T's and C's. http://www.mbclub.co.uk/forums/general-discussion/63522-mobilo-life-mobilo.html ). So there is no way that they can refuse to stamp the book. Remember the stamp means the specified service has been done. It does not claim to be proof of Full MBSH. You have to go through the book checking to ascertain that.

 

[hawk20]

I think the real problem is that MB and its dealerships seem to think it's perfectly acceptable to quote someone £330 for a B Service and then inflate the bill to £900. It's a con. How many people, who are running cars with their own money, would cheerfully take up the offer of a dealer service if they were quoted £900 up front. OK, hawk20 would, but who else?

Rory, you really are letting your relentless anti-MB anti-dealer stance, lead you to say things which are irresponsible IMO.

Dealers have a duty of care. Cars are complex lethal weapons. If you go in for a B service, for example, and they find your brakes are worn and need changing, they SHOULD tell you. And if the brake fluid needs changing, they SHOULD tell you. And you should be glad. And should want matters put right.

This is not inflating the bill. It is telling people what needs doing. If they don't take the advice and have it done, I'm glad they refuse to stamp the book.

Anybody who cares and takes a tiny bit of trouble in the care and maintenance of their car can find out what jobs are needed and when. Brake fluid every two years and so on. Plugs changed at 50k and so on. Either get it done before you go in for a service or be glad they tell you it needs doing and require to do it before stamping your book. It would be irresponsible to send someone out with inadequately maintained brakes and yet with the book recently stamped. Or with plugs past recommended mileage and then expect free Mobilo to tow them in if they break down, wouldn't it?

The fact that so many are surprised to find that the plugs need changing (when they happen to be in for a service) tells you something about those owners. Why didn't they know? Would they ever have changed them if the dealer had not brought it up?

Basic servicing costs the average customer on average miles about 2p per mile. People should budget for that minor cost of motoring. They also need to do a tiny bit of sensible planning to decide whether the other maintenance jobs on their car will be done by a main dealer or by an indie. Not that difficult is it?

The truth is most do not make enough effort. Loads of cars come in for service, with illegal tyres, worn brakes, low oil because nobody has checked the oil level since the last service, and numerous other examples of people not looking after their cars properly. Thank goodness that responsible dealers do tell people what extra work is needed and ask them if they want it done. Nobody has to say yes do they?