AMG owernship experience

[E55BOF]

Reading certain posts in here is like being on an LSD trip.
And I don't mean limited slip differentials.

I know what you mean. Perhaps the poster in question is on an LSD trip?

 

[WDB124066]

Be careful what you say; I don't see anyone arguing with you on this point yet...

I see it as a strength not a weakness, they only reason why you see it as a weakness is ....?

 

[E55BOF]

'The only reason'? Now you're making assumptions.

Hold on, though. Who said I saw it as a weakness? Not I.

 

[Bluegnomes]

I think that the OP has an interesting question. Why do high end AMG like his s63 coupe depreciate so badly. Well for me it’s all about image (how the brand manages the image and residuals) and desirability. For instance a new AMG GT (same engine and fewer seats) will depreciate far less than a s63 coupe since it’s viewed as more sporting faster and a “sports car” hence more desirable.

Also brands that only produce high end cars tend to depreciate less. Look at an Audi R8 and a Lamborghini Huracan -
Essentially the same car. The Lamborghini depreciates less since the image is far better but it’s far easier when Lamborghini doesn’t have to produce an Audi A1. Mercedes has the same issues.

Oh and custard is an infamous PistonHeads incidence. A poster was writing about an amazing car collection and in the thread some people accused the OP of being somewhat of a fantasist. So the thread doubters asked for picture of his cars with a tin of custard on each of this fantasy garage. The pictures of the garage with all the cars + custard tin came straight back.

 

[french]

Hmm thank god this is not Pistonheads ,though this thread is heading that way unfortunately...be grammEr mistakes next...

On topic: being an AMG owner of the V8 variety, I am usually quite proud when it shows 10mpg or less...

 

[alfl23]

The members of the opposite sex may be right.

12.7 mpg? Ye gods! I have a reasonably heavy right foot, and my 5.5 Biturbo estate is averaging just under 20 mpg, though there's not much urban crawling in traffic involved. I expect I'll beat 25 mpg on a run, but I won't be cruising at "Sorry, officer; was I flying too low?" speeds (except possibly on the M6 Toll...).

If you get 12.7 mpg, either you are spending lots of time creeping along in heavy traffic, or you deserve either total respect, or immediate sectioning, or perhaps both.... I genuinely have no idea how you can manage that and still have your licence.

They definitely are, the 12.7 is me living in super Central London, so there's a half an hour per mile rule that seems to be going round, exaggerating but you get the point. I like accelerating fast to 30mph, but I'm not going to outrace Hamilton through traffic, I definitely avoid that kind of risk. Motorway driving gets you a "decent" 20mpg, which sounds well in line with what most of your are getting. It's improving heavily, now that I get free fuel motoring with the Tesla.

 

[alfl23]

I think that the OP has an interesting question. Why do high end AMG like his s63 coupe depreciate so badly. Well for me it’s all about image (how the brand manages the image and residuals) and desirability. For instance a new AMG GT (same engine and fewer seats) will depreciate far less than a s63 coupe since it’s viewed as more sporting faster and a “sports car” hence more desirable.

Also brands that only produce high end cars tend to depreciate less. Look at an Audi R8 and a Lamborghini Huracan -
Essentially the same car. The Lamborghini depreciates less since the image is far better but it’s far easier when Lamborghini doesn’t have to produce an Audi A1. Mercedes has the same issues.

Oh and custard is an infamous PistonHeads incidence. A poster was writing about an amazing car collection and in the thread some people accused the OP of being somewhat of a fantasist. So the thread doubters asked for picture of his cars with a tin of custard on each of this fantasy garage. The pictures of the garage with all the cars + custard tin came straight back.

Recognition is my bet as well. The S Coupe is no head turner and you can drive it full low profile. Connesseurs will recognise it sure, but people never go "wow that's an S coupe", they have no idea, one of the main reasons I bought it. Up close it's clearly more polished than a C class, but it's very far from the loud Lambo icon. Ironically that seems to kill the game financially.

Just to be clear, I didn't get into the Coupé brand new, I prompted all this chatter because I was looking at ordering new for the 2018 model, and getting a nice Brabus exhaust with valve control. I love the car, and I did take a hit for ~30%(of new) depreciation, the first owner was kind enough to take the first 40%. Makes it all the more scary, when I got in after what I thought was the bulk of the depreciation, with a car that barely had a few k miles. That custard thing on PistonHeads is fun, just googled it, I saw the comment earlier but I felt it was addressed to the other poster. I'm not 22 unfortunately, would definitely trade a few cars to go back to that though, youth is wasted on the young..

 

[alfl23]

Still think the first owner of my CL holds the record for AMG depreciation of £100k over 6000 miles.

Since the S63 Coupe is basically the current generation CL, I think these cars are heading almost for the same record.

 

[Bluegnomes]

You could easily be looking at a six figure depreciation on a s63AMG coupe in 3 years. Definitely a place where leasing is a better option.

 

[alfl23]

You could easily be looking at a six figure depreciation on a s63AMG coupe in 3 years. Definitely a place where leasing is a better option.

It's ok Mercedes is trying extremely hard not to sell me one. On top of the UK configurator for the S coupes having been broken ever since the face lift was announced, they have no demo cars in the UK. The new S560 Coupé arrived in Brooklands 1 month ago or so, but no AMGs. I said I'll go to Germany at my expense etc, and do a test drive there, but the German dealerships are refusing to help a customer from a different market under any circumstances. Perhaps I am being more unreasonable than I think asking for my 20 minutes of fame in an LWD car.

If this were Bentley, they would be selling me a 4th country house by now, equipped with stables and electric charging stations, with Bentley furniture and Bentley toothbrushes. Mercedes is becoming a yard sale specialist, perhaps it's time to disappoint the poor teenager in me who once dreamed of owning S classes and let go of the brand as they have of any decent sales skills.

I know it's growth pains, but I am a bit surprised of just how bad they have become at selling, a real shame considering they make some pretty great cars.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Bloke discovers that brand new high performance cars depreciate a lot and are unreliable.

It's cheaper to buy used.

Central London cars often see single digit mpg

Rare cars are difficult to obtain.

Who knew?

.

 

[Deleted member 37751]

Bloke discovers that brand new high performance cars depreciate a lot and are unreliable.

It's cheaper to buy used.

Central London cars often see single digit mpg

Rare cars are difficult to obtain.

Who knew?

.

I read the OP’s problems as being aimed more at the proverbial piss-poor Mercedes aftersales than anything else.

Complaining about single digits mpg from a bi-turbo V8 being driven in London (whilst racing at every other traffic lights) somewhat muddied his point I think, which was how Mercedes as a brand runs out of puff the nearer you get to £100k then completely plummets thereafter.

Also his point about Mercedes current market aspirations is a valid one; where I grew up I would barely see a Mercedes from one day to the next, now they’re almost every other car I see.

 

[alfl23]

Bloke discovers that brand new high performance cars depreciate a lot and are unreliable.

It's cheaper to buy used.

Central London cars often see single digit mpg

Rare cars are difficult to obtain.

Who knew?

.

Bloke learns people on AMG forums are frustrated enough to take every opportunity to be condescending and take a shot
Bloke remembers this is the internet, and promises never to post again. I would perhaps urge in the kindest way other reads to not engage if they don't feel the topic is of interest.

Out of respect for the people here who have invested their time into meaningful answers, I fail to understand why one would even bother wasting their time typing an answer of no value whatsoever. Let's not turn this into ITV reality shows. The issue is genuine, and if you know many people who are completely oblivious to run cost and depreciation, then I don't, from the "bloke" driving a Prius to a friend of mine fortunate enough to own a Pagani Huayra and other such wonders.

Perhaps from experience I'd say the exact opposite is true, the more Pagani you get the more cost market focused people become, who in similar fashion spend a lot of time understanding where their brands are going in 10 years time, who their market segment is, total addressable market, historic depreciation on similar cars from same brand etc etc.

Mercedes is making it impossible for anyone to be sensible outside of throwing in the proverbial towel, there's no way to time an entry/exit into a luxury Mercedes(other than rarities SLR or maybe CLK2000), and no way to get reliable, quality service and reliability for your high end AMG pride and joy, and one way or the other everyone is confirming just that.

Mercedes doesn't care about taking part in a high end market anymore, and their presence here nowadays is mostly marketing focused, trying to make bank on the image of luxury and prestige they once had. The message I got here was either get in line with the programme or don't buy, which I have no doubt is long term premium segment suicide for Merc as they gradually transition to a mass market brand.

If all the people "dumb" enough to buy brand new AMGs for £150 - 200k go to Ferrari instead, how is your "cheap" used market going to look like in 5 - 10 years? I think that's a simple answer.

I stand by my MPG comment, the AMG engine on an input/output basis is terrible, with all respect. Let's not explore more "discovery of the century" comments, what you have here is a money pit with the fuel consumption figures of a Bugatti, while a million miles away from the same power.

I'm not complaining about cost, I'm complaining about the engine being very poorly built, to require as much juice as a car 1.5 - 2x the power. As much as driving style matters, it's not reasonable for a mid power range AMG to get into the consumption figures of a nearly 800bhp v12. It's one of the things that goes to show the lack of quality.

~10mpg is what you get in a McLaren 720S V8 with 700bhp to the wheel on a track day at Silverstone. Again, no one buys these cars to save money, but it just speaks volumes of AMG efficiency.

 

[WDB124066]

MB have never really taken pride in being a fuel efficient option. If they could just build cars that were as reliable as a Hyundai or a Cherry that would be great, but they don't want to. Just like the Brits didn't want to make a car or bike that didn't leak oil. In fact, I believe if they can engineer a fault or numerous faults into a car and believe they can get away with it they will. It really is that simple. They have other objectives now. Think, we will relieve you of your money Mr. Bling. Only then will you come closer to their game. Here they are very efficient, how much can we remove for how little we need to provide. That is the only efficiency they are really interested in now, certainly not fuel efficiency on almost all models.

Here, and on it goes...trainwreck is MB reliability. SL55 Coilover Conversion

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Bloke learns people on AMG forums are frustrated enough to take every opportunity to be condescending and take a shot
Bloke remembers this is the internet, and promises never to post again. I would perhaps urge in the kindest way other reads to not engage if they don't feel the topic is of interest.
.

Hope you don't mind that i cut the rest out, I didn't want to be that bloke who copies a massive block of text.

I can't speak for the rest of then forum but a couple of things spring to mind:

• Whinging posts slagging off MB rarely go well on the forum, maybe because the members feel some kind of brand loyalty for some reason
• The more emotional sounding the post the less empathy
• Your car ownership list won't evoke much sympathy, you must be loaded
• You present yourself as a very wealthy individual with lofty standards which hardly resounds with the 'man in the street' forum member of which we mostly are
• The way that this forum is structured is that very many members click on 'new posts' and often find themselves unwittingly entering an AMG thread, I've often wondered what's happened to the membership and then realised (sometimes after posting) that I have stumbled into the AMG world again.

So, in summary, you are a little out of kilter with those who have upset you. There's nothing wrong with that but, maybe, you could have adapted the way that you presented your thoughts to fit with your audience.

 

[WDB124066]

Yes it's all his fault.

These are a far better option than any AMG from an ownership experience as far as I am concerned.

Lexus LS 600 Hybrid 2008

Even the paint is better than what you get on a Merc and the wheels don't crack and, and, and, and, and, and......

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Yes it's all his fault.

These are a far better option than any AMG from an ownership experience as far as I am concerned.

Lexus LS 600 Hybrid 2008

You OK fella?

Your recent posts have been a bit confrontational.

 

[WDB124066]

No, I sneezed and all my LSD went everywhere, how wierd, now where's that fing phone number!

I got a hold of Jim, thank Christ for that.

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Or look what I found @1:50

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WTF indeed, weirdo.

 

[alfl23]

Hope you don't mind that i cut the rest out, I didn't want to be that bloke who copies a massive block of text.

I can't speak for the rest of then forum but a couple of things spring to mind:

• Whinging posts slagging off MB rarely go well on the forum, maybe because the members feel some kind of brand loyalty for some reason
• The more emotional sounding the post the less empathy
• Your car ownership list won't evoke much sympathy, you must be loaded
• You present yourself as a very wealthy individual with lofty standards which hardly resounds with the 'man in the street' forum member of which we mostly are
• The way that this forum is structured is that very many members click on 'new posts' and often find themselves unwittingly entering an AMG thread, I've often wondered what's happened to the membership and then realised (sometimes after posting) that I have stumbled into the AMG world again.

So, in summary, you are a little out of kilter with those who have upset you. There's nothing wrong with that but, maybe, you could have adapted the way that you presented your thoughts to fit with your audience.

Thank you for this, now that is very useful feedback, you are right, as you can imagine my expectations were realistic in that sense, audience wise I didn't do a great job perhaps, and I never aimed for this to become a car collection showdown in any way, or any vendetta against Mercedes, trash talking for no reason. I am not at all upset, it's a forum where we all vent about things in our own ways, my angle was and remains hopefully quite factual.

High standards or otherwise, I felt the same loyalty to the brand for a long time, it's why I was here in the first place. Everyone here is parting with their cash for a premium performance car, the ownership experience that comes with it should reflect the degree of £££ we parted with. As much as anyone here, I didn't sell my inherited silver spoons and bought cars with the loot. Learning to make the most of money paid to Mercedes was my goal, I wasn't fishing for any particular sympathy on anyone's part, just sizing how badly I've understood the market and brand thus far basically, and to better understand their historical direction from people who've directly owned their cars for a long time, some of which were kind enough to reply here.

Anyway, thank you for all the help, I got all the information I was fishing for!

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

OK, I'll be less concise:

Whinging about depreciation on a new AMG is nonsensical. Compare it to an equivalent M Series car and it's comparable. More upmarket and tasteful, but comparable in terms of depreciation. If you want to avoid steep depreciation, buy used cars. And be wary of recent classic car price growth - Quantitative Easing has pushed all kinds of money into alternative assets from Art to Astons, but that's a one off jump. Don't expect your million pound DB5 to continue growing in price.

Comparing AMG ownerships costs to a Ferrari is nonsensical. No-one, but no-one can put a Ferrari through equivalent usage without deep maintenance and reliability pain. Look in any showroom and see how many cars have more than 60,000 miles on the clock: hardly any. Ten year old 599 with 20k miles on the clock? That'll be £100+k worth of depreciation, sir, call it a fiver a mile.

OK - my personal ownership experience of Ferrari is only from the 550 and 360, but I have plenty of friends who admit the same. Visit a Ferrari owners club meet and you'll hear the same. They cost big money, and problems are often almost impossible to resolve by the dealers. And this is on cars with less than 20k miles on the clock. In addition, the typical 2 or 2+2 seater Ferrari doesn't have the all round usability of your average AMG. It's not the same product.

All car companies offer poor after sales service, especially at the luxury end. Throw in the example of the Lexus LS and you have an exception but, seriously, the LS600 might be the personal choice of Bill Gates, but no-one else thinks it's an AMG competitor. You can't begin to even consider the LS600 as a competitor to an AMG performance car. It's a great car to drive 250,000 miles round the M25, but Chris Harris will never eulogise its performance.

The message that people appear to be giving you here is not "either get in line with the programme or don't buy." It was don't be naive about how idyllic other brands are, or how idyllic Mercedes used to be. You can run off to McLaren, Bentley or Rolls Royce, but rest assured you'll see similar issues there. While the Mercedes of the 1980's were more unaffordable than they are today, their design, manufacturing, safety and reliability issues were immense. And, frankly, they were neither as fast, nor as safe as today's cars.