Paint Damaged by Bird Sh*t

[Robbo]

On Thursday after coming back to the car after work, there was a great big bird sh*t on the bonnet about 2.5" diameter. What with one thing and another I didnt get aroung to cleaning it off until today. When I eventually managed to clean it all off (it was well stuck on), to my horror it had etched deeply into the top clearcoat leaving a rough dull pockmarked blemish, which no amount of T-cut could get rid of. It is so deep that I think it may have gone though the clearcoat

I knew that bird sh*t can damage the paintwork, but these water based paints are a load of crap (literally!) - it was only on there for 2 days and my perfect bonnet now has a huge and obvious blemish. To say that I am unhappy is an understatement.

So everyone please remember to clean off any bird sh*t immediately to avoid permanent paint damage. You have been warned!

 

[splang]

Seriously, try macguires paint (or body) scrub,,,

MUCH better than t-cut - got rid of a big scratch on my bonnet which tcut wouldnt touch...

Let me know how you get on..

Steve

ps only costs 6.99

 

[Anders]

For the bodywork section?

 

[Brian WH]

Agreed - Moved.

 

[John Peerce]

I hate to sound like someone "shutting the staple door after the horse has gone", but if you had a decent wax or resin layer on the car it might just have taken the "hit" from the bird shit rather than your lacquer. It may well be the case that you already have had your car polished and waxed.. but are you sure that it hasent worn off over time etc ?

As a simple rule, if water beads on you car bodywork (say when it rains) then the wax/polish layer is intact, if the water is "flat" and just runs down the surfaces of the car, then its probably due for a wax and polish. Any decent wax/polish should be able to protect the car from bird droppings, tree sap, and UV rays.. in the least ...

 

[catgate]

We have house martins in gay profusion and I find it advantageous to park away from their shite path!

 

[Robbo]

John,

I agree with you, however my paintwork had been done with autoglym polish and extra gloss protection and water was beading off fine.........

Must have been one hell of a bird, cant think what it had been eating!

Just a thought, the bonnet has had a respray by MB Epsom and they used a local specialist. I wonder whether it is softer than OEM paintwork?

 

[John Peerce]

John,
Just a thought, the bonnet has had a respray by MB Epsom and they used a local specialist. I wonder whether it is softer than OEM paintwork?

Thats a good point and a very relavant one to me, so allow me to elaborate at length !

I had my bonnet done two months ago (to get rid of stone chips ) and also my rear bumber sanded, resprayed, and lacquered to get rid of scuff marks.

The issue here is not so much the paint layer, but the lacquer layer. The theory when having the lacquer applied and baked in the furnace or under heaters, is that if its baked for too long then you will have a "harder" shell, which should withstand bird shit and tree sap seeping in. Mercedes cars orginal lacquering is done that way. However, the downside of this way of over-baking the lacquer is that the surface can become too brittle as it was subjected to heat for so long, and becomes susceptible to chipping from stones (hence most Mercedes cars these days have so many stone chips). On the other hand, if the lacuqer is baked less time into "softer" layer, its becomes less prone to stone chips (stones would "bounce off"), but then other things tend to become embedded on the soft surface of the lacquer, and also presumably tree sap and the chemicals from the bird shit will "seep" through this layer. So there is no perfect way for baking the lacquer, each has advantages and disadvantages.

When i look closely at my bumper, i can see very small bits of road debris (eg tar particles) embedded on the surface of the lacuqer, not normally visible from a distance. This means the laquering was done on the soft side. Generally, most bodyshops have the lacquering done softer than the original factory finish, and my guess is that your bonnet was done that way.

Note i had a bigger problem with my AMG alloys when i had them refurbished by MB (who outsourced this to one of those mobile/van services). The layer lacquer was so soft (like a transparent rubber layer instead of a hard shell) that hot brake dust was getting embedded in it and no amount of scrubbing would get it off ! I had it redone by them to a harder finish, but it is still not as perfect as the orginal layer.

Since you had the respray done through the official MB dealer, i think you stand a very good chance of having this corrected by them for free. You can sight poor workmanship and quality etc. The work probably came with a one year gurantee anyway. Its up to you whether to tell them about the bird shit not being cleaned for two days though, as this might hurt you argument. You may just want to simply show them the "patch" left by the bird shit, not knowing what caused it, and complain about their poor workmanship.

 

[Satch]

Bird guano from Seagulls used to cause a lot of problems in the days when I lived in a coastal seaport. Ever wondered who buys all those iffy car covers you see advertised in the Daily Mail and the like?

Arrgghh! Misery if you did not have a garage and even then they got you for the stuff used to strip paint off most things, would corrode brass & bronze, cause surface pitting of aluminium and generally ruin anything left outside. And if the pigeons (yes we had the flying rats as well for they are native cliff dwellers) had been eating berries ended up with purple corrosive splats as well.

Never mind the sheer unpleasantness, in chemical terms it is vile stuff which needs to be removed from paint ASAP and the area well rinsed with water.

In general paints are said to be softer these days thanks to having to be either water based or not contain so much of the nasty solvents. Technology will catch up, but not quite yet it seems

 

[Robbo]

John

Very interesting post. So it looks like it could well be due to the softer lacquer from the respray. Unfortunately the respray was done over a year ago and so I think that I would be pushing my luck to go back to MB after this time.

I think the next thing to do what splang suggests and get hold of some Meguiars Body scrub and give it another go.

 

[cbenz]

It will be interesting to see if the new Mercedes nano-particle paint, meant to be more scratch resistant etc, is more bird lime resistant too.

I whole heartedly agree, bird lime damages paint and seagulls are the worse.

I did read somewhere on the web that, depending on species and diet, the aforementioned turdies can be pH3 to pH4, that's quite nasty!

It does seem that the only safe place is in the garage, but then no one can see your pride and joy and you can't drive it! I'm already paranoid and park over the far side of the supermarket carpark to avoid door bashers. Seems you've got to avoid parking under lamp posts and trees these days too. Now what I really want is my own personal covered space in the supermarket car park, that would be worth saving your points on the loyalty card for!!! :bannana:

Question for the chemists amongst us......

From my 'A' Level chemistry days I seem to remember the pH scale was logarithmic, i.e. one value is 10x more the other. If a pH3 turdy landed on my hot bonnet, is the heat likely to act as a catalyst and enable the aforementioned turdy to do more damage than if the bonnet was cold? If so, bring on the winter!!!!

 

[Robbo]

Cbenz,

Yes, the higher the temp, the faster the reaction. A rule of thumb (IIRC) would be that the reaction kinetics double for every 10 deg C increase in temp. So if you imagine on a hot sunny day, the paintwork is probably over 50 deg C. Compare that to in the winter when it may struggle to get above freezing. The reaction kinetics would therefore be 32 times faster in the summer Or something like that.

 

[Shude]

I had some paint damage on the bootlid of my previous car and no matter what I tried, the paint looked fine when viewed normally, but any reflections in it showed the shape of the guano! Steve (MBenzNL) had a bottle of some thick gloopy 3M stuff which he put a small amount of onto a cloth and then rubbed the area like mad, it was gone in seconds. He said the stuff isn't made any more though!

 

[cbenz]

Cbenz,

Yes, the higher the temp, the faster the reaction. A rule of thumb (IIRC) would be that the reaction kinetics double for every 10 deg C increase in temp. So if you imagine on a hot sunny day, the paintwork is probably over 50 deg C. Compare that to in the winter when it may struggle to get above freezing. The reaction kinetics would therefore be 32 times faster in the summer Or something like that.

Well explained Robbo, nice one!

Seems like the damage season is upon us then! Marvellous!

A long drive to the seaside (heating the bonnet) and parking there all day in the sun under the seagulls could really ruin your day (and your car!).

You'd have thought some manufacturer by now would've come up with some form of wax\sealant\protectant that genuinely will protect your paint from bird lime. In the meantime watch out for those super-heated turds!

I have to confess to now travelling around with a small bottle of water and a few sheets of kitchen roll. If I see a turd on my car, I scrunch up the kitchen roll, soak it in water and place it on the turd and dribble a bit more water on it. Within a few minutes it just slides off, job done!

 

[andy_k]

tee hee - we live at the seaside and we have seagulls nesting on our roof - they seem to fly in patterns so we get bombed once a week - would rather live here and deal with this than live away from the coast - small price to pay

Andy

 

[John Peerce]

as i dont have a garage or off-road parking and park on public roads near my home, i have thought about getting car cover to protect the bodywork from bird droppings and tree sap etc. But having done my research, two things put me off: firstly, i read that car covers can mean that moisture can accumulate on the surface of the car causing long term damage, and secondly, the process of putting on and lifting the car cover can cause fine scratches over time on the surface.

So in the end, it’s just a case of having regular protective resins and waxes etc. I use a product from the US called Dulon, which was (or so the company claims) was developed and is now sold to the marine and aerospace industries to protect the bodywork of planes and boats. So far it has worked well as far as protecting the surface from tree sap and bird shit and without lasting damage. Then again, i haven’t been to the seaside, so I haven’t had this tested against seagull excrement which ranks at par with Iraq's alleged WMDs.