Poor MPG E320 CDI W210

[se97mlm]

Dunno about that, they sold quite a few bad Mercs, why not a few tuning boxes.

They sell anything that will make them money.

Quite right. And they are available at the dealerships, not from Mercedes. If they were that great, we would incorporate the mods as standard.

 

[KLP 92]

Just an update.

Brabus spend alot of money tuning Mercedes. They are not just a random company that tune all manufacturers, just MB. I would not for an instance believe that a chip will cause 10mpg difference; if it did i'm sure a huge fuss would be kicked up.

If you buy a chip on ebay for a fiver, or a piggy back box then yes, your mpg will be worse. 10mpg worse? I doubt.

A proper ECU remap or box will do what it says. It will give you more performance at a slight decrease in economy, but at cruising speeds it is normally better on fuel. How do i know? Well i've chipped every diesel i've owned and haven't complained about economy till now.

Yes there are downsides to chipping a diesel. Injectors fail more commonly, gearboxes die relatively easily and any turbo pipe that is beginning to fail will leak.

Now i beleive i have fixed the car. I recently changed the instrument cluster in the car, i had a pixel fault so bought one from a breaker. it was removed from a E320 CDI same year as mine so i presumed its a straight swap over. The only difference i found is that when you fill the tank my old cluster said 15.4 gallons and the new one said 14.2 gallons when full. didn't really think anything of it till i spoke to Ollie at PCS.

Now apparently the coding is very important on these clusters, even though its removed from the similar car it may be different.

SO this morning i swapped the clusters back round, filled the tank to the brim, drove 86 miles of mixed town and motorway driving and back to the same petrol station, same pump so i can have an accurate reading. The trip computer showed 35.2mpg average since refill, i filled up 10 litres dead. I make that to 38.2 mpg, so better than the trip meter.

Has anyone ever heard of this problem?? I know its right as the same journey was done yesterday but took nearly 20 litres

Needless to say the old cluster is back in the car till i can find out about coding it correctly.

Now i wouldn't have thought a cluster could be important to fuelling side of things, does anyone knwo what it exactly controls?

 

[Dieselman]

The cluster can't control the engine ECU so I am perplexed as to why the actual consumption alters although the apparent consumption will due to the incorrect tank size being computed.

Run your tests over a longer distance.

 

[KLP 92]

The cluster can't controlt eh engine ECU so I am perplexed as to why the actual consumption alters although the apparent consumption will due to the incorrect tank size being computed.

Run your tests over a longer distance.

Thats what i thought, but the figures are spot on with this cluster. I'm not bothered about the figures on the display, the actual economy with the other cluster is worrying.

I will do some more runs later and let you know.

 

[Dieselman]

Can't you just swap the actual pixilated display over...


It will be the tank size throwing out the calculation as it refers to the sender to know how much fuel has been used.

 

[KLP 92]

Can't you just swap the actual pixilated display over...


It will be the tank size throwing out the calculation as it refers to the sender to know how much fuel has been used.

D-man the prob is the actual real time fuel consumption. Whats displayed is of no concern to me, but on my recent trip i average 30mpg when i should have had alot more. Thats at cruising speeds, pure motorway mileage.

I did the same 80 mile trip yesterday which resulted in an average of approx 20-25mpg. The same trip today with the original cluster gave me 39mpg.

We're not talking 1-2mpg here! Both clusters displayed the same mpg, 35-36mpg on the trip, but with the old one it actually averages 10-15mpg more

Will do a few more runs and see if i have an intermittent problem

 

[se97mlm]

The coding of the cluster is important, as there are 3 tank sizes for the 211: 65L, 70L and 80L. Not only that, but some other things can be coded via the cluster that the ECU reads. For example, on a Sprinter, the rear axle ratio is programmed into the cluster, not the engine ECU. Usually all variant coding is done with the engine ECU, but there may be a coding in the cluster that overrides a coding in the ECU.

Regards
Matt


edit: removed DPF suggestion as realised this is a W210!

 

[Soltan]

The coding of the cluster is important, as there are 3 tank sizes for the 211: 65L, 70L and 80L.
Regards
Matt
quote]

Hi Matt,
Is there an easy way to tell how large your tank is, other than fill it up

 

[se97mlm]

Hi Matt,
Is there an easy way to tell how large your tank is, other than fill it up

Well for me, yes because I have the Daimler in-house development tools

If you know anyone with Star, they could look it up.

Alternatively, you could enter your VIN into

http://old.mbclub.ru/mb/vin/?lng=eng

and read if the option code for larger tank is listed. If yes, it's 80L. If no, then it's 65L for a saloon or 70L for an estate.

Regards
Matt

p.s For you it's easy, all the 320s have the 80L tank

 

[Dieselman]

Usually all variant coding is done with the engine ECU, but there may be a coding in the cluster that overrides a coding in the ECU.

Any chance of finding where the variant coding is stored on an E300Td and what options are available for final drive ratio...

 

[Dieselman]

I did the same 80 mile trip yesterday (

And did the odometer register the same distance covered?

I just wondered if the cluster was from a 220Cdi so has the smaller tank and lower final drive ratio.

 

[se97mlm]

Any chance of finding where the variant coding is stored on an E300Td and what options are available for final drive ratio...

I'll ask around about that tomorrow. I'm not sure that the software is sophisticated enough to use the rear axle ratio on the 300td. To help me answer that, do you have a drive by wire throttle pedal, or is it still a cable attached directly to the pump?

In the Russian parts catalogue you can look up the different axle ratios available. I know the speedo is unaffected by and axle ratio change, as the signal for that comes from the front wheels. Would you go for a longer or shorter ratio?

 

[Dieselman]

I'll ask around about that tomorrow. I'm not sure that the software is sophisticated enough to use the rear axle ratio on the 300td. To help me answer that, do you have a drive by wire throttle pedal, or is it still a cable attached directly to the pump?

In the Russian parts catalogue you can look up the different axle ratios available. I know the speedo is unaffected by and axle ratio change, as the signal for that comes from the front wheels. Would you go for a longer or shorter ratio?

It definately uses the axle ratio as the car throws a gearbox speed error when altering the ratio.
I want to go from 2.87:1 to 2.65:1.

The E300TD is very sophisticated I'll have you know......and uses an electronic throttle.

Cheers

 

[television]

Can't you just swap the actual pixilated display over...



.

How can changing the display help,its nothing to do with the read out

 

[Dieselman]

How can changing the display help,its nothing to do with the read out

He's got one good unit with a dodgy display and one bad unit with a good display.


No..??

 

[KLP 92]

And did the odometer register the same distance covered?

I just wondered if the cluster was from a 220Cdi so has the smaller tank and lower final drive ratio.

Definately from a E320 CDI as its the 160mph speedo and 5000 revs.

The odometer was correct, the same journey to europe is done at least once a year so the entire round trip is almost identically the same +-10 miles (depends if i'm in an adventurous mood!)

 

[KLP 92]

He's got one good unit with a dodgy display and one bad unit with a good display.


No..??

Yes you are correct. The only problem is that the cluster i have is an elegance one, it has black dials compared to my avantgardee one which has grey dials.

I'll given the cluster to aka$h who'll get the coding done for me in the next few days so i'll report back then.

 

[se97mlm]

It definately uses the axle ratio as the car throws a gearbox speed error when altering the ratio.
I want to go from 2.87:1 to 2.65:1.

The E300TD is very sophisticated I'll have you know......and uses an electronic throttle.

Cheers

I suspect the variant coding is in the engine ECU then, and passed on to the transmission ECU. Someone with Star must be able to change it, as I remember Steve the independent mechanic in Maidstone telling me how confusingly complicated it is the number of things you have to code. With the Daimler development tool, you can code entire standard vehicle configurations in one go, or change individual components, like the axle ratio.

I wonder how much fuel you'll save dropping the revs at 80mph from 2500 to 2300?

 

[KLP 92]

The coding of the cluster is important, as there are 3 tank sizes for the 211: 65L, 70L and 80L. Not only that, but some other things can be coded via the cluster that the ECU reads. For example, on a Sprinter, the rear axle ratio is programmed into the cluster, not the engine ECU. Usually all variant coding is done with the engine ECU, but there may be a coding in the cluster that overrides a coding in the ECU.

Regards
Matt


edit: removed DPF suggestion as realised this is a W210!

Would the cluster be able to cause a change in fuelling though? Seems odd that the cluster could be responsible for a 10mpg increase in consumption.

The only odd but is that i've not noticed any performance loss, black smoke issues, just a sharp increase in consumption.

 

[Dieselman]

Definately from a E320 CDI as its the 160mph speedo and 5000 revs.

The odometer was correct, the same journey to europe is done at least once a year so the entire round trip is almost identically the same +-10 miles (depends if i'm in an adventurous mood!)

That'd be the same as this 220 then.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2000-MERCEDES...oryZ9855QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

All the CDi speedos go to 160mph.

Just makes me wonder because the difference in consumption is approximately 1.5 times as much which tallies with four or six fuel injectors.