Best way to play the Used Mercedes Salesman game?

[Deleted member 65149]

I worked for a dealership for a few years (not as a salesman) so seen it from the other side. The salesmen have mostly been at it for years and know all the tricks far better than any punter. If the forecourt is very quiet then just for their own entertainment they may play along with your game, but usually they prefer to spend their time with serious punters. They don't want to spend hours with the multitude of time-wasters who visit when they have nothing better to do.

Salesmen are there for one purpose - to make a sale. If they have a choice between someone who's genuinely keen on a particular car and someone else who'll take up a couple of hours of their time before saying the colour is wrong, they'll obviously try harder to sell to the first one.

And that's where you can get them hooked. Always show an interest in the car you want. Get the salesman salivating at the thought of the commission he'll get when you sign on the dotted. He'll ask you early on what your budget is - don't tell him (but always have one in mind). Let him do the majority of the talking; reel him in slowly. Get him to spend time with you so he gets to the point that he's desperate to sell. By then you'll have the upper hand.

Let the negotiations begin. Of course his first price will be whatever's on the ticket. Don't come back with a silly lower offer, just ask him to do better. Whatever he comes back with, stay silent. Try to do no more than put on a disapproving face. WAIT. Let him come back with a lower offer (and he will). Remind him that you really want the car, but you were hoping he could do better. Don't plead poverty or any of those silly comments - they don't wash. Sit it out.

In a dealership he'll most certainly eventually say he'll go to talk to his manager/dealer principal. He may just be popping out to the loo, but he'll be thinking about the best he can do to secure the deal. He'll come back and say his boss has agreed to £xxx. Look disappointed.

You now have the big decision to make. Do you take the next stage and say you need time to think about it because the price isn't quite right. Or do you want the car so desperately that you're worried someone else may snap it up before you. Only you know the answer to that one. Easier with a new car; not so easy with a used car.

Let's assume it's the used car you've been looking for for ages. Tell the salesman you want to go back and sit in the car on your own (or with wife/friend/kids) to think about it. Stay in the car for as long as you can. If the salesman comes back out in the next five minutes you really have him and can do a much better deal. If he leaves you and waits for you to go back to see him then you're probably close to the best you'll get. Try your very first counter offer of a round figure below what he last asked (how low depending on how well you think the earlier tactics have gone). If your offer is a little lower add "... and I'll sign the deal now".

The big secret is to let the salesman do all the talking when you get to the negotiation stage. The quieter you are the more likely you are to get the best deal. The real skill is keeping quiet when he's already reached the price that you think is good!

How much you get get off still depends on all the points mentioned by others though. Now go get it.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

I forgot to mention, after you've got that perfect deal and just about to shake hands, ask for some extras like a full tank of fuel and 12 months road tax.

 

[NISFAN]

Approved used cars are outselling new by 3-1 right now, most OEM's won't give much off a used at the moment. So expect to pay close to sticker price.

New car deals is where the big discounts are at present.

Good post Knighterrant

 

[johnfromstaffs]

Good post Knighterrant [/QUOTE]

In respect of clothing, when we first called on the dealer, SWMBO and I were dressed like tramps and driving our 1977 Corsa on the way back from the local tip, having dumped some old carpet. It didn't seem to make any difference.

 

[D-18]

Perhaps it is a function of age, but I've found that salesmen have generally treated me better as I've got older. I assume that in their eyes, you probably appear less of a tyrekicker/dreamer.

I'm upfront with them in terms of what I'm looking for, approximately what I think I might spend and I make it clear I won't be playing any silly games. Some people can be very rude to salesmen, I try to treat them the way I think they should treat me and I have usually ended up buying several cars from the same person. I'm sure I have not been able to negotiate the very last penny on every purchase, but have concluded deals which were satisfactory to me.

I think the best advice, as stated in other posts, is to set your budget and be prepared to walk away if you can't agree a deal. There are always other cars out there if you look long enough, but is difficult to resist a 2nd hand one if it is exactly what you want. If it is what you want, then who cares if it costs few £hundred more than the bloke down the pub thinks you should have paid - just get the damn thing bought and enjoy it.

 

[Dryce]

The salesmen have mostly been at it for years and know all the tricks far better than any punter.

The big secret is to let the salesman do all the talking when you get to the negotiation stage.

I think there are no hard and fast rules. Different attitudes and different deals.

Salesmen and customers can both be oddly irrational and stupid.

It's quite possible to walk into a showroom with the intent of buying a car, stating that intent, and wanting to shake hands on it there and then - and still have a deal that was acceptable to both sides fall over because one side or other will be playing games.

My biggest complaint is gamesmanship.

You have £20K to spend on a car at a dealership. They're prepared to sell for £20K but the salesman thinks he can get an extra £500 so tries to hold at £21K and you end up wasting several days as he chips it down by £250 per call.

Customers are sometimes no better. Dealer needs to get £20K for the car. Customer went in expecting to pay £20K for the cars. Dealer quickly agrees to sell at £20K and customer figures 'that was easy - there must be more to come off' and walks away to wait for the call.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

Some people can be very rude to salesmen, I try to treat them the way I think they should treat me.

All good points from D-18, but especially that one. Any salesman worth his salt will know the importance of using your name regularly (it gives you a subconcious reassurance that he's a good, honest person who cares about you). But the technique also works the other way around. His confidence in you and desire to make a sale will increase if you're nice back to him and use his name. These are games, but not underhand games.

 

[Dryce]

Perhaps it is a function of age, but I've found that salesmen have generally treated me better as I've got older. I assume that in their eyes, you probably appear less of a tyrekicker/dreamer.

Depends what you're buying.

We were brushed off in an Audi dealership a few years ago when looking for a TT DSG.

We were not young even then.

 

[Merc Owner 2B]

Another point that I'd like to add is that the MB dealership sales people that I know do not work for commission. They are paid bonuses based upon saitisfactorily completed customer surveys delivered to the customer following each sale.

 

[NISFAN]

Depends what you're buying.

We were brushed off in an Audi dealership a few years ago when looking for a TT DSG.

We were not young even then.

Maybe you didn't look like a c*ck (as JC describes typical Audi drivers)

 

[effbee584]

A) does the end of month / quarter thing help to negotiate extra discount or is that an urban myth?

Not on my last purchase - end of January. MB sales staff are 'apparently' not targeted on sales volume, I concluded that they are salaried with a dealership bonus. When I mentioned an extra sale for him just at the end of the month he was just not bothered - maybe an act????

B) every time I've been in they seem more interested in selling paint protection, gap insurance and extra warranty's- if you strip all that away does that affect your discount on the car?

It did not work that way for me, car deal was sorted and agreed before I even met the 'finance' manager, who I did not need as a cash buyer. They will probably not be a salesman since they have to be FSA approved to advise on loans and insurance. I did take out GAP cover - quite cheap, MB servicing plan and heavily discounted extra 2yr dealer warranty.

C) Car I'm looking at is 18k and has just arrived -what kind of discount would you expect to negotiate?

Same price as mine so probably nothing - they gave me a better trade-in value rather than lower their price. All the same to me and I was pleased with the deal. I later learned that they lost money on my trade-in, which went auction.

In general, I played it cool and disinterested, my wife " 'er indoors" let the game down by drooling over a black CLS, not the one I ended up buying. All in all buying through this main dealer was a good experience.

 

[NISFAN]

Another point that I'd like to add is that the MB dealership sales people that I know do not work for commission. They are paid bonuses based upon saitisfactorily completed customer surveys delivered to the customer following each sale.

I find that hard to believe, what if only 25% of people fill in those surveys? He gets no bonus?

My understanding is that most dealerships work on a very similar commission banding system. The salesman doesn't get commission directly from one sale, more they have to sell x number of cars to stay in a commission banding. The bands are far apart, so most generally aim to stay in a comfortable middle band. They do get commission on extras like the GAP, Paint care, tyre insurance, etc that is why they push those so hard.

 

[Deleted member 65149]

Depends what you're buying.

We were brushed off in an Audi dealership a few years ago when looking for a TT DSG.

We were not young even then.

Proof that Audi salesmen care for the elderly. They knew you'd be saddled with massive bills if you made the mistake of buying the TT DSG!

 

[NISFAN]

Proof that Audi salesmen care for the elderly. They knew you'd be saddled with massive bills if you made the mistake of buying the TT DSG!

Ha ha, also you looked like a person that might be put off with the idea that you have to open the bonnet every 2000 miles to add another litre of oil.

As soon as you rock up in a Mercedes the salesmen all think "Pffffft!!! we aren't going to close that sale"

 

[Carrsey]

In a dealership he'll most certainly eventually say he'll go to talk to his manager/dealer principal. He may just be popping out to the loo, but he'll be thinking about the best he can do to secure the deal. He'll come back and say his boss has agreed to £xxx. Look disappointed.

I know they all do it, but for me it makes me think he cant do the job if he cant make simple decisions. They should know the product and know the bottom price.. If you dont you shouldnt be on the floor dealing with the public..

 

[NISFAN]

I know they all do it, but for me it makes me think he cant do the job if he cant make simple decisions. They should know the product and know the bottom price.. If you dont you shouldnt be on the floor dealing with the public..

They know the bottom price very well, it is on their lists in coded form. Salesmen have pride in not being in the 'can only sell if he offers the highest discount' category. No need to, the next punter will buy it.

 

[Carrsey]

They know the bottom price very well, it is on their lists in coded form. Salesmen have pride in not being in the 'can only sell if he offers the highest discount' category. No need to, the next punter will buy it.

O i know they know, just cant be doing with their little games and as i say to me i makes them look like they cant do the job...

Its like when a trader (not main dealer) says "cant knock anything off as this is what we paid for it" yeah what ever mate, bye bye..

 

[theogeor]

Few things I do and always work for me irrespective which dealer you go to and what brand. Also the same rules apply to all negotiations which is part of what I do for a living

1. Go prepared. Do your maths and calculate the figures in advance. Create different scenarios and memorize them. You need the fantastic, good and bad scenario calculations. Be realistic if you are targeting a specific car and compare the going prices for similar cars for example in autotrader.
2. Know the cut off point... When it goes from good to bad...
3. Never show to be too enthusiastic. Stay as cold and calm as possible but at the same time make sure you indicate that you are a serious buyer and not a time waster...
4. Try to get the upper hand in the whole discussion. Never allow the sales person to change subject or diver your attention to something else. Also even if the car looks perfect find things that you do not like i.e. tyres are a bit worn, scratch here and there etc... You need to have the upper hand in the psychological game
5. Pass the ball and the responsibility of making the sale back to the sales person. They are not used to that... Tell him/her that is their decision if they want to sell or not at that specific moment and not yours
6. If the discussion is going well then ask the sales man to give you a final price. IF they do not then write them on a piece of paper the price you want and give it to them (writting it down is a psychological thing). The price should be lower than the target price so as to allow you some room for a counteroffer. Tell them that this is what you are willing to pay for the car and tell him to thing about it before he gives you an answer. Most if not all the times I have done that the price I have paid was either that or close to that.. Also try to get some value add if they ask you to pay a bit more price that you wanted to i.e. new tyres, mats, full valet , minor scratches to be repaired etc...
7. If there is no agreement then stick to your price limits and tell them to give you a call if they change their mind. Stay professional and polite all the time.


Those are my rules when negotiating. Pick and choose the ones you are comfortable with


Regards


Theo

 

[DominoD7]

Ok an update...


Went to MB dealers today- found it was actually a used centre only so no mad rush with new Reg plates. Viewed the car, test drove it and all went well. All spec required except media interface which I can get retrofitted for £500 so was hoping to get discount to cover it.
Stepped inside to crunch the numbers and played it as calmly as I can- usual procedure let me speak to my manager etc etc, screen price came down £700. I explained I was looking to do the deal about £750 lower to do the deal today but I could net get them to budge any further.
On a seperate note I did like for like comparison on PCP vs Agility and to actually own the car at the end of 3 years the PCP works out £850 cheaper which was a surprise, I poked a little further on the Agility details and did not realise you have to pay interest on the proportion of the car that you hand back after 3 years (the balloon payment)
I guess it makes sense, it just came as a shock when I deliberately left a low £1000 on the agility with a large deposit and deducting the balloon payment and was told I had to pay £2500 at a so called "flat 5% rate"

Ended up leaving the showroom to think it over so might pursue the pcp option and see whether they can be persuaded to drop any more.

Cheers

D7

 

[Palmball]

How about:

- Do your research on similar cars (and i mean similar, no point comparing a dealer C250 to an E500 sold by mick and bobs car pitch)
- Dont play any games
- Be honest about what you want
- Ask them for their best deal
- Tell them what you want to pay based on your research
- Do a deal or dont if it doesnt suit.

Ironically, most salesman I know prefer customers who are upfront and honest rather than those who want to mess about playing games.

There are some good suggestions on this thread but the above one is the most sensible. All this talk of waiting for the right time or pretending to not be interested...sorry, but not in my experience.

I have bought my fair share of cars at all price points and what Jay has suggested never failed me. Do your research, do more research and then based on this, decide an acceptable price you want to pay. Not a price you think you should pay 'because you want £x discount' (some cars are already priced to sell so theres NO discount ), but a price based upon as much fact as you can get hold of such as what other similar examples are being sold at, broker prices and what typical trade-in values are.

Then walk into the dealer, preferably having made an appointment, and be serious from the first moment. If I'm ready to buy a car that I know I want then within the first few minutes I've told the salesperson that they should have a deal today. And because I've generally done my research, I know that my offer is likely to be fair and achievable so he won't think I'm playing games or being silly when I give my first and final offer.

People often ask how I get some of the deals I've got and my response is always 'be prepared and be serious'. Nothing gets a salesperson salivating more than the prospect of a guaranteed and prompt deal...the sooner they can close me down, the sooner they can move onto the next customer.

Also, showing excitement is not a weakness or to be artificially avoided - it helps build rapport, it's normally a GENUINE reaction (which is very important - we all want salespeople to be genuine with us so why wouldn't a salesperson want to feel their customers are genuine?) and it makes your seriousness very believable. You can be excited and then still refuse to buy if the price isn't right...it all down to your personal self control!

I am also pretty sure that my technique rarely results in me paying the very lowest price....but is this always the most important thing? Sure, you can squeeze the lowest price but you're unlikely to ever REALLY know how well you've done. Surely it's best to do your research (there's that word again!) and then pay a fair price that is acceptable to you, whilst building rapport with the dealer /salesperson in case you should ever need them on side in future (something that as also worked very much in my favour on a few occasions!).

And finally...one more reason to let your natural emotions come through....it's a BIG purchase so you should feel great about it. And you're more likely to enjoy the process if you're, well, actually enjoying the process! If the end result is you get a car for a realistic price that you decided you wanted to pay, what more could you ask for?