Formula 1, Moto GP, WSB, 2021 Season

[GeeJayW]

I agree with masi going but then again turn 6 should of bin a change of position or at least give the advantage back which never happened so it was a bit of give and take ,yes redbull wrer beat untill the safety car and now Mercedes have lodged a protest, just except the outcome redbull took the gamble, Mercedes played it safe and lost

Without looking at the timings, I can’t judge whether or not the advantage gained by Lewis avoiding Max in Turn 6 was handed back. Max and Red Bull played a blinder today, but Mercedes and Lewis were faster and their pit strategy would have been based on the sporting regulations which would appear to have been breached by the race director.

 

[whitenemesis]

Perhaps a modification of the rules when under the Safety Car?
Cars to keep to the gaps between cars just before the SC comes out, so no bunching up, no loosing an X sec lead?

 

[Dryce]

I agree with masi going but then again turn 6 should of bin a change of position or at least give the advantage back which never happened so it was a bit of give and take ,yes redbull wrer beat untill the safety car and now Mercedes have lodged a protest, just except the outcome redbull took the gamble, Mercedes played it safe and lost

In Turn 6 we clearly see LH avoiding a collision.

And therein lies the story of the problem with dealing with any decision under the current regulations with MV at the front of the race.

The problem with what happened in the last laps is that a *selective* instruction was given that affected the result of the race. Moreover it didn't correct anything - it reinforced the inadvertent impacts of the safety car on giving advantage to some teams and not others. If they had not issued that *selective* instruction then the F1 authorities couldn't be accused (rightfully) of playign fast and lossie with the rules to affect the outcome of the race.

F1 is very lucky to have two outstanding drivers taking it down to the wire at this race. And both are worthy world champions. The result of *this* race was an utter farce. Yet again F1 demonstrates that you can thpow billions of ££ at a large numbervery very clever people and end up with simple crass stupidity having a bigger effect than all those engineers, technicians, computers, and wind tunnels on a given Sunday.

It's very unsatisfactory.

Consider the nightmare if this would have been Lewis Hamilton's first WDC - the ramifications on the sport would be horrendous with accusations of deliberate racial bias and a fix.

I suspect that on this occasion those in charge wanted to do 'the right thing' and made a huhe error thinking they were acting in the interests of the sport as a spectacle. That's worrying. Because in that moment they lost sight of what was actually right and what was fair - and potentially bring the sport into disrepute. As the immediate excitement fades then the difficult questions need to be faced.

 

[GeeJayW]

Perhaps a modification of the rules when under the Safety Car?
Cars to keep to the gaps between cars just before the SC comes out, so no bunching up, no loosing an X sec lead?

The rules are there to be applied and adhered to. What we’ve seen throughout this season is inconsistency, indecision and lack of clarity from the race director. He negotiates with the teams on decisions instead of just making them in line with the regulations. Today was the cherry on top of the already thick layer of icing on the cake. A complete and utter farce.

 

[Dryce]

Perhaps a modification of the rules when under the Safety Car?
Cars to keep to the gaps between cars just before the SC comes out, so no bunching up, no loosing an X sec lead?

It's really hard to sort out the situation with the Safety Car. We have seen arguments about keeping the pit closed when the SC is out. But in a sport where drivers are required to change tyres that would create a disadvantage.

Things have become harder in the last few years because the circumstances under which a VSC or SC come out mean we see more laps under them and the tyres are actually designed to degrade and there are multuple tyres options meaning a greater variety of strategy / opportunity.

 

[GeeJayW]

It's really hard to sort out the situation with the Safety Car. We have seen arguments about keeping the pit closed when the SC is out. But in a sport where drivers are required to change tyres that would create a disadvantage.

Things have become harder in the last few years because the circumstances under which a VSC or SC come out mean we see more laps under them and the tyres are actually designed to degrade and there are multuple tyres options meaning a greater variety of strategy / opportunity.

Shouldn’t only be able to change compounds under green flag conditions.

 

[Swotty]

Taken from the comments section of the DT:

"The decision of race officials to ignore their own safety car rules was disgraceful. rule 48.2 of the FIA rules clearly states 'If the clerk of the course considers it safe to do so, and the message "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW OVERTAKE" has been sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system, any cars that have been lapped by the leader will be required to pass the cars on the lead lap and the safety car.' Not just the cars between Hamilton and Verstappen. The rule also states. 'Unless the clerk of the course considers the presence of the safety car is still necessary, once the last lapped car has passed the leader the safety car will return to the pits at the end of the following lap.' In this instance the safety car didn't wait until the following lap to leave but left on the same lap."

If true, then Mercedes may have a strong case to challenge the result.

 

[Deleted member 55947]

This win by MV will always be tainted by a decision made by the officials which is out of his control and that’s sad.

 

[Dryce]

If true, then Mercedes may have a strong case to challenge the result.

I think they can clearly argue that the last lap was raced against regulations.

Trouble with this is that it's potentially so clear cut that it can't be thrown to one side. The sport is now stuck in a dilemma.

What a monumental **** up.

 

[BPD07]

This win by MV will always be tainted by a decision made by the officials which is out of his control and that’s sad.

Well he will just have to do it again next year, to satisfy those that say it’s not a clean victory.

 

[GeeJayW]

Taken from the comments section of the DT:

"The decision of race officials to ignore their own safety car rules was disgraceful. rule 48.2 of the FIA rules clearly states 'If the clerk of the course considers it safe to do so, and the message "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW OVERTAKE" has been sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system, any cars that have been lapped by the leader will be required to pass the cars on the lead lap and the safety car.' Not just the cars between Hamilton and Verstappen. The rule also states. 'Unless the clerk of the course considers the presence of the safety car is still necessary, once the last lapped car has passed the leader the safety car will return to the pits at the end of the following lap.' In this instance the safety car didn't wait until the following lap to leave but left on the same lap."

If true, then Mercedes may have a strong case to challenge the result.

Great… weakness from Masi under pressure (from Red Bull and Liberty) leads to a decision that doesn’t comply with the sporting regulations. Now whatever the final official result is, it will be coated in sh!t. What a great day for F1.

 

[Red C220]

It really will be a bad day for Formula1 as a sport as a whole if the result is changed after the fact.

There have been some strange and inconsistent decisions throughout the season which have penalised and benefitted both teams.

Next year is a big change in design and I'm really looking forward to a fresh start. Hoping Lando gets a good car under him next year.

 

[neilrr]

What a farce!

Did MV get a nose in front of LH immediately before LH put the hammer down on the last lap restart?

I notice Betfair's F1 Abu Dhabi page is showing "Suspended". Does that mean they are holding off on settling bets? Usually when a race or event is over they settle within a few minutes & the page is soon taken down.

EDIT. They have just removed F1 & all the Motorsports section.

 

[Spider10]

Racial bias has no place anywhere let alone on here if it was LHs 1st championship I would like too think the same decisions would have been made if
the boot was on the other foot how many on here would just comment, and a well done LH you deserve it WELL it didn't happen and tbh they both deserved to win which is why it has been a brilliant season to watch (some decisions going MB way other's not)

 

[Dryce]

This win by MV will always be tainted by a decision made by the officials which is out of his control and that’s sad.

I think the result of this race was wrong. So in that sense Sir LH was robbed by incompetence of the F1 setup.

But I won't consider MV tainted by a decision made by others when the season was so close that he and Sir LH were on equal points and so far ahead of the rest of the field both on the tracks and in the WDC.

If the result is overturned I won't consider MV robbed.

If the result stands then I will consider MV a worthy WDC. (though I'll reserve the right to comment on his driving attitude!). MV is outstanding.

 

[GeeJayW]

What a farce!

Did MV get a nose in front of LH immediately before LH put the hammer down on the last lap restart?

I notice Betfair's F1 Abu Dhabi page is showing "Suspended". Does that mean they are holding off on settling bets? Usually when a race or event is over the page is taken down quickly.

Max did go an inch or two ahead of Lewis under the safety car, I remember commenting at the time. Not worthy of a penalty in my view, but stranger things have happened.

 

[Dryce]

Racial bias has no place anywhere let alone on here if it was LHs 1st championship

Consider if LH had just been *denied* his first WDC today under these circumstances.

Now that would be very highly charged and political beyond the confines of the sport and the tabloids.

 

[Bellow]

Hamilton had the race won on lap 48 with even Horner admitting Verstappen had nothing more to offer. That the race director then engineered a situation that reversed that situation giving Verstappen an unearned opportunity to win is unacceptable.

 

[Dryce]

Hamilton had the race won on lap 48 with even Horner admitting Verstappen had nothing more to offer. That the race director then engineered a situation that reversed that situation giving Verstappen an unearned opportunity to win is unacceptable.

It's interesting how compliant the broadcasters are in the immediate aftermath.

Huge commentary team at Sky and nobody really starts to question (or show any realk depth of thought) until they have to talk about Mercedes protest.

I regret not seeing Messrs Coulthard and Webber get their heads around the whole situation as it actually developed. I would have 'enjoyed' it but not for good reasons.

 

[Darrell]

Hamilton had the race won on lap 48 with even Horner admitting Verstappen had nothing more to offer. That the race director then engineered a situation that reversed that situation giving Verstappen an unearned opportunity to win is unacceptable.

If it was that obvious and you managed to see that from your tv screen then I’m sure that the lawyers from Mercedes will chew up the race director and spit him out.