Formula 1, Moto GP, WSB, 2021 Season

[Darrell]

Big changes to the cars next year, let's see if Mercedes can steal a march on the others (again) and LH get his 8th WDC next year?

What about big changes to the F1 staff??

 

[GeeJayW]

I won't name him but think his initials are P N.
Correct or way off the mark?,

Phil Neville is a pop star!!? Who knew?

 

[GeeJayW]

What about big changes to the F1 staff??

Given that the idea of next year’s cars is to allow cars to follow much more closely. There also needs to be a change/reinforcement of the driving standards regulations. Clumsy, aggressive driving will get very messy.

 

[Dryce]

what is almost certain to end up as a major embarrassment for F1 and the FIA.

The comments I hear from those who are not so interested in F1 - would - if representative of wider population - suggest that F1 has belittled itself significantly.

 

[Dryce]

Does anyone really believe if Hamilton had pitted and was behind Verstappen it wouldn't have finished under the safety car?

I don't think this was a 'fix' as such.

I think it was a gross professional error by those in charge who lost sight of their duty to the uphold the regulations on behalf of the competitors and the fans.

I think Mr Masi simply wanted to get the race going again and without having time to think about it properly seized on the chance to do it.

He now leaves F1 with a problem in that as read they have a race that can be considered to have been run outside the regulations - with that race one of the most watched in recent times.

 

[st13phil]

Todt's term as FIA President ends on 17th December. I wouldn’t be surprised if his successor decides he wants to appoint a new F1 Race Director, and also to undertake some “tidying up” of the F1 Sporting Regulations.

 

[pmcgsmurf]

I've just been looking at the timing charts and gaps between drivers.

Max is 8.3 behing when he pits on Lap 13.
Lewis pits a lap later then the gap ends up at around 5 seconds between the two of them.
Sergio holds Lewis up till Lap 20 and Max ends up around 2 seconds behind, all straight forward so far.

On Lap 36 Max at around 8 seconds behind stops again then ends up around 20 seconds behind (less time lost with VSC).
This is the point where I think the Mercedes strategy lost the plot, leaving Lewis to do 44 Laps on these tyres when he simply did not have too!

Max gets the gap down to around 12 seconds by Lap 53 stops for softs and ends up only 15.4 seconds behind due to even less time lost with the Safety Car.

I do think the strategists at Mercedes got this wrong and were too focussed on the track position rather than the "what ifs".

 

[GeeJayW]

I've just been looking at the timing charts and gaps between drivers.

Max is 8.3 behing when he pits on Lap 13.
Lewis pits a lap later then the gap ends up at around 5 seconds between the two of them.
Sergio holds Lewis up till Lap 20 and Max ends up around 2 seconds behind, all straight forward so far.

On Lap 36 Max at around 8 seconds behind stops again then ends up around 20 seconds behind (less time lost with VSC).
This is the point where I think the Mercedes strategy lost the plot, leaving Lewis to do 44 Laps on these tyres when he simply did not have too!

Max gets the gap down to around 12 seconds by Lap 53 stops for softs and ends up only 15.4 seconds behind due to even less time lost with the Safety Car.

I do think the strategists at Mercedes got this wrong and were too focussed on the track position rather than the "what ifs".

Interesting, I haven't looked at the timings was just going off comments from MB made yesterday. Can you comment on where Lewis would have come out had he pitted for new tyres the lap after Max did (37)? He would surely have lost time on the in-lap because of the VSC and wouldn't have been able to make places up.

They did ask Lewis which tyre (medium or hard( he would prefer if they needed to stop him. He said either, as both felt good. In the event, it didn't matter of course, as they didn't fit anything. Could well be a screw up from the team I guess.

With Max on new(wish) softs at the end, it may not have made any difference to Lewis' race anyway. though would clearly have been better than the boots he had on.

 

[pmcgsmurf]

Interesting, I haven't looked at the timings was just going off comments from MB made yesterday. Can you comment on where Lewis would have come out had he pitted for new tyres the lap after Max did (37)? He would surely have lost time on the in-lap because of the VSC and wouldn't have been able to make places up.

He would still have been ahead of Max as they were both lapping at 100 seconds + per lap.
Then on Lap 38 Max did 86.3 and Lewis a 90.1.
Pit stops (pit lane time) were 21.1 up to 22.6 across all drivers.

 

[GeeJayW]

He would still have been ahead ox Max as they were both lapping at 100 seconds + per lap.
Then on Lap 38 Max did 86.3 and Lewis a 90.1.
Pit stops (pit lane time) were 21.1 up to 22.6 across all drivers.

Is starting to look like a missed opportunity by Mercedes. Though, it may not have made much difference in the end.

 

[Dryce]

Could well be a screw up from the team I guess.

The evidence of the race itself means it wasn't a screw up. LH was maintaining pace and distance to the end. Mercedes made the right decision.

I would say that looking at it the other way around was a calculated gamble by RBR - on the basis that it might give their driver an edge in the closing laps. It didn't. And I think while MV is very god at managing his tyres - so is LH - both are 'complete' drivers in terms of raw speed, race craft, and car management. Because it didn't work it left RBR in the position to play another logical no-lose gamble with the tyre change under the Safety Car.

 

[Dryce]

Todt's term as FIA President ends on 17th December. I wouldn’t be surprised if his successor decides he wants to appoint a new F1 Race Director, and also to undertake some “tidying up” of the F1 Sporting Regulations.

The sporting regulations regardinng the Safety Car don't need tidying up. They just need to be followed properly.

Where they might be challenged is if Mercedes take this further and the rules are defended along the lines that RBR was 'defending' them where RBR were tryig to twist their intended meaning (The stewards report didn't mention Mr Masi trying that line of defence at the time).

 

[Stratman]

This Twitter thread is well worth reading.

I get the impression that if it ever ends up in a court of law the FIA will be under a ton of bricks.

 

[GeeJayW]

This Twitter thread is well worth reading.

I get the impression that if it ever ends up in a court of law the FIA will be under a ton of bricks.

Hmm, interesting.

 

[Steveml63]

Hi,
If this is true then FIA are laughing all the way to whatever outcome they decide - rather than a proper court!
The FIA are a bit of a joke - in my opinion.

MARTIN SAMUEL: Mercedes CAN'T take their claim to highest court

MARTIN SAMUEL - CHIEF SPORTS WRITER: Mercedes will get one shot at overturning the race result from the season-ending Abu Dhabi Grand Prix and Max Verstappen's drivers' championship title.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Cheers
Steve

 

[Larkone]

Sign the petition to get Masi sacked

Sponsor Remove Michael Masi from his role as Race Director · Change.org

www.change.org

 

[Harrythedog]

Hmmm..... maybe, maybe not. I'm still (perhaps over generously) prepared to believe that Masi merely wanted last lap fireworks rather than to specifically hand the WDC to Verstappen. That he did that (in my scenario) was ill-considered and unbefitting of one with his responsibility.
No generosity whatsoever for Spa. None. And I still can't believe it went unchallenged - or know why it went unchallenged.

I agree.
I think Masi was acting more like a Stage Director as opposed to a Race Director

 

[st13phil]

The sporting regulations regardinng the Safety Car don't need tidying up.

I wasn’t specifically referencing regulations regarding the safety car - it was more of a general point.

There’s a view that MV's driving has tested the regulations in ways they have never been tested before, and that they need to at least be reviewed. The issue is that they were written when “gentlemen's agreement” held sway on many matters of driver etiquette, but that MV (and RBR) take the position that if the reg's don’t specifically outlaw a practice then it’s fair to engage in it.

It's worth remembering that the reg's that do exist regarding crowding other drivers basically had to be introduced in their current form due to the antics of Senna and Schumacher, who had a similar attitude to what was “reasonable” on-track behaviour.

Returning to the Abu Dhabi incident, the issue was not what the safety car regulations state, rather it was Masi's “on the fly”, inconsistent, interpretation of his personal authority to overrule them.

 

[st13phil]

The problem for the FIA, insiders say, is that the spotlight on Abu Dhabi was so bright, in the context of the gripping title fight between Hamilton and Verstappen, that F1's reputation as a responsibly and effectively governed sport is on the line.

Isn't that the truth (my bold)?

Full article here:

Formula 1: Where next for sport after Verstappen and Hamilton title drama?​

 

[Bellow]

On Lap 36 Max at around 8 seconds behind stops again then ends up around 20 seconds behind (less time lost with VSC).
This is the point where I think the Mercedes strategy lost the plot, leaving Lewis to do 44 Laps on these tyres when he simply did not have too!

MV's strategy was to do the opposite of what LH did. If LH had pitted then MV would have stayed out and gained track position leaving LH to play catch up and as was demonstrated, that wasn't a winning strategy without Masi's intervention - which Mercedes couldn't have predicted.
As the lead car LH was vulnerable to the 'opposite of what he did' strategy and any attempt to neutralise it sacrifices track position if the pit stop is less than perfect - a chance Mercedes are on the record as not being prepared to take. Mercedes had the perfect strategy for the event being run as it should have been - in accordance with the rule book.
The only justification for Mercedes to be less cautious than it was was if they had known that the restart would have been as it was. And as previously stated, its expectation was it would be as per the rules with either all or no backmarkers un-lapping themselves and the safety car being withdrawn appropriate to that.