Has UK enough generating power for electric cars , heat pumps and all other requirements

[st13phil]

An update as of today (2nd December):

Britain has 43.2 gigawatts of installed capacity in wind and solar. Currently they are generating 1.4 gigawatts. Gas (28.6 gigawatts) is making up the difference.

But our politicians are "committed" to ceasing the use of fossil fuels and we're all going to be driving EV's

 

[davymead]

Every week another dose of incompetence on a level I’ve never seen before.
As mentioned a time or two, we’re being led by people who have no clue whatsoever, and are constantly looking for the next brainless method of throwing away our hard earned by countless billions.
Tragic and almost unwatchable, Lee Anderson posing questions to the head of the Civil Service this week about immigration numbers. Record Taxation levels to cover hapless inability.

 

[ALFAitalia]

I've posted this before.....but I think that there is lot of BS talked about lack of power if we all drove EVs (not that this will happen for at least 30, possibly more, years). Id like to thing the National grid would know if there is enough electricity around and if they can get it where its needed. We use 16% less leccy than we did 20 years but have more generating capacity. The Grid say that if we all went EV tonight they could cope......and its going to be a slow change over the next 40 years or so.....so plenty of time to upgrade if required . Sure, if you rely just on renewables then its a no go at the moment......but that's decades if ever away...... in the real world. By the way modern solar panels do not need sunshine to work....just daylight....sure they wont make as much...but they will generate. I'm often amazed how much the panels on the caravans on my forecourt are kicking out on a dull overcast winter day like today. And wind turbines need wind at just 5m/s....so under 12 mph. Its not often below that in the UK!....especially out at sea where lots of the "farms" are. I can see a few offshore turbines from my balcony......they never seem to stop....even on days that seem pretty much still.

Busting the myths and misconceptions about electric vehicles | National Grid Group

Can the electricity grid cope with more EVs? And what really happens to old EV batteries? Find out the answer to these and many more questions about electric vehicles in our comprehensive EV myth-buster.

www.nationalgrid.com

 

[Jukie]

Short answer to the OP's question: No, not at times of peak demand when the wind doesn't blow and the sun isn't shining.

Average demand vs maximum generation capacity are the oft-quoted metrics, but life doesn't work like that. We can barely cover the current need for peak energy demands at the moment, with the CEO of National Gas, saying that demand from gas-fired power stations would be “maxed out” from yesterday (Thursday) through much of the weekend. And then there's the not insignificant matter of the inadequate distribution network...

But Beaker (Ed Milliband) and the rest of the eco-zealot politicians continue to tell us that it'll all be fine, so everything's rosy in the garden.

Beaker....

 

[ALFAitalia]

LOL....that what we used to call Prof Chris Whitty during lockdown .....due to his constantly confused and puzzled look when being questioned!!!!

Prof Chris Whitty


Beaker...





Although in reality he looks more like Beakers boss....Dr Bunsen Honeydew!!

 

[alabbasi]

It doesn't and unlikely that it will given the age of the infrastructure in old cities. But it won't matter because this is just a bait and switch tax move. like the diesel push from a couple of decades ago. When the balance tips, electric cars will be vilified and taxed to encourage owners to buy something else.

 

[st13phil]

For anyone interested in how the UK meets its demand for electricity, this site - which presents near real-time data from the National Grid - is illuminating (no pun intended):

G. B. National Grid status

www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk

It also provides historic data on a daily, weekly, monthly and yearly basis.

For reference, as of June 2023 the total installed wind generating capacity at 27.9GW exceeded the total installed gas generating capacity (27.7GW) for the first time. Yet a quick look at the historic graphs reveals that despite the larger installed capacity, actual wind generation rarely exceeds 15GW (and when it does, it only just exceeds it). By contrast, gas generation often exceeds 20GW, and is essential for meeting the UK total demand, delivering in excess of 25GW (more than 90% of its total capability) twice in the last week while wind failed to supply even 5GW for 5 out of the last seven days. For reference, the solar generation over the same period was utterly negligible.

So when our politicians and a host of eco-zealots tell us that wind and solar generation will be our saviour in the world of no fossil fuels, remember that they are lying.

 

[markjay]

For anyone interested in how the UK meets its demand for electricity, this site - which presents near real-time data from the National Grid - is illuminating (no pun intended):

G. B. National Grid status

www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk

....So when our politicians and a host of eco-zealots tell us that wind and solar generation will be our saviour in the world of no fossil fuels, remember that they are lying.

Our only saviour will be consuming less energy..... There are no miracle shortcuts to saving the planet.

 

[m80]

Our only saviour will be consuming less energy..... There are no miracle shortcuts to saving the planet.

Bit difficult with an ever increasing population.

 

[markjay]

Bit difficult with an ever increasing population.

Just look around you and see what a wasteful society we've become.

All the food that gets thrown away every day in restaurants, coffee shops, hospital kitchens, supermarkets, etc etc, required energy to grow, process, transport, and refrigerate, then to process as rubbish.

All those unnecessary car journeys that cause congestion, are wasteful.

Airplanes that fly half empty. Etc etc.

The list is long.

I remember visiting a jewellery factory once, they had a mesh floor at the exit with a vacuum hoover underneath to extract any traces of gold dust that may have clung to your shoe soles.

When a resource is precious, we treat it with respect. When it's cheap, we waste it. It's human nature.

 

[190]

Our only saviour will be consuming less energy..... There are no miracle shortcuts to saving the planet.

Agree if we are talking all forms of energy.

The issue is that this country is pretending that using vastly more of our energy in the form of electricity to power EV's and heat pumps will solve the problem when much of that energy is still being generated by fossil fuels, The politicians and eco nutters who live in fantasy land can't seem to grasp that we still need 60% of the peak electricity demand to be generated from fossil fuels. Building more wind and solar farms won't change that percentage during periods when the sun don't shine and the wind don't blow. Only nuclear can do that and we can forget any significant contribution from that much before 2050.

I'd have a lot more sympathy for net zero advocates if they would stop lying to the public, join the real world and tell the truth about the ongoing need for fossil fuels and the truth is we will still be burning fossil fuels in 2050. It could have been largely avoided if we had gone nuclear big time like France but that's history that will take at least a generation to correct.

When a resource is precious, we treat it with respect. When it's cheap, we waste it. It's human nature.

To a greater or lessor extent that's in our local culture but it's not inevitable. Go to Japan and they have different values that we would do well to copy. However I have no expectation that we will in my lifetime.

 

[del320]

For anyone interested in how the UK meets its demand for electricity, this site - which presents near real-time data from the National Grid - is illuminating (no pun intended):

G. B. National Grid status

www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk

Same info, but somewhat easier to understand.

National Grid: Live

What has been clear during this cold snap is UK's reliance on inward transfers.

 

[Dryce]

The issue is that this country is pretending that using vastly more of our energy in the form of electricity to power EV's and heat pumps will solve the problem when much of that energy is still being generated by fossil fuels,

Indeed.

Very poignant on the website they make a claim about 20GW+ of peak wind - but on the current status wind represents just over a quarter of that high value.

Nobody - including the National Grid is being properly honest or transparent on the real problems we are facing.

 

[Dryce]

What has been clear during this cold snap is UK's reliance on inward transfers.

Very little contingency if things don't line up properly at this time of year.

 

[markjay]

Very little contingency if things don't line up properly at this time of year.

Unlike the trains.... Or the roads.... Or the Royal Mail....

Sadly the list is long.

 

[rf065]

I've posted this before.....but I think that there is lot of BS talked about lack of power if we all drove EVs (not that this will happen for at least 30, possibly more, years). Id like to thing the National grid would know if there is enough electricity around and if they can get it where its needed. We use 16% less leccy than we did 20 years but have more generating capacity. The Grid say that if we all went EV tonight they could cope

The grid supplies electric from power stations, wind farms etc to the sub stations up and down the country. From the sub stations to your house, you are supplied by the various utility companies who use cables that are not owned by the grid. So when the grid say they can generate enough electricity, they are only talking about their own equipment up to the numerous sub stations, they have no idea what goes on beyond that.

 

[Dryce]

The grid supplies electric from power stations, wind farms etc to the sub stations up and down the country. From the sub stations to your house, you are supplied by the various utility companies who use cables that are not owned by the grid. So when the grid say they can generate enough electricity, they are only talking about their own equipment up to the numerous sub stations, they have no idea what goes on beyond that.

And ..... your point is ..... ?

Because if our local substation goes out so does pretty much everything for miles about?

 

[rf065]

And ..... your point is ..... ?

Because if our local substation goes out so does pretty much everything for miles about?

It's got nothing to do with that, doesn't matter how much capacity the grid say they have if your local infrastructure does not have the capacity to supply local demand.

 

[Fastcar155]

Hi , how long will it be before someone in government states we give up on electric cars.

United States has real issues with them , I understand that Hertz are not tokeen on them and Sixt won't buy them.

 

[ALFAitalia]

Not going to happen....we have come too far, spent too much money and the tree huggers and their supporters have too many votes to ignore. No going back now. Its different in the US.....the distances between major cities is often well outside the range or any EV often with desert or farm in between....I'm surprised they sell as many as they do. Rather different in a tiny country like ours where nothing is more than about 4 charges away....even if you do Lands End to John O Groats!! Even a devout petrolhead head like me sees EV's as the future....just not my future!!!