Look no taxes !! Will electric cars really be tax free?

[Darrell]

In France there are loads of the chargers. I think the guy here has his own villa.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Thank God some people have enough vision to see that there will be change and it can be brilliant.

There's some real dinosaur thinking going on in this thread and the others on the subject of car evolution.

 

[GeeJayW]

Thank God some people have enough vision to see that there will be change and it can be brilliant.

There's some real dinosaur thinking going on in this thread and the others on the subject of car evolution.

There are also a lot of people who are looking at EVs through rose coloured spectacles.

 

[tron]

Show me the battery and then the infrastructure to support it and I'll be with you Feelgood but until then, I won't hold my breath.

 

[Tim203]

Show me the battery and then the infrastructure to support it and I'll be with you Feelgood but until then, I won't hold my breath.

Like all these things, they need sales to support new development and product advancement . I cite mobile phones and computers as just a couple of examples. The pioneering customers are the ones that help this happen often knowing full well something better and cheaper will outdate their purchase very quickly. My own firm is going through this at the moment and I'm very grateful for people's foresight and faith in what we do.

 

[Deleted member 126969]

Looking at their website it's showing 3 in Greece and none of them here. Now I'm well confused.

You aren't limited to a 'Supercharger' with a Tesla, its just very much the the fastest way to charge one. Anything from a 13A socket upwards will do - plenty of EV chargers about, although by no means enough for if/when the uptake increases. Of course, the lower the charging power, the longer it takes. A full charge on a flat Tesla 100 S or X would take about 33 hours using a 13A UK socket. (assuming using 13A at 230 volts and a 100kWh battery pack from 0 to 100%). Or about 7 miles of range per hour of charging. Compared to apparently 300 miles per hour of charging on a Supercharger. But, it's not that simple either, rate of charge isn't constant or linear.

I'd say the fact you've seen a Tesla X in Greece, quite a distance from its home in Switzerland, and seen it driving about would tend to support the idea that it is at least possible.

My recent purchase of a C350e is starting to look a bit more prophetic than pathetic now

 

[gIzzE]

By 2040 charging on main roads will be contactless, Qualcomm are already testing it today, in 25 years it will be commonplace.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

OK, I've confused things: Superchargers are a special kind of charger

So I answered a question about Teslas, by giving details of their Superchargers...but they're "just" fast chargers for Teslas (and others). They're a better than normal chargers.

Drive into your local supermarket car park and you'll find an ordinary charger.

And any motorway service area. And most town centres etc etc. Anywhere you'll find people wanting to use an electric vehicles.

Electric vehicles aren't just for Morris and Joan wanting to charge it overnight in the driveway of their semi-detached.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

In 1994 no-one expected Diesels to be in ordinary cars

Thank God some people have enough vision to see that there will be change and it can be brilliant.

There's some real dinosaur thinking going on in this thread and the others on the subject of car evolution.

Twenty three years ago, no-one (well, apart from French farmers and Irish tax evaders) thought that diesel would ever fuel ordinary passenger cars.

It was Gordon's '99 budget that said "diesel is the future," gave a massive tax break, and introduced the central london pollutant that is prematurely killing tens of thousands (according to EU figures).

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

But obviously it's all over-kill

If diesel pollution in city centres is the issue ( Marylebone Road, Putney High Street, Paris city centre on windless days), anyone with half a brain would just stop diesels from entering high pollution areas, or would put restrictions on the amount of traffic, re-route traffic, or decentralise countries.

But politicians don't have half a brain, so we end up wth these regulations to support the hundreds of billions (sic) already being invested by car countries.

"What's the solution to black lung disease for miners and pollution from coal-fired power stations? Nuclear power !!" Hold on a minute - some people disagree.... The Miners want to hold onto their right to send half a million men underground every day, and "some say" Nuclear power has some costs and risks attached to it.

 

[flat6buster]

Am I allowed to ask about trucks, buses and shipping?

In Shanghai most buses are electric. Most mopeds are electric.

In london?

 

[Stratman]

Electric cars, with their regenerative braking, should also considerably reduce the amount of brake dust particles in the air and hence in our lungs.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

There are also a lot of people who are looking at EVs through rose coloured spectacles.

Show me the battery and then the infrastructure to support it and I'll be with you Feelgood but until then, I won't hold my breath.

I'm not particularly keen on all electric cars but I'm open to the possibility of moving in that direction over the next 20-odd years it's simple evolution.

Would you prefer everything to just stay the same for ever or are you prepared to open your minds to something new?

 

[Benzowner]

Interesting read Factcheck: Are there really 40,000 air pollution deaths a year? - Energydesk

 

[GeeJayW]

I'm not particularly keen on all electric cars but I'm open to the possibility of moving in that direction over the next 20-odd years it's simple evolution.

Would you prefer everything to just stay the same for ever or are you prepared to open your minds to something new?

Face to face, I think we could have a good discussion about this.

In this virtual format, it's very difficult to adequately cover the implications of EVs without writing an essay, that frankly nobody would read.

I'm not opposed to new ideas, concepts etc. and have in the past been closely involved in EV, HEV, PHEV technologies from a fuels and emissions viewpoint. That included some study of available battery and motor technologies, testing protocols and methods. Part of the programmes included discussion with TfL, TRL and industry engineers. I've also unsurprisingly driven a number of EVs, though not for a while (been retired for three years). So, while I do not consider myself an expert, I think I'm probably better informed than most.

FWIW, my take on future transport energy is that there will need to be a more diverse portfolio of energy sources and technologies used. This extends beyond road transport into to other areas of energy use in my view. There is no one-size fits all when it comes to energy supply and use. The use of fossil fuels will continue for quite some time to come.

 

[Stratman]

Future battery technologies

While most of these will never see the light of day in any meaningful way, it just takes one to make the breakthrough in what I consider the most important factor, namely range/recharge time.

 

[GeeJayW]

Future battery technologies

While most of these will never see the light of day in any meaningful way, it just takes one to make the breakthrough in what I consider the most important factor, namely range/recharge time.

Range/recharge time is certainly one of issues around the acceptance of EVs. Drivers are very sensitive about this even when they don't really need to be. Many motorists do short journeys, which could easily be met by EVs. However the concern about running out of 'juice' and not being able to quickly and conveniently 'top-up' is a worry for most.

This same concern kicks in whenever there is a petrol/diesel shortage. Drivers that are normally happy to drive around with less than half a tank of fuel, suddenly feel the need to keep their tank full just in case.

 

[Stratman]

Range can be very important to those who live in tower blocks, or even two or three storey blocks. They can't do a nightly top up as many others can.

I can put over 500 miles of range in my diseasel in around ten minutes, maybe 400 when it's mostly short journeys. Mrs. Stratman's i10 has a realistic range of around 300 miles. If EVs can come close to matching those figures they'll be accepted by all except the Clarksons of this world.

Adding 250 miles in 10 minutes has to be the target, does it not?

 

[GeeJayW]

Range can be very important to those who live in tower blocks, or even two or three storey blocks. They can't do a nightly top up as many others can.

I can put over 500 miles of range in my diseasel in around ten minutes, maybe 400 when it's mostly short journeys. Mrs. Stratman's i10 has a realistic range of around 300 miles. If EVs can come close to matching those figures they'll be accepted by all except the Clarksons of this world.

Adding 250 miles in 10 minutes has to be the target, does it not?

I'm not disagreeing with you at all, it is an important issue.

However for many, being able to drive 10-20 miles is all they actually need most of the time. So convenient, short, top-ups will probably meet most users needs. Achieving this without the hassle of having to plug a cable into some sort of box is a must. The charging systems need to be where the cars are parked and cannot (in my view and FWIW) in the long term rely on a cable connection. As you say for a lot of people hooking up a cable is impractical. Need to move on from 'golf cart' thinking and quickly.

As a sidebar, most people have no idea how much energy there is in a tankful of petrol or diesel. Providing similar amounts of energy using electricity and then storing it in a conveniently small space is very tricky stuff.

 

[tron]

Having spent much of my working life in r and d, those who insist upon change for it's own sake generally have only tenuous contact with reality. The losses involved in inductive charging? If they were trivial, we would already have abandoned plugs and sockets