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Mercedes W114 250 Coupe - help!

I believe the only new threads allowed in the Projects forum are those the mods approve - whereas posts in existing threads are not an issue. Ignore me if I have the wrong end of the stick.

Strangely, my access to a Thanks button for your post also denied.
 
That sometimes disappears for me too - momentarily normally. A little quirk!
 
Not yet pronounced upon but there is evidence of different greases and I want to get the necessary stuff in so that when we do have a look we can clean it all up and repack.
 
I've just checked out MB265.1 and Comma multipurpose grease II and unless you intend haring down Alpine passes deploying all the V8's power (then immediately parking), track days, traversing rough tracks or fording - the Comma should be fine.

The lithium complex greases offer a slightly higher drop point which is only of significance if brake heat soaks through to the bearing, though it is a useful insurance on a car that could suffer a binding brake - not yours.
They also come with a slightly higher load bearing capacity but I doubt that you intend bouncing the car over kerbs or entering the Safari Rally.

When it comes to checking the bearings for fitness to reuse - don't put much emphasis on KB's 'by feel' method. Visual is everything. I don't recall having to change the beraings on my 230,000 mile W123 though I suppose they could have been changed at some point prior. Or MB really did over-engineer their cars back then. Tony will guide you re the bearings.
 
I think when KB rowed back after the visual examination I took that as a sign.

I've ordered the Febi MB spec (if not approved) grease as I don't have much of the comma left and I want something bright green. I couldn't find any of the approved list easily available and both local MB parts departments are hopeless.

I also found a new front brake hose in the parts bin today so that can replace the one at the front I butchered.

Would people forgive me if I had seats with headrests fitted? (the current seats lack that). I have always loved those 70s headrests with the prominent ears and they would be original, if not to this car.
 
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I would put money on MB A0029890051 and probably the FEBI bearing grease being
FUCHS Renolit LX-PEP2----- the manufacturer grease of choice for the G WAGEN front bearings/axle assembly - oh and its green . ;)
 
I could find Fuchs Renolit LX EP 2 but not PEP2.

Tony has had a good look at the bearings and the rubber seal - frankly they could have been made yesterday. Absolutely untouched, no scoring, no blue marks, nothing. Rubber seal is as flexible as anything when he pointed it out. Now just a matter of removing all the old grease and re-packing with new when it arrives.

He also confirmed he'd completely re-done all the brake pipes in copper, which is good news. Front fuel pipes had been done but not the rear ones.

w114frontbearing_zpsrplcagrb.jpg
 
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Timken seem to be the name most associated with taper roller bearings- possibly because an American Henry Timken took out the first patent in 1898. Other names that come to mind are SKF and FAG. With so much outsourcing to foreign manufacturing in India and China however its difficult to know whether any brand name continues to reflect its quality origins. Any identifiers on your roller bearings Charles?
 
I've ordered the Febi MB spec (if not approved) grease as I don't have much of the comma left and I want something bright green. .

If you haven't absolutely committed to the above....I have found grease I'd forgotten I had that you can have. Both are Total products, one a lithium complex the other an aluminium complex based one. For this, with the proviso that no intermixing is possible or permitted I'd give the Copal MS2 the nod as aluminium complex greases do work particularly well in bearing applications where heat can be present. They tend to be more fluid (less drag and better lubricant delivery), have a wider temp range, withstand bleeding better (reversibility) and have better water wash out resistance. This particular product also has nearly 30% greater load bearing capacity than the Fuchs
http://www4.total.fr/AMO/Liban/PDF/COPAL MS 2 FR.pdf
Let me know if you want some and if so, ask Tony if a couple of (400g) cartridges will pack all bearings - are the rears to be done also?

Tony has had a good look at the bearings and the rubber seal - frankly they could have been made yesterday.

How are the races? They are the crucial elements.

I want something bright green. .

Gentlemen, green is but a dye. That won't be seen and if it is will clash with the interior! I suspect what you viewed yesterday has burned an imprint on your retinas. It will pass. My eyes have just about stopped bleeding...
 
But red and green go so well together!

Getting the seal off was a bit of a task, but we checked all the bearings and races. They are not perfectly clean yet (any recommendations - I'll re-grease them now with a light coat until the Febi (ordered and paid for) grease arrives, which will prompt me to clean them then)

w114frontbearing6_zpswxnzva7h.jpg


w114frontbearing5_zpseb65ryr2.jpg


w114frontbearing3_zpsoualpntx.jpg
 
Timken seem to be the name most associated with taper roller bearings- possibly because an American Henry Timken took out the first patent in 1898. Other names that come to mind are SKF and FAG. With so much outsourcing to foreign manufacturing in India and China however its difficult to know whether any brand name continues to reflect its quality origins. Any identifiers on your roller bearings Charles?

I recall having a long conversation, or in fact being on the receiving end of a long monologue, with Alan Brock who restores three speed Ford boxes from the 30s to the 50s. His contention is that the original Ford bearings (and gears) are of an incredible quality and he showed me stock from the 40s with no play at all in the bearings. The only contemporary bearing we put into the box was one with an end oil seal as Ford didn't do those at the time - this was an SKF bearing but made in Malaysia. There was a tiny, but noticeable, play in the bearing which he said was a clear step down in quality from earlier SKF bearings - but price is as much a factor as location.
 
To clean bearing I invariably use petrol as I usually have some to hand. Any solvent that dissolves grease will do.
If in doubt as to the condition of the races have a look on the 'net for 'bearing failure modes'. There is plenty info from the likes of SKF including photos. Something to consider when viewing taper rollers is that they can have wear adjusted out - to a point.
With a typical bearing when play is detected it is binned. With a taper roller it is adjusted. Thus, it is possible to subject the bearing to wear that reduces the dimensions but without showing visible wear. The biggest danger is that a race wears so thin that the hard surface (of finite initial thickness induced through case or induction hardening) wears thin enough as to be unable to support the load place on it. What then happens is that it elastically deforms (returnable to original form) but the softer underlying metal deforms permanently and bit by bit the ability of the race to withstand load is reduced until it fails - catastrophically.
So, apart from the obvious scoring look for signs of this (any unevenness of the surface (IIRC it's termed false Brinnelling), anything other than smooth and shiny) and any sign of corrosion (pitting) also banishes the bearing to the bin. In the absence of any of that - reuse. (You are correct in preventing interim corrosion).
Looking at the two (race) photographs. In the first, presumably that is just dirt - not surface marking? In both, at the narrower diameter (of each) - a wear groove/ridges?

So far on this thread, two Scots, a man with Welsh roots, a smattering of English - when does the Irish Queen introduce herself?
 
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Photos of the races taken with much better light after a good clean of the race surface with petrol (plenty of that) with a full frame sensor Nikon through a Macro telephoto lens. Anything visible now is pure surface not inadequate cleaning.

w114frontbearing11_zpsmvih7wvf.jpg


w114frontbearing10_zps691fl4ir.jpg
 
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Thumbnail at the ready. Are there discernible ridges as previously mentioned?
When you drag a thumbnail across the race surfaces - can any roughness be detected?
 
No roughness, ridges or pitting at all - it feels totally smooth. Even where you see those marks at the bottom there is nothing felt using a nail or finger.
 
Regrease and slap it back together. With tapers you can expect to come back and readjust after a few hundred miles as they tend to settle after rebuilding - as much the grease moving as anything I suspect. Simple operation requiring tightening slightly the clamping nut until any play is eliminated. At that they should be good for thousands of miles. Any detectable play with wheel jacked clear of the ground implies bearing is wearing. Keep an eye out for that and you can reuse what you have without concern.

How is the other side? Are the rear bearings also tapers or more conventional ball race type?
 
Other side is inaccessible at present. I haven't done the rear ones yet either as the mystery of getting the hub off is total!
 

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