The EV fact thread

[markjay]

Chinese cars remind me of cheap market toys we used to buy as kids. They looked OK but broke after a few minutes of play,
Chinese cars look OK - but who knows how they really perform in a serious accident?
I always suspect that they are not made of the same strength and standard of materials as well engineered vehicles from long established legacy manufacturers.
I always suspect they are cheap for a reason!

True, though we should make a distinction between Chinese-made products, and Chinese brands.

Apple make their products in China and and they are all of the highest quality (as far as manufacturing goes). And there's no reason to assume that the Tesla cars made in China will be any different to those made in the States.

The potential problem is with Chinese brands. Time will tel if Chinese marques will go the way of Honda/Toyota/Nissan/Suzuki/Subaro and Kia/Hyundai, or will continue to make products that just-about meet the required Western legal standards.

 

[190]

True, though we should make a distinction between Chinese-made products, and Chinese brands.

Apple make their products in China and and they are all of the highest quality (as far as manufacturing goes). And there's no reason to assume that the Tesla cars made in China will be any different to those made in the States.

The potential problem is with Chinese brands. Time will tel if Chinese marques will go the way of Honda/Toyota/Nissan/Suzuki/Subaro and Kia/Hyundai, or will continue to make products that just-about meet the required Western legal standards.

I think you hit the nail on head in terms of China manufactured quality vs China Brand quality. I recently bought a portable dehumidifier and after the usual research chose a very well respected British brand with manufacturing facilities in the UK and a 3 year warranty. The model I chose usually came out top or near top in all reviews. When it arrived it was labelled made in China which was a slight surprise but it will have been designed and specified in the UK so there is no reason to believe it's inferior to the British made items.

China can manufacture to the highest quality standards in the world when they want to or are told to. Do the research on Chinese brand cars though and while they have inevitably improved they are some way off a match for a European brand. They are more "white goods" quality than say German quality and spares back up along with used values are still inferior. They will probably get there in time but I wouldn't buy one yet.

 

[SmartAmg]

China can manufacture to the highest quality standards in the world when they want to or are told to. Do the research on Chinese brand cars though and while they have inevitably improved they are some way off a match for a European brand. They are more "white goods" quality than say German quality and spares back up along with used values are still inferior. They will probably get there in time but I wouldn't buy one yet.

I Would/Did. Great so far. Lovely motor.

 

[Pontoneer]

I think you hit the nail on head in terms of China manufactured quality vs China Brand quality. I recently bought a portable dehumidifier and after the usual research chose a very well respected British brand with manufacturing facilities in the UK and a 3 year warranty. The model I chose usually came out top or near top in all reviews. When it arrived it was labelled made in China which was a slight surprise but it will have been designed and specified in the UK so there is no reason to believe it's inferior to the British made items.

China can manufacture to the highest quality standards in the world when they want to or are told to. Do the research on Chinese brand cars though and while they have inevitably improved they are some way off a match for a European brand. They are more "white goods" quality than say German quality and spares back up along with used values are still inferior. They will probably get there in time but I wouldn't buy one yet.

Indeed .

Quad , one of the best known brands of British high fidelity , now manufacture their products in China , although my electronics and my electrostatic loudspeakers were made in Huntingdon.

 

[markjay]

I would put it this way:

In China, you can find manufacturers who will make your product to the highest quality that matches the best of British, and, equally, you can find manufacturers who will produce for you substandard rubbish-quality products that won't last very long and are unsafe to use.

In Britain, you'll struggle to find a manufacturer who will be willing to make the latter for you.

The implications are that 'Made in China' could mean anything, while 'Made in Britain' means that the product is very likely to be of decent quality.

 

[Steveml63]

True, though we should make a distinction between Chinese-made products, and Chinese brands.

Apple make their products in China and and they are all of the highest quality (as far as manufacturing goes). And there's no reason to assume that the Tesla cars made in China will be any different to those made in the States.

The potential problem is with Chinese brands. Time will tel if Chinese marques will go the way of Honda/Toyota/Nissan/Suzuki/Subaro and Kia/Hyundai, or will continue to make products that just-about meet the required Western legal standards.

Fair point - I have a Chinese built Model 3 Performance and I have no reservations about this car in a heavy crash.
In the UAE, there are so many new Chinese cars on sale here now.
Many brands are totally unheard of (and I worked in automotive technology for 20 years!)
Whenever I see a new model of Chinese car in a parking space at a mall - I take a look around it and notice that some of them look less than substantial!
Their prices are so low compared with European, Korean, US or Japanese brands - you can see why people who are not car experts are buying them.
They generally have longer warranties & service packages than traditional brands - to attract new buyers and give them confidence,
If these brands get a foothold in Europe or USA - it will game over for many of the legacy brands

 

[ALFAitalia]

Hmm.... what about all the British made crap?.... and there is lots of it... which is why I'm forced to buy foreign even when it's rather not. JLR group products for example.....British made radiators are another...all crap. And of course most foreign electronics are far better.

 

[Will]

Hmm.... what about all the British made crap?.... and there is lots of it... which is why I'm forced to buy foreign even when it's rather not. JLR group products for example.....British made radiators are another...all crap. And of course most foreign electronics are far better.

Agreed - ironically some of the British car brands have improved or only been viable since they were sold off to foreign investors.

Does anyone honestly think a new Chinese made MG is less reliable or a lower quality product than a British one was in the past?

And quite a few of the posters on this forum will happily fit cheap Chinese tyres and/or pattern parts to their Mercedes-Benz - ordered from their Chinese manufactured iPhone/laptop etc

Whilst sitting at home drinking imported tea next to their Christmas tree with Chinese lights and tinsel on it

 

[ALFAitalia]

Lots of Genuine main dealer sourced Mercedes parts are made in China.

 

[pioneercollector]

Mrs PC decided that she would like some light blue SMEG things for the kitchen ( Don't ask ) anyway these things are what i would call outrageously priced for what is in essence a Kettle / coffee percolator and toaster, anyway they arrived and i did spot that the bottom of the box was written ' Made in the PRC' ...... Hmmmm SMEG are Italian, says on the top of the box !
Took me a second or two to realise that PRC is the 'Peoples Republic of China' .....
To add another layer of intrigue when i registered the products for the guarantee the holding company is BEKO - So SMEG items are actually BEKO but made in China with an Italian look !!! Sigh...

In fairness the toaster and the coffee machine get a good hammering from me on a daily basis , and have done for over three years....

 

[Mactech]

Has nobody actually spotted we've been living in and international economy and market place for a while now...
Some people actually buy German cars.....made perhaps, in the USA or South Africa?

 

[poormansporsche]

Random question of the week..... Not EV bashing just seeing what everyone thinks

In the space of the last 2 weeks I have seen 3 VW "I Ds" (don't know which models as they all look the same to me, although one was a buzz and the other 2 were hatchbacks) with tyres that have fallen of the steel wheels and all 3 owners were standing around scratching their heads. I've seen plenty of cars with flats or shredded low profiles but can't remember seeing a tyre fallen of a rim for donkeys years ????

Coincidence ?????

Or do EV tyres not work with steelies, or is there some issue when EV specific tyres go flat.

Or have VW forgotten how to mount tyres on steelies ????

Or are VW just £hite ?????

Thoughts ???!

 

[BTB 500]

Could it be that the driver accidentally unleashed such monumental power and torque that it overwhelmed the friction between the rim and the tyre, spinning it off?

 

[ChipChop]

Random question of the week..... Not EV bashing just seeing what everyone thinks

In the space of the last 2 weeks I have seen 3 VW "I Ds" (don't know which models as they all look the same to me, although one was a buzz and the other 2 were hatchbacks) with tyres that have fallen of the steel wheels and all 3 owners were standing around scratching their heads. I've seen plenty of cars with flats or shredded low profiles but can't remember seeing a tyre fallen of a rim for donkeys years ????

Coincidence ?????

Or do EV tyres not work with steelies, or is there some issue when EV specific tyres go flat.

Or have VW forgotten how to mount tyres on steelies ????

Or are VW just £hite ?????

Thoughts ???!

Could be someone at your local VW dealership/ Kwikfit is just not very proficient at mounting tyres.

 

[ChipChop]

Has nobody actually spotted we've been living in and international economy and market place for a while now...
Some people actually buy German cars.....made perhaps, in the USA or South Africa?

Battery packs for EV's are made almost exclusively in the PRC. They are also by far the most expensive component in an EV. The PRC stands to gain a lot all thanks to the ill thought out energy transition currently being forced through in Western economies.

 

[markjay]

Mrs PC decided that she would like some light blue SMEG things for the kitchen ( Don't ask ) anyway these things are what i would call outrageously priced for what is in essence a Kettle / coffee percolator and toaster, anyway they arrived and i did spot that the bottom of the box was written ' Made in the PRC' ...... Hmmmm SMEG are Italian, says on the top of the box !
Took me a second or two to realise that PRC is the 'Peoples Republic of China' .....
To add another layer of intrigue when i registered the products for the guarantee the holding company is BEKO - So SMEG items are actually BEKO but made in China with an Italian look !!! Sigh...

In fairness the toaster and the coffee machine get a good hammering from me on a daily basis , and have done for over three years....

BEKO is Turkish brand. We bought some of their appliances (via John Lewis). Seems OK.

 

[markjay]

Battery packs for EV's are made almost exclusively in the PRC. They are also by far the most expensive component in an EV. The PRC stands to gain a lot all thanks to the ill thought out energy transition currently being forced through in Western economies.

China has already benefitted immensely from making... just about anything that we in the West used to make in the olden days. I am not sure that the EVs batteries are a game changer here.

 

[Mactech]

Could it be that the driver accidentally unleashed such monumental power and torque that it overwhelmed the friction between the rim and the tyre, spinning it off?

Given the monstrous grip offered by cold, damp December roads...all sounds entirely plausible......NOT...
...But I can't offer a more likely cause!

 

[ChipChop]

China has already benefitted immensely from making... just about anything that we in the West used to make in the olden days. I am not sure that the EVs batteries are a game changer here.

No money in cornering the global EV battery market? 30+ million cars currently on the road in the UK and we are repeatedly told by futurologists that at some indeterminate point in the (near) future the majority will be 'fuelled' by a PRC made battery pack.

 

[poormansporsche]

Could it be that the driver accidentally unleashed such monumental power and torque that it overwhelmed the friction between the rim and the tyre, spinning it off?

Dunno, but it was certainly strange that all 3 had steelies and never seen a EV with blinging alloys with the tyre hanging off ?????