Formula One 2018 - General Thread

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Switchable aero....?
The DRS is just that (and I don't like that system or what it does to the speed balance of cars - its akin to a remap / nitrous boost) but....

Its not beyond the wit of man (all 800 of them), time in the tunnel and some basic electronics to allow the driver to modify the aero of the car (front wing, side wings etc.) when closing in on a car.
It may mean that the lead car in open air would be still trickier to pass as they have a slight speed advantage, but its an option?

Or strip back aero and introduce other variables as stated above (fuel, tyres, weight)
 
The problem is not a technical one, most things can be engineered!
It is a political one. Teams want to win. The organisers want to put on a great show.

''Excuse me Mr Bolt, would you mind running a little slower...or retiring so we can have closer races?"

Compromises will have to be made!
 
Dryce said:
My observation is that when cars sustain minor damage or lose bits of the front wing it often doesn't always seem to affect their race performance that much. Your comment would suggest a reason for this - in that what is happening in these situations is that losing some small bits or getting some bits a bit out of shape is likely to have a lower impact on a cars ability to follow the car in front.

Then why on earth can the rules not be hardened in some way to stop this - eg. stating that each wing can consts of only so many separate surfaces (eg. 2 or three) with a limit on protrusions and the and angular change in the surface plane.
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One thing to remember (and this is true) When the car suffers bodywork/aero damage that is not sufficient to 'black flag it' it is an established principle that the drivers seem to use that damage to take the cork out the bottle. On an almost 'devil may care' charge they find lap times that were not there moments before the damage. Martin Brundle regularly comments on this "some questions for the team here". The reality is that as they shed some of these bits, the cars probably react better to dirty air. They are set up for "optimum performance" on that circuit with some possibility of computer modeling based on what traffic they think they think they may run in. It all goes out the window if car 'a' starts to run out of position and gets ahead of car 'x' who was not set up to run behind car 'a' who now finds his car has zero downforce on most corners, so scrubbing his tyres heavily. He then has to drop back or attempt a banzai overtake to clear the dirty air. Sometimes, the missing bits just help that process along a bit. Strange but true.
 
fabes said:
Switchable aero....?
The DRS is just that (and I don't like that system or what it does to the speed balance of cars - its akin to a remap / nitrous boost) but....

Its not beyond the wit of man (all 800 of them), time in the tunnel and some basic electronics to allow the driver to modify the aero of the car (front wing, side wings etc.) when closing in on a car.
It may mean that the lead car in open air would be still trickier to pass as they have a slight speed advantage, but its an option?

Or strip back aero and introduce other variables as stated above (fuel, tyres, weight)
Click to expand...


The issue with that is that thr driver will immediately use everything he has to get to the front before running out of fuel or tyres :^) Drivers want to race, teams want to win. Sponsors want the very best air/TV time.

When I worked at Sun Microsystems they very deliberately asked to sponsor the wing mirrors with their brand. Why? They realised that nearly all the still and slow motion shots would feature wing mirrors either side of the drivers head = massive TV coverage for the Sun Brand.
 
Amongst all this technology, it is sometimes overlooked that there is a soft, squidgy and extremely talented bit in the centre of the car.
Whilst nobody is going to pretend that they can make up for a poor car all on their own, they can still have a huge input into how much performance can be extracted from the vehicle at any given time.
The best are those who can adapt quickest to changing car and circuit conditions and find grip where others maybe wouldn't look.
The ones with lots of pole positions spring to mind.
 
@Happytalk73 - the car you have been waiting for!

MCL33

skysports-f1-mclaren-mcl33_4238482.jpg

skysports-f1-mcl33-mclaren_4238483.jpg

skysports-f1-mclaren-mcl33-f1-2018_4238489.jpg
 
Mactech said:
The problem is not a technical one, most things can be engineered!
It is a political one. Teams want to win. The organisers want to put on a great show.

''Excuse me Mr Bolt, would you mind running a little slower...or retiring so we can have closer races?"

Compromises will have to be made!
Click to expand...

I think there is an ecosystem with a lot of self interest at heart.

We've had massive failure to reduce costs and the big teams are *huge*. Big payrolls and big ecosystem.

If it costs several thousand ££ for a relatively insignificant part or material then people and suppliers get that ££. So that super expensive specialised resin or that super expensive heat insulation or that extra person to tune race strategy all adds up. Silly money for a fraction of a fraction of a second.

And it's terribly convenient to the top teams when cost becomes a barrier to competition.

My feeling says that they should simplify the aero. Dump KERS. Dump semi-auto gearboxes. And increase the car weight if that will reduce cost. Go back to allowing a more varied engine formula. Reduce the number of people allowed in the pit (modern tyres changes are so fast that you can hardly see them .... slowing them down by halving the crew might actually offer a better spectacle).

I'd like to see more engine variation and independent suppliers compete with works teams like Cosworth used to.
 
Dryce said:
I think there is an ecosystem with a lot of self interest at heart.

We've had massive failure to reduce costs and the big teams are *huge*. Big payrolls and big ecosystem.

If it costs several thousand ££ for a relatively insignificant part or material then people and suppliers get that ££. So that super expensive specialised resin or that super expensive heat insulation or that extra person to tune race strategy all adds up. Silly money for a fraction of a fraction of a second.

And it's terribly convenient to the top teams when cost becomes a barrier to competition.

My feeling says that they should simplify the aero. Dump KERS. Dump semi-auto gearboxes. And increase the car weight if that will reduce cost. Go back to allowing a more varied engine formula. Reduce the number of people allowed in the pit (modern tyres changes are so fast that you can hardly see them .... slowing them down by halving the crew might actually offer a better spectacle).

I'd like to see more engine variation and independent suppliers compete with works teams like Cosworth used to.
Click to expand...

There are engineering solutions to cure all of what we see as 'woes' in F1
I'm not going to suggest the answers as the manufacturers and teams are under great pressure to win.
They are hard wired to find ways around technical regulations and cost constraints to win.
It is only going to be the political deftness of F1's new owners and strong regulation from the FIA that will bring about more competitive racing.
Why else would any of the manufactures and teams want to give up on any chance of what they are paid to do?
Manufacturers will spit dummies out, and some will leave, but F1 will survive even at a lower funded level.....if the racing is a spectacle.
 
First test started today, some timesheets so far

Timesheet 3 pm:
1) Ricciardo, Red Bull, 84 laps, Medium tyres - 1:20.179;
2) Bottas, Mercedes, 58 laps, Medium tyres - 1:20.349;
3) Raikkonen, Ferrari, 77 laps, Soft tyres - 1:20.506;
4) Hulkenberg, Renault, Medium tyres - 73 laps, 1:20.547;
5) Alonso, McLaren, 31 laps, Supersoft tyres - 1.21.339;
6) Hamilton, Mercedes, 25 laps, Medium tyres - 1:22.327;
7) Hartley, Toro Rosso, 90 laps, Soft tyres - 1:22.371;
8) Stroll, Williams, 46 laps, Soft tyres 1:22.452;
9) Grosjean, Haas, 52 laps, Soft tyres - 1:22.578;
10) Sainz, Renault, 19 laps, 1:22.621;
11) Ericsson, Sauber, 60 laps, 1.23.408;
12) Mazepin, Force India, 22 laps, 1:25.628;
13) Sirotkin, Williams, No time set
 
I'm just wondering how they'll blame the 'Wheel nut issue' on Honda? :dk:



:D
 
Mactech said:
As a rule of thumb, the more intricate the topside aero devices are (and the new cars look pretty fussy to me!) then the better they will work in clean free stream air......which means the grip is more likely to be degraded by the 'dirty' air following another car:(
Great for a lap time, not so clever for wheel to wheel combat.

I'm counting 28 elephants ( sorry! elements) on the front wings.....
Click to expand...

skysports-f1-new-mercedes-w09_4237589.jpg


Sorry late on this thread The amount of bodywork between the front wheels and sidepods on the Merc looks plain mad - no doubt effective but ugly and expensive. Bring back single element front wings and overtaking
 
McLaren looking good in 12th with supersoft tyres & just 38 laps,,,,,,,,,NOT! :(
 
Happytalk73 said:
McLaren looking good in 12th with supersoft tyres & just 38 laps,,,,,,,,,NOT! :(
Click to expand...

Car broke down 3 times today, hopefully they will have a better day tomorrow, especially when Torro Rosso had a decent day
 
Just to cheer Ant up.....

McLaren's troubles have been put in stark relief by Honda's generally reliable running with new partners Toro Rosso, the Red Bull junior team.

upload_2018-3-7_7-14-40.gif
Toro Rosso driver Pierre Gasly ended the day fifth fastest, behind Sebastian Vettel's Ferrari, Mercedes' Valtteri Bottas, Red Bull's Max Verstappen and world champion Lewis Hamilton, who took over the Mercedes from Bottas at lunch time.
 
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