Formula One 2018 - General Thread

[Dryce]

My experience is that Christian Horner tends to be less vocal about disparity between teams when his is the one at the front of the pack. Sometimes what he says makes sense, other times it sounds more like sour grapes.

Natural effect of vested interests of those running these mighty front running teams. The teams are too big.

There is probably a threshold of team size and funding beyond which the sport becomes unhealthy. F1 breached this a long time ago.

I don't think the racing of yesteryear was so much better - was the effect of engine reliability any fairer than SV's jump on LH due to the VSC?

However I do think that we see less return for the money - and higher barriers to entry to participate and compete. The sport may pride itself in spending huge amount of money on tiny details for tiny effects. The money that pays for the excess effectively comes from the fans and sponsors. I don't think we actually get enough value back.

I'm maybe a luddite. I'd like to see F1 go back to fundamentals. And I like to see scope for innovation within the formula. Simple to say. less easy to actuall specify and implement - and in my world it would also mean less money so less people - ie. jobs.

 

[artyman]

Well when the coverage comes off terrestrial TV I shan't be watching any longer in an case, my son who has SKY says he's going to give it two more races then if processional he's out. Not good for Liberty

 

[Mactech]

I understand the algorithm not working correctly, but did not understand why the team elected to not tell Lewis that Seb had pitted. The team will have known that the second Seb etered the pit lane they were going to struggle unless Lewis could pull a rabbit out the hat. They never passed him the hat? We then heard Lewis ask? "why did you not tell me"

It may well have made no difference, but he had no chance to even try.

Ferrari looked confident in race trim and they now know that Mercedes have a significant disadvantage when in dirty air.

As for the Halo? It looks awful and to me breaks the spirit of 'open top racing'. The Renault paint job masks it well but I don't like it. I also agree with SV that it would have made no difference to Massa (hit at or level by a spring) or Bianchi? (Car v JCB Digger)

I beg to differ on the Halo safety.
Massa was hit on the helmet just above the eye by a 8" long heave spring. The trajectory of that would have been caught or altered by the leading vertical stay of the Halo.
In the Bianchi incident the head g forces would have been considerably reduced by not having the helmet make direct contact with the JCB. Given the forces involved, that may well have tipped the scales in favour of life for Bianchi.

I have been through the same arguments inside the FIA when the 2004 sports car regulations were being compiled and we were looking at the survival rate of drivers in "blow over" incidents. 4 nil in favour of closed cars.
I was at Paul Ricard in the middle of the night when one of our Bentley drivers survived unscathed after landing his closed car upside down on a low concrete retaining wall outside the confines of the circuit.
I was also at Laustizring in Germany on the day Alboreto was not so lucky landing an open top Audi Le Mans car.
Justin Wilson, a driver I have run would, I believe, be still racing Indy cars today if his car had a Halo.
I really do prefer live drivers whatever the cars look like.

 

[GeeJayW]

From the commentary over the weekend, apparently the FIA considered the Bianchi incident with respect to halo and concluded that it would probably not have helped, but would not have made things worse...

The WEC/leMans formula specifies closed cockpit, maybe in response to Albereto's crash in the Audi.

F1 is nominally an open cockpit formula along with F2 etc. (which are also getting halo). So it looks as if halo is here to stay. I do think that the outer carbon fibre jacket should not be allowed to have additional slats and flaps on it as the drivers basically have the use it to get out of the cockpit.

 

[Mactech]

From the commentary over the weekend, apparently the FIA considered the Bianchi incident with respect to halo and concluded that it would probably not have helped, but would not have made things worse.

The FIA would have access to much more data than I have, but from personal experience, head butting any part of the scenery or other vehicles is certainly not to be recommended.

The Sportscar regs were specifically written around open cars when we were developing the Bentley Le Man cars of early this century. So the load test for the front dashboard safety hoop was transferred to be applicable to the top of the screen rail which much more of a technical challenge. We were the first to support the 'London bus' on the top of the 'A' pillars.
This forms a very secure survival cell for the driver.
Mercedes accidental test pilots Mark Webber and Peter Dumbreck are both extremely happy they did their test flights in closed cars.
Open cockpits are now at complete odds with modern thinking on safety....whatever rose coloured spectacles we wear.

 

[Mactech]

Just thinking about the commentary of the FIA on the Bianchi incident, I wonder how much of that was driven by their legal department and how much by the safety engineers?
With 20:20 hindsight there will always be those who say that the FIA should have introduced it sooner if could be proven to be a benefit, despite the fact that the research and testing had not been completed at that time. Litigation culture?

 

[bob6600]

The Halo is more of a stop-gap. The Aero screen (which was developed by Red Bull I think) was preferred but was not ready in time and did not pass the required tests. I would imagine the Halo will remain until 2020 and then there will be a screen

 

[GeeJayW]

Just thinking about the commentary of the FIA on the Bianchi incident, I wonder how much of that was driven by their legal department and how much by the safety engineers?
With 20:20 hindsight there will always be those who say that the FIA should have introduced it sooner if could be proven to be a benefit, despite the fact that the research and testing had not been completed at that time. Litigation culture?

It could be a result of robust risk assessment, but I can't help thinking that the whole halo thing is driven by a litigation culture, especially now that F1 is owned by a US based company.

 

[Deleted member 113659]

Let’s not forget many of the drivers were in favour of the Halo too.

 

[GeeJayW]

Let’s not forget many of the drivers were in favour of the Halo too.

None of the drivers are in favour of being hit in the head by a wheel or other stray object. It is hard to argue against a safety device, but where does one draw the line? The cars would be a lot safer if they were limited to 70 mph or had fully enclosed wheels etc..

 

[brucemillar]

And we should not forget Maria De Villota.


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[homersimpson]

And those two sentences accurately describe (another reason) why F1 is boring to watch: much of the decisive "action" takes place behind the scenes, where the audience can't see it. Add in aero rules that put so much emphasis on the front wing that it makes following closely and maintaining pace pretty much impossible, and braking performance that shortens the braking zone to such an extent that it's largely a matter of luck if an attempt to overtake under braking comes off, and F1 really has driven itself up a cul-de-sac when it comes to spectator interest.

There's no doubt that F1 cars are spectacularly fast, but it's like watching a 'plane flying at Mach 2 at 60,000ft: the scenery is more interesting.

Its a shame, but I have to agree... As a spectacle F1 isn't very exciting. The best bit is always the start when all the drivers are going for turn one, after that it becomes a bit mundane... I understand the tech and skill to drive at 200mph while cornering but its just not exciting to watch on TV..

To see mega exciting F1 watch youtube videos from the 80's, Senna, Prost, Mansell to name but a few...

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The young people who perhaps watch F1 now won't remember those days...

For me motor sport is only interesting if you're actually at the track rather than watching on the box...

 

[st13phil]

To see mega exciting F1 watch youtube videos from the 80's, Senna, Prost, Mansell to name but a few...

Thanks for that.

I think people tend to forget quote how physically demanding F1 was from a steering effort point of view in those days. While current F1 drivers have to endure much higher G-loads, the work their arms and right hand have to do now is tiny by comparison.

 

[Darrell]

the work their arms and right hand have to do now is tiny by comparison.

Lewis shouldn’t have given Nicole the elbow then should he!

 

[st13phil]

Lewis shouldn’t have given Nicole the elbow then should he!

I was waiting for that sort of response


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[Darrell]

Sorry.

I was waiting for that sort of response


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I couldn’t let it go.

 

[st13phil]

He could

 

[wu56Shoozz]

Why these are worrying times for British F1 fans - F1 - Autosport Plus

 

[190]

I've had to get used to watching MotoGP highlights so I'll have no problem watching F1 the same way. Unless they do something about the aero package and overtaking we won't be missing much anyway.

 

[wu56Shoozz]

I'll miss Coulthard & Webber Etc.. just not that dawber S Jones, I won't pay for it though considering BBC had it all these years for free...